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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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 Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 3:42 pm Post subject: |
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| When do I remember hearing that before? Oh yes, it was last year. And the year before. |
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Wangja
Joined: 17 May 2004
Location: Seoul, Yongsan
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 4:16 pm Post subject: |
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| True, but it is the first time that the rationale has been to bring peace and stability. The same rationale used for the invasion ....... |
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supernick
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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I doubt very much that U.S. troops will ever leave and probably, UK troops will still be there in smaller numbers in many years from now.
The UK and the U.S. remembers only too clearly what happened when there was an enegy crunch 30 years ago. People were led to believe that oil was running out. Smaller sized vehicles became the rage, which really gave the Japanese a leg up on the Americans. Oil was never running out; the Saudis decided to reduce supply because of UK and U.S. support for Israel.
How many military bases are the Americans building in Iraq that will be permanent? 10 or 14?
What will happen when things become unstable in S.A.? Will this give the U.S. justification for invading?
The insurgent attacks suit the