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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003
Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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 Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 7:59 pm Post subject: |
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| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| Quote: |
| cement him as the greatest British novelist ever, and I will only accept arguments of Joyce to the contrary if you can explain "Finnegan's Wake" to me. |
Well, no point in arguing because Joyce was Irish, not British, so D!ckens is safe!!! |
http://www.macs.hw.ac.uk/britishisles/
And, as we all learned in geography in third grade, Ireland is one of the British Isles, hence, James Joyce is a British novelist and his works are taught in many British literature courses.
For example; here is a list of the top forty British novelists of all time. Joyce is under "J."
http://meridianmagazine.com/classicscorner/010108british.html |
The "British Isles" is a now outdated geographical term. Coined before Southern Ireland gained it's freedom in 1921. Try calling Joyce (if he were alive) and the other 4 million Irish people living in the Republic of Ireland 'British' and see what they say. The term now used to encompass that geographical region is Great Britain and Ireland.
Your third grade geography teacher needs his/her text books upgraded. |
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Thunndarr
Joined: 30 Sep 2003
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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| billybrobby wrote: |
| does any body know how to get around the motherfucking swear filter? |
Charles Dickens.
Edit: On topic, I'm currently reading Bleak House. It's taken a while to get moving, but I'm really enjoying the characters, if not so much the plot, which hasn't really gotten moving yet. |
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shortskirt_longjacket
Joined: 06 Jun 2004
Location: fitz and ernie are my raison d'etre
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 9:24 pm Post subject: |
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| eamo wrote: |
| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| Quote: |
| cement him as the greatest British novelist ever, and I will only accept arguments of Joyce to the contrary if you can explain "Finnegan's Wake" to me. |
Well, no point in arguing because Joyce was Irish, not British, so D!ckens is safe!!! |
http://www.macs.hw.ac.uk/britishisles/
And, as we all learned in geography in third grade, Ireland is one of the British Isles, hence, James Joyce is a British novelist and his works are taught in many British literature courses.
For example; here is a list of the top forty British novelists of all time. Joyce is under "J."
http://meridianmagazine.com/classicscorner/010108british.html |
The "British Isles" is a now outdated geographical term. Coined before Southern Ireland gained it's freedom in 1921. Try calling Joyce (if he were alive) and the other 4 million Irish people living in the Republic of Ireland 'British' and see what they say. The term now used to encompass that geographical region is Great Britain and Ireland.
Your third grade geography teacher needs his/her text books upgraded. |
Look, I'm not saying Joyce *should* be considered a British author. I am saying that in American Universities he is taught in British Literature courses. I know because I took two, and his books were in both of them. If you want the number of the school you can get all harsh with them. PM me. Personally I have never been to England *or* Ireland so I don't really give a rip. |
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Swiss James
Joined: 26 Nov 2003
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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you just spotted the real name of that rugby team didn't you?
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shortskirt_longjacket
Joined: 06 Jun 2004
Location: fitz and ernie are my raison d'etre
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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| Swiss James wrote: |
you just spotted the real name of that rugby team didn't you?
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I knew I was gonna say "British Lions" and he was gonna say "British and Irish Lions" and I was gonna say "Yeah, but nobody really calls them that" and he was gonna say "They do in Ireland" etc., etc. ad infinitum
I think he's talking geography and politics and I'm talking Lit, and I don't know anything about the geography and politics so it's not a fight I care to have.
I'm trying to take the high road. Y'all can call all that stuff whatever you want. Best of luck. |
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Satori
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: Above it all
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| Quote: |
| cement him as the greatest British novelist ever, and I will only accept arguments of Joyce to the contrary if you can explain "Finnegan's Wake" to me. |
Well, no point in arguing because Joyce was Irish, not British, so D!ckens is safe!!! |
http://www.macs.hw.ac.uk/britishisles/
And, as we all learned in geography in third grade, Ireland is one of the British Isles, hence, James Joyce is a British novelist and his works are taught in many British literature courses.
For example; here is a list of the top forty British novelists of all time. Joyce is under "J."
http://meridianmagazine.com/classicscorner/010108british.html |
The "British Isles" is a now outdated geographical term. Coined before Southern Ireland gained it's freedom in 1921. Try calling Joyce (if he were alive) and the other 4 million Irish people living in the Republic of Ireland 'British' and see what they say. The term now used to encompass that geographical region is Great Britain and Ireland.
