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princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
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 Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 8:20 pm Post subject: WHAT'S UP WITH THIS? |
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| I just can't understand this. Even with 4 years of teaching experience in Korea I can't get a job offer that pays more than 2.1 a month and that's before taxes so that doesn't count. In the past 2 weeks, I have received 2 job offers, both of them paying 2.1 BEFORE taxes and health insurance which means I'd be receiving 1.9 something a month. My current school asked me to stay a 3rd year but of course, still no raise. In my 2nd year, I was still gettting 1.8 something after taxes. And they asked me to stay a 3rd year with still no raise. I just don't understand. Maybe it's because I don't have an education degree or TESOL certification. |
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Real Reality
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:14 pm Post subject: |
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Wages are going up for Koreans. Unfortunately, a foreigner's experience may not count as much as a Korean's experience.
Perhaps, Homer can give you an apologist's explanation.
Wages up in 2005
In a ministry's survey of 7,438 companies with more than five employees, their average wage hike rate amounted to 6.8 percent in the January-October period, up 1.4 points from 5.4 percent in the same period of 2004, ministry officials said.
JoongAng Daily (January 09, 2006)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200601/08/200601082333239339900090509051.html
Incomes rising as dollar falls
"Considering the weaker dollar, per-capita GNI will reach $19,600 next year if the dollar remains around 1,000 won. And if the dollar declines below 970 won, per-capita GNI will hit $20,763."
by Kim Dong-ho, JoongAng Daily
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200601/10/200601102312588779900090509052.html
Korea's GNI increased by 16% in 2005
Korea's per-capita gross national income climbed 16 percent last year from a year earlier, thanks to the sharp appreciation of the Korean won against the U.S. dollar.
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200602/05/200602052240373809900090509052.html |
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pest1
Joined: 09 Feb 2006
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:21 pm Post subject: Re: WHAT'S UP WITH THIS? |
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| princess wrote: |
| I just can't understand this. Even with 4 years of teaching experience in Korea I can't get a job offer that pays more than 2.1 a month and that's before taxes so that doesn't count. In the past 2 weeks, I have received 2 job offers, both of them paying 2.1 BEFORE taxes and health insurance which means I'd be receiving 1.9 something a month. My current school asked me to stay a 3rd year but of course, still no raise. In my 2nd year, I was still gettting 1.8 something after taxes. And they asked me to stay a 3rd year with still no raise. I just don't understand. Maybe it's because I don't have an education degree or TESOL certification. |
That is definitely bizzare. I know many people who make 2.3+ even in their first year. Are you in a small town or something? Because there are definitely jobs in Seoul that pay that much and dont require any TESOL degrees. If you have already worked for the same school for 3 years, try ask them to let you into management positions. You should have the experience and expertise by now. |
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dbee
Joined: 29 Dec 2004
Location: korea
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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Maybe it's because I don't have an education degree or TESOL certification.
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... or maybe it's because Koreans consider you as a babysitter.
IMO expecting to get paid more as you gain experience is only reasonable if you work in a career-orientated job. ESL is not a career, it's casual labor. The older and more 'experienced' you get, the less marketable you become.
Guys with all the qualifications and years and years of experience are working in the same pay-grade as newbies fresh off the plane. There is no ladder in ESL. Hence, it's not a career.
That's why I take a dim view of putting your hard-earned cash into CELTA courses and like. You won't get a return - at least in financial terms. |
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princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:41 pm Post subject: |
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| The school where I am currently teaching and have been teaching in for the past 2 years is in Uijeoung-freaking bu, so I guess maybe that has something to do with it. But my school asked me to stay a 3rd year wiht no better situation. Still 1.8 after taxes and 2 roommates. I taught my first 2 years down in Seoul and I just got offers from 2 schools in Seoul who are only willing to give me 2.1 BEFORE taxes, which is only like 1.9 something afterwards. Strange indeed. I signed a contract last night with one of them, but I figure I can still back out since I don't have a visa for them yet. |
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princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:46 pm Post subject: |
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| dbee wrote: |
| Quote: |
Maybe it's because I don't have an education degree or TESOL certification.
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... or maybe it's because Koreans consider you as a babysitter.
IMO expecting to get paid more as you gain experience is only reasonable if you work in a career-orientated job. ESL is not a career, it's casual labor. The older and more 'experienced' you get, the less marketable you become.
Guys with all the qualifications and years and years of experience are working in the same pay-grade as newbies fresh off the plane. There is no ladder in ESL. Hence, it's not a career.
That's why I take a dim view of putting your hard-earned cash into CELTA courses and like. You won't get a return - at least in financial terms. |
Back in 2001, I had a friend here who was in her 5th year at her school and was STILL getting 1.5. She should have just quit. |
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pest1
Joined: 09 Feb 2006
Location: Korea
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| Posted: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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| dbee wrote: |
... or maybe it's because Koreans consider you as a babysitter.
IMO expecting to get paid more as you gain experience is only reasonable if you work in a career-orientated job. ESL is not a career, it's casual labor. The older and more 'experienced' you get, the less marketable you become.
Guys with all the qualifications and years and years of experience are working in the same pay-grade as newbies fresh off the plane. There is no ladder in ESL. Hence, it's not a career.
That's why I take a dim view of putting your hard-earned cash into CELTA courses and like. You won't get a return - at least in financial terms. |
Which is why you need to try to get into management level. With a TESOL or equivalent degree, you are more likely to be eligible for positions such as DOS and Academic managers and so on, which surprisingly could pay a lot of money. Besides, if you don't want to be stuck in Asia forever, there are many teaching jobs in Europe that require a TESOL certificate. |
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Old fat expat
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Location: a caravan of dust, making for a windy prairie
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 12:19 am Post subject: |
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princess wrote:
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| I signed a contract last night with one of them, but I figure I can still back out since I don't have a visa for them yet |
Why is it OK for us Westerners to be expedient regarding contracts but when a director has a casual regard to the 'legal and binding' contract the wae-gok is on Dave's screaming bloody murder. Or are you going to tell me you've learnt this causal regard from being in Korea?
It's a contract and if you have signed it you have accepted the conditions. If you want to hold out for a better deal then have the ballz to be honest and not sign, or be good to your signed word. In the West we call it integrity. |
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bellum99
Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Location: don't need to know
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 12:49 am Post subject: |
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| Hmmm. I guess I agree with him. You shouldn't have signed if you weren't sure about it. |
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Hollywoodaction
Joined: 02 Jul 2004
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:35 am Post subject: |
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| I get the same pay raise as the Korean professors. My salary has increased by 25% in the last 5 or 6 years. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:43 am Post subject: |
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| 4 years experience? STOP applying for hagwon jobs. Look at public schools. Contact the district offices in Seoul and see if they are filling positions. Im sure many are. Look at private elementary, middle and highschools. |
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endofthewor1d
Joined: 01 Apr 2003
Location: the end of the wor1d.
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 1:56 am Post subject: |
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or you could go for a college or university job. i got into a college after three years in hakwons, without a masters or tesol or celta or anything. mind you, i applied to about 300 colleges and universities, and the one which hired me was one of two places which gave me any serious consideration. i'm not making any more money at that job, but i'm a lot less stressed, and i work a lot less hours, and have much longer vacations.
hakwons generally don't put much value on experience. in fact, i'm sure there are places which would value you even less because a person who has done any time in hakwons might better know what crap to take and what crap not to.
good luck. |
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princess
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: soul of Asia
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:15 am Post subject: |
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| bellum99 wrote: |
| Hmmm. I guess I agree with him. You shouldn't have signed if you weren't sure about it. |
It's funny though. After the director took me to dinner and I signed the contract, he gave me a long ride to the subway station. On the way, he asked me if I liked Koreans. I said yes,why? Then he asked me if any Koreans had ever disappointed me. I said yes. Then I said, you know, there are alot of bad schools out there. Then he said I know. I think you will be looking at other schools. Strange that he would say that, huh? So, he even EXPECTS I will look at other schools even after signing HIS contract. What does that say? Hmmm..... |
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Real Reality
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Last edited by Real Reality on Sat Feb 18, 2006 4:48 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Old fat expat
Joined: 19 Sep 2005
Location: a caravan of dust, making for a windy prairie
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| Posted: Sat Feb 18, 2006 3:49 am Post subject: |
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He may be used to Koreans being dishonest and expects it of you. He may have had previous teachers be dishonest and expects it of you. He may have sensed your hesitency and expects you to act on it, So far none of these reasons make HIM dishonest. Or he may be dishonest and expects it of everyone else. Any options I have left out?
Although I have some training in human behavior it is so difficult to second guess what someone is thinking or why they do or say certain things. Often even the person doing the saying doesn't even know.
Until you know him longer, or talk to someone who has known him longer, it is easy to pick 'the one' of the above reasons to justify backing out. Did you talk to any of the other/previous teachers? |
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