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Climate Change:'We are past the point of no return'
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Hollywoodaction



Joined: 02 Jul 2004

PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2006 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

joe_doufu wrote:
FWIW, I oppose the use of fossil fuels because of the limited supply. It's like capital and interest. The fossil fuels are our global capital, and can never be replenished. We shouldn't burn them unless the profit is being used to get us to that next level, where fossil fuel energy sources are obsolete. So I do oppose the burning of fossil fuels... but not because I'm struck impotent by the overwhelming fear of carbon dioxide.


Fossil fuels can be easily replaced as a source of energy. What worries me is that once they are gone we won't be able to cheaply produce many products, such as plastics.
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rapier



Joined: 16 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Thu Jan 26, 2006 8:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting points coming across here.

*-on a side note, do you think it will be the Danes exclusively that get to populate and colonise the massive thawing landmass that is Greenland?
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igotthisguitar



Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)

PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

2005 Was Warmest Year On Record: NASA
By Deborah Zabarenko
Tue Jan 24, 4:03 PM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - Last year was the warmest recorded on Earth's surface, and it was unusually hot in the Arctic, U.S. space agency NASA said on Tuesday.




All five of the hottest years since modern record-keeping began in the 1890s occurred within the last decade, according to analysis by NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies.

In descending order, the years with the highest global average annual temperatures were 2005, 1998, 2002, 2003 and 2004, NASA said in a statement.

"It's fair to say that it probably is the warmest since we have modern meteorological records," said Drew Shindell of the NASA institute in New York City.

"Using indirect measurements that go back farther, I think it's even fair to say that it's the warmest in the last several thousand years."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060124/sc_nm/environment_warming_dc_1
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rapier



Joined: 16 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

-and 2006 will be warmer again.
-Only to be beaten by 2007....
The earth is dying folks, we have entered a dangerous phase of great changes that have already begun to impact.


2006 off to a flying start!! lets just look at Todays news alone..
Global warming raising sea levels
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060127/ap_on_sc/rising_seas_2;_ylt=Ak93usq3ezGLzcJT3Gj0uBZrAlMA;_ylu=X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl

Nuclear power cannot tackle climate change
http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/story/0,3605,1688034,00.html

1500 yr old coral reefs damaged by increase in hurricanes and rise in sea temperature
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060127/ap_on_re_us/gulf_coral_woes;_ylt=AvF.nKhmxSW.RbnterT.5ioPLBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

Freak extremely cold winter continues to freeze Europe
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20060127/wl_nm/weather_europe_dc;_ylt=AgrGD77_NOyH_PZNqxEOQeoPLBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

China's skies darkened significantly by pollution over the past 50 years
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060127/ap_on_re_as/china_haze;_ylt=AmqQMBlLcUBqVkmfKtX0tm4PLBIF;_ylu=X3oDMTA5aHJvMDdwBHNlYwN5bmNhdA--

And theres about 20 more on the main yahoo site alone, just for today, that relate to the extreme problems now hitting us due to climate change and environmental degradation/exhaustion. The signs are everywhere, constant and unrelenting now, for anyone who has eyes or can read.
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khyber



Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Compunction Junction

PostPosted: Fri Jan 27, 2006 10:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Most methane in the atmosphere is produced by bacteria in the soil.
I trust you but could you give a link?

The way i see it is that it's detrivores (bacteria that break down leaves, and other stuff) who produce those bacteria.

What puzzles me with your "most of the methane" statement is that, as I noted, methane has tripled over the last 150 years. Does that mean that there are CONSIDERABLY more bacteria in the soil?

And the idea that plants producing methane (up to 30% of what's in the atmosphere) seem completely impossible to me consider the DECREASE of rainforest and INCREASE in methane found.

One thing is that these numbers are based on ESTIMATES. They will take a soil sample in a rain forest (a TINY sample...like a few centimeters; measure the methane output and then Use THAT data as a random (and therefore representative) sample of an ENTIRE forest.
To me, that seems like a completely unreliable method to judge WORLDWIDE how much methane comes from plants.

Compare that to industry where outputs must be measured by each plant and we are then able to get a MUCH MORE precise idea of how much methane is being released.

Quote:
What worries me is that once they are gone we won't be able to cheaply produce many products, such as plastics.
not to play the hippie card, but THAT is why power of hemp NEEDS to be utilized (yes it is possible to make a kind of plastic out of hemp [i BELIEVE])

Quote:
-and 2006 will be warmer again.
-Only to be beaten by 2007....
The earth is dying folks, we have entered a dangerous phase of great changes that have already begun to impact.
I wouldn't make claims like that. It'll get thrown back into your face.
And if you look at your "top 5" list..you'll note that it goes from 2005 to 1998
But, would you like to make an avatar wager?
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rapier



Joined: 16 Feb 2003

PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2006 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

khyber wrote:
I wouldn't make claims like that. It'll get thrown back into your face.

But, would you like to make an avatar wager?


I'm just noticing a general trend..most years now are warmer than the last.

"1998 globally the warmest year on record"
http://www.ec.gc.ca/press/1998_m_e.htm

"1999 second warmest year on record"
http://www.publicaffairs.noaa.gov/releases99/dec99/noaa99083.html

2000 warmest year in U.S
http://archives.cnn.com/2000/WEATHER/07/14/heat.drought.01/

2001 the second warmest year globally since records began
http://www.cru.uea.ac.uk/cru/press/2001-12-second-warmest/

2002 replaces 2001 as second warmest on record
http://www.niwascience.co.nz/pubs/mr/archive/2003-02-07

2003 surpasses previous year as second warmest on record
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2003/ann/ann03.html

2004 fourth warmest year on record
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6720088/

2005 was the warmest year on record
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/11009001/


The 10 warmest years since records began have been since 1990.



Ahem...avatar wager? Shocked Laughing
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igotthisguitar



Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)

PostPosted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 1:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arctic shipping coming soon, U.S. expert says
Thu Jun 15, 03:50 PM EST

U.S. shipping companies are showing such a keen interest in global warming that a White House adviser says Canada should develop a policy with the U.S. on shipping through the Northwest Passage.

Commercial companies are itching to use the Northwest Passage as a preferred route between the Eastern Seaboard of the United States and Asia, George Newton, chairman of the U.S. Arctic Research Commission, told a conference on Arctic waters on Thursday.

The route would save two weeks in travelling time, an incentive for shipping companies, which have invested $4.5 billion in tankers capable of going through ice. As well, the Polar Research Board in Washington is expected to recommend that the U.S. government buy more icebreakers.

But Newton warned in Ottawa that a lot more work needs to be done before Arctic shipping becomes commonplace.

Canada and the United States need to study the Arctic waters, to demystify them and work out how to safely navigate the treacherous waters. Canada needs an extensive infrastructure to support shipping, and consult with aboriginals and other stakeholders.

"We need search and rescue that fall on those ports," Newton said. "We need voyage repairs, we need the ability to manage traffic in an effective fashion and we need ice breakers."

And Canada's northern people need to be consulted, said John Amagoalik, known as the Father of Nunavut.

"We have to make sure that whatever happens is manageable," Amagoalik said. "We can't allow just anybody to do whatever they want up there. There has to be some sort of management regime."

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/cbc/s/15062006/3/north-arctic-shipping-coming-soon-u-s-expert-says.html
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