Your third grade geography teacher needs his/her text books upgraded. |
Look, I'm not saying Joyce *should* be considered a British author. I am saying that in American Universities he is taught in British Literature courses. I know because I took two, and his books were in both of them. If you want the number of the school you can get all harsh with them. PM me. Personally I have never been to England *or* Ireland so I don't really give a rip. |
You sure you really have a course called "Brittish Literature" in american uni's? At my uni it was called "English Literature". |
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shortskirt_longjacket
Joined: 06 Jun 2004
Location: fitz and ernie are my raison d'etre
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| Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2006 11:21 pm Post subject: |
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| Satori wrote: |
| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| shortskirt_longjacket wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| Quote: |
| cement him as the greatest British novelist ever, and I will only accept arguments of Joyce to the contrary if you can explain "Finnegan's Wake" to me. |
Well, no point in arguing because Joyce was Irish, not British, so D!ckens is safe!!! |
http://www.macs.hw.ac.uk/britishisles/
And, as we all learned in geography in third grade, Ireland is one of the British Isles, hence, James Joyce is a British novelist and his works are taught in many British literature courses.
For example; here is a list of the top forty British novelists of all time. Joyce is under "J."
http://meridianmagazine.com/classicscorner/010108british.html |
The "British Isles" is a now outdated geographical term. Coined before Southern Ireland gained it's freedom in 1921. Try calling Joyce (if he were alive) and the other 4 million Irish people living in the Republic of Ireland 'British' and see what they say. The term now used to encompass that geographical region is Great Britain and Ireland.
Your third grade geography teacher needs his/her text books upgraded. |
Look, I'm not saying Joyce *should* be considered a British author. I am saying that in American Universities he is taught in British Literature courses. I know because I took two, and his books were in both of them. If you want the number of the school you can get all harsh with them. PM me. Personally I have never been to England *or* Ireland so I don't really give a rip. |
You sure you really have a course called "Brittish Literature" in american uni's? At my uni it was called "English Literature". |
http://www.sandiego.edu/bulletin/as/English.html
| Quote: |
300 [100] British Literature to 1800 (3)
A survey of representative texts from the earliest literature in English to 1800. Consideration will be given to the cultural and historical contexts in which the works were written. (Every semester) |
| Quote: |
368 [169] British Modern Fiction (3)
Major works in relation to issues in twentieth-century British literature and culture. May include novels or short stories by Conrad, Lawrence, Joyce, Forster, Woolf, Lessing, and others. |
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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003
Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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Well, Shortskirt. If your college or whatever included Joyce in their British literature course I wouldn't blame you for thinking of Joyce as a British author. Not a huge mistake on your part. More an inaccuracy on the part on your Uni.
There is quite a canon of Irish literature so it doesn't need to be 'added-on' to British Literature because of it's small stature.
Just think though. If I did a course at Uni called, "North-American Literature", then came on a board like this and called Steinbeck a Canadian. The Americans would be jumping all over me to clear that one up!! |
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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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| Posted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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I must agree with one poster that "The Pickwick Papers" is very droll and enjoyable. If you are a fan of Dostoevsky's writings, you may find the following snippet from the New York Review of Books interesting. I love "The Idiot," more than any other book and I really enjoyed "The Pickwick Papers," too.
DOSTOEVSKY & 'DON QUIXOTE'
By Lev Loseff, Reply by Simon Leys
In response to The Imitation of Our Lord Don Quixote (June 11, 1998)
To the Editors:
Fairness requires a reminder that the paradox implied in the title of Simon Leys's erudite and moving essay, "The Imitation of Our Lord Don Quixote" [NYR, June 11], originally belongs to Dostoevsky, who on January 13, 1868, in a letter from Geneva confided to his favorite young niece, Sophia Ivanova, how immensely difficult it was to realize his idea for a new novel. He wrote:
The main idea of the novel is to present a positively beautiful man. This is the most difficult subject in the world, especially as it is now. All writers, not just our, but European writers, too, have always failed whenever they attempted a portrait of the positively beautiful. Because the task is so infinite. The beautiful is an ideal, but both our ideal and that of civilized Europe are still far from being shaped. There is only one positively beautiful person in the world, Christ, and the phenomenon of this limitlessly, infinitely beautiful person is an infinite miracle in itself. (The whole Gospel according to John is about that: for him the whole miracle is only in the incarnation, in the manifestation of the beautiful.) But I am going too far. I'd only mention that of all the beautiful individuals in Christian literature, one stands out as the most perfect, Don Quixote. But he is beautiful only because he is ridiculous. Dickens' Mr. Pickwick (who is, as a creative idea, infinitely weaker than Don Quixote but still gigantic) is also ridiculous but that is all he has to captivate us. Wherever compassion toward ridiculed and ingenious beauty is presented, the reader's sympathy is aroused. The mystery of humor lies in this excitation of compassion.[*] |
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