Korean Job Discussion Forums

[sundubuman]

"BUY DANISH" ASK MY DANISH FRIENDS/ UPDATE

John Zimmerman is right. The Muslim countries have chosen to pressure liberal little Denmark in order to teach the media and governments, which stand by them, a lesson which does not bode well for free speech or satire. Kuwait has joined the Saudi boycott (the Saudi market alone is worth 1.2 billion) and I suspect the rest will follow. So, here is a plea from my Danish friends:

"If you Americans look with this great sympathy on our case, couldn't you then raise a consumer support of DK in the US? The opposite of a boycott. A movement of: "Buy Danish!" Please?

You can easily eat and digest all our famous Danish cheese at your millions of breakfast-tables from Seattle to Atlanta. Then the boycott (which is escalating fast down there now) will be harmless.

Well, we can and should. In fact the idea immediately occurred to the readers of Charles of LGF who was kind enough to post the news about the Saudi boycott on his popular site. They recommended you buy not only the always delicious Danish butter cookies but also:

Danish Havarti cheese

Carlsberg and Tuborg Beers.

Arla owns White Clover Dairy, a Wisconsin company so buy that brand. It comes under White Clover and Holland Farm.

Danish Crown hams ( DAK (sold at Sam clubs)... baby back ribs, because they come from Denmark.

You shop online at The Danish Foodshop and Danish Deli Foods.

You can also buy gorgious Danish porcelain and LEGO for the kids.

UPDATE: First, the speed with which this movement took flight is amazing and encouraging. Thanks, guys, for helping spread in on your blogs. The boycott is gathering steam. Our old friend Libya also withdrew its ambassador. But the Danes are standing firm and the EU (for the moment) is standing by them:

EU trade chief Peter Mandelson met a Saudi minister at a meeting in the Swiss mountain resort of Davos on Sunday and "urged the minister to convey the seriousness of this issue to his government," his spokesman said.

"Any boycott of Danish goods would be seen as a boycott of European goods," said spokesman Peter Power.

An opinion poll showed that 79 percent of Danes think Fogh Rasmussen should not issue an apology and 62 percent say the newspaper should not apologize.

[Bulsajo]

Wouldn't boycotting Middle East oil be more effective than buying Danish products?

Jumpin in the Ford Excursion to pick up some Havarti...

[canuckistan]

I'm not spending too much time boo-hooing over offended Muslim sensibilities with this.
They should be getting upset about the ugliness being taught in too many madrassas, which does nothing to foster a tolerant view of "other-than-Muslim" people in the world.

[cheeba]

It's looking like a Carlsberg and Havarti weekend. Of all the countries to pick on. . . Denmark. Personally I think the cartoons were a little over the top but the letters section is the best way to deal with offended sensibilities. Pulling your ambassador, sorry if you don't like free speech, go to somewhere where it doesn't exist like Libya, Syria, Saudi Arabia . . . We have to put up with mullahs saying we're infidel dogs, yet I don't see us pulling ambassadors. Hypocrites.

[sundubuman]

In one sense, the Muslim reaction is logical. In virtually every Islamic country, the government exercises ultimate control over the media.

So when they demand the Danish government to control its press, they are projecting their worldview on free societies.

Steff hot dogs would be the best way to support Danish companies in Seoul.

I never tried them before this week. As long as this idiotic boycott lasts, Ill have them, and probably after, as they aren't that bad. Not quite a kosher chicago dog with hot peppers and celery salt, but not bad either.

[khyber]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/cpress/20060202/ca_pr_on_na/cda_prophet_drawings
whaddya think of this summation of the situation?
There are a lot of salient points in this article but i think this:

[VanIslander]

mmmmm.... danish

[Summer Wine]

I have to agree that the muslims seem to be getting a bit too uptight on the matter. This was a nice quote, others made worse comments I felt.

[yoda]

From CNN:

[dogbert]

[Leslie Cheswyck]

http://www.faithfreedom.org/oped/kw60203.htm

Danish Cartoons, Double Standards and False Rhetoric of Islam and its Public Defenders

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

by K.W.

2006/02/03

The BBC, CBC, and NPR permit furious Muslim spokespeople and the Western Left to make apologies for Muslim boycotts and riots in reaction to Danish political cartoons; thus framing the dialectic as one between provocateur and provoked. There are two fallacies here- one of false dualism, and one of double standard. Danish and French use of speech is held to a higher standard of responsibility than what Saudi Arabia and Egypt permit Imams to teach every day in their countries- anti-Jewish hate for example. This unwillingness to address speech with speech extends beyond boycotts and riots of course- as the managing editor of France Soir, Jacques Lefranc discovered when he was fired for his decision to reprint the cartoons by the paper's Egyptian owner, Raymond Lakah- a man whose income derives from the French freedom of speech! When the exercise of a core Western value, free speech, is met with hostility by Islam or in the name of Islam; even American liberals such as myself must conclude that there is some merit to the claim that we are experiencing a clash of civilizations- each with mutually exclusive goals.

Muslims use Western standards of behavior against Westerners while also holding Westerners to Islamic standards of behavior; while at the same time never accepting Western standards of behavior. When Saudi Arabia is criticized for the lies and hate taught in its schools against Jews they demand we not hold them to our standards. When a Danish cartoonist mocks Muhammad, we are of course held to their standard. They do not dismiss the mockery of unbelievers- instead; many feel antagonized and make for the street. If they are condemned by Imams, one would need to read closely and often to detect it in the Western press. Even European Muslims felt antagonized and many have participated in the boycott against Danish goods. This is not the loyal dissent of loyal citizens; it's the use of coercion in an attempt to silence those who seek to publicly criticize Islam, as is permitted by freedom of speech. However, the validity of the speech itself is irrelevant- if Islam and its agents are permitted to impose their values upon Western nations, where and when will it end? This gives credence to the interpretation that Islam's goals are unlimited and that Islamic apologists are practicing al-taqqiya; the lying to non-Muslims. Should Jews and Christians boycott the Arab world until false depictions of Jews and Christians cease? Such a proposition is absurd, yet this is the standard the Islamic world and its spokespeople hold to the West. Those Muslim spokespeople who are forever demanding apologies from the West, tacitly support Islamic terror and aggression by failing to condemn and apologize for their co-religionists with similar rhetoric and volume. Muslim outrage against European cartoonists and the way that it is expressed, is nothing less than a denial of Danish sovereignty.

Affiliation to one's nation comes above any other affiliation; the rights of Muslims are protected in Western Republics because all citizens acknowledge the supremacy of the nation-state which in turn gives rights back to its citizens- including the freedom of religion. It's basic Rousseau: we give rights to get back more rights than we surrendered. When Muslim citizens of Western nations deny Western values on religious grounds they are denying the social contract that defends their freedom of religion. By depicting the debate as one between provocateur and provoked, the BBC, CBC, and NPR validate Muslim values while at the same time denying Western values: a perverse distortion of the debate. Freedom of religion- at least in the USA , UK , and Canada- ends where it encroaches upon another's rights. By failing to identify the full context of the debate- as one between Islamic and Western values- the motives of the offended are treated as having greater sincerity than the motives of a perhaps misanthropic cartoonist and his publishers- who are depicted as bigots. Never once does an interviewer ask a Muslim apologist "Who are Muslims to dictate terms to Western nations? Who are immigrants to Western nations to tell their hosts to change values in deference to Islam?" If Europe was alarmed when Russian gas supplies got cut off recently due to post-Soviet conflicts with Ukraine , then why doesn't Europe respond in a similarly proportionate manner when Islamic nations threaten to cut off oil supplies? Because the Russian act defied our values, while the Muslim approach of unofficial incitement gives Muslim governments plausible deniability of responsibility for their citizens actions.

So long as Islamic values are permitted to encroach upon Western values, without a concomitant and proportionate encroachment going the other way; a clash of civilizations seems inevitable. To deny Western values is to cut oneself off from appealing to those values. Those in the West, who continue to treat Islam as they would Buddhism, Judaism, or any other religious minority, extend rights to a party that refuses reciprocity. Those who demand from the West that which they are unwilling to reciprocate, seek to forcibly revise our values. In short they seek our submission- or in Arabic: Islam.



-K.W.

[keithinkorea]

It's a shame that it is so hard to find good Danish Bacon in Korea. The Danes produce the best pigs in the world. Yum yum.

I think the Danes should reciprocate by send their yummy bacon to every Islamic nations government and every Embassy of an Islamic country engaging in the boycott. If they want to stop none Muslim countries being free then screw them. The Danes are too nice to do that, damn them!

My favourite cartoon that some of the nutcases are freaking out about is the one where Mohammed is telling the suicicide bombers to stop as they've ran out of virgins in paradise. That is funny, a little sick yes, but damn funny Freedom of speech is exactly that, and many of our grandfather died for that freedom.

I have as much respect for decent Muslim as I have for any other group of people, and I've met some damn nice Muslim people in the past. Don't let the stupidity, bigotry and stupidity of a few of them make you automatically distrustful of all of them. I've not met many Danes but some of their women and also their bacon are great, LEGO is a pretty cool invention too.

Not all Muslims are nutters, it's the same as Christians. Some of them are quite nice. Nutters whether christian, north Korean spy-unless you can catch them and get the nice big reward-, jew, satanist or English teacher should be avoided, common sense really.

I believe in freedom for everyone as long as it doesn't infringe on other humans or is grotesquely cruel to animals or extremely damaging to the environment. I guess I'm your typical liberal-libertarian-anarchist with a healthy social conscience (perhaps that I did so well on the 'are you nuts?' test posted the other week

Anyway I think we should all do our bit to support freedom of speech as long as it doesn't cross our 'collective' ethical boundaries.

[The Lemon]

The "Death to Cartoonists" crowd have helpfully assembled a shopping guide for your "Buy Danish!" efforts:

[bigverne]

[Gorgias]

Just posting to add my support. Nothing new to add.

It is a little sad that the Europeans just make sport of the tankless, money-less, friend-less Muslims. Literally: "Hmm... No good football on the telly, let's mess up an Arab country." But I do admire their philosophy: "We are very sorry for any offense this has caused to the Muslim community-- but, we're still gonna publish whatever cartoons we like, so, err... go to hell."