Korean Job Discussion Forums

[mooncalf]

Here's my question:

Are the blacklists you see online really that reliable? Sure there are bad schools in Korea, but perhaps many schools get bad reviews because there are other elements at play. For example:

1) The internet may be biased in general towards bitchin-and-moanin . . . after all, when was the last time you saw a really positive endorsement of a school? With detailed management / contact info?

2) Many students may be unprepared for Korean office cultural, or even Korean culture in general . . . could many of the negative comments be the result of cultural misunderstandings?

3) There are many excelent posts on this forum about how to select a good contract. Even so, many newbies may not spend the time and energy to reach an agreement with their future employer about what is really expected . . . is it possible that the teacher and the school are reading the same contract, but understanding it differently?

Tell me I'm way off base . . . or add another element to the picture . . .

Thanks!

[Grotto]

Take anything you read about a school with a grain of salt. If there are multiple posts about the same school by different people then chances are its more accurate.

Remember also that many people dont post their experiences, good or bad!

[mindmetoo]

There are bad schools. There are bad teachers. Being fired for being a loser with a difficult personality, who screams at everyone and can't respect his boss/coworkers, doesn't make a school a bad school.

[UncleAlex]

I think you can judge for yourself whether blacklisting schools is reliable
by reading the grievances that have been stated. In most cases it is more
than a cultural misunderstanding: exploitation, neglect, and downright cheating.

[some waygug-in]

There are 2 (and sometimes 3) sides to every story. The problem with blacklist sites is that you usually only get to see one side.
But that doesn't mean they are not useful.

There are some schools/employers in Korea that definately deserve to be on every blacklist in sight.

Sure some people have no clue and come off sounding like whining newbies, but you have to ask yourself , "who hired them?" If some of these places actually valued experience over "a pretty face" then they probably would have a lot less trouble with "bad teachers". They bring people over who have no clue, try to rip them off at every turn and then wonder why their name gets posted on a blacklist site.

[flint]

[Homer]

[BigBlackEquus]

You get some chains like Wonderland, SLP (Sogang Language Program), and Ewha (now called, "W") the hagwon, and a certain university in Pusan which have floods of angry former teachers. Those are the ones that you can really spot, if you search the blacklists and ask around.

I was at a former school, however, that treated me pretty good, as well as my co-worker, but she had it out with the owner over something minor, and let it blow out of proportion. She and the school parted on bad terms, and she would have blacklisted them, no doubt, had she known of one.

Two entirely different experiences from the same boss.

[TJ]

A hagwan can change overnight so a blacklisting may only be valid if it is recent.

For example, the first year I worked at a hagwan the director was a money hungry woman (female dog) who refused to pay me money I was legally entitled to. She deserved to be blacklisted, but I didn't blacklist her.

However, she sold out and the new owners were the exact opposite. They were really nice, honourable, people. My second year at that hagwan was great. If the business had been black listed the new owners would have suffered - and that would have been wrong.

Investigate blacklistings, don't take them at face value.

[vox]

You know, not a lot has been said about green lists and in light of some of the comments on this thread, it needs to be said that Green lists are also worth looking at. I came to Korea in 2004 (justifiably) paranoid that everybody was going to try to screw me somehow but I wound up with a great staff at a hagwon and I endorsed the school after I left. The comment about spotting trends with certain schools is a good one, but you should also check green lists.

Being a loser teacher with one bad post should not get a school's rep run into the ground but being a loser Korean passive-aggressive thief, while a morally worthy target to be s**t upon, should not cast a shadow on those Korean directors who really try to bridge those communication gaps every day. One of the best ways to find them is on a green list.

This would also be a good time to remind lurkers that not nearly enough people report their good school experiences.

I can't believe I'm writing this having just got shafted by HUFS. Oh well, being human is partly about learning to dance with your contradictions. That's what the minister keeps saying anyway.

[angelgirl]

HUFS keeps popping up. One has to wonder why?

[vox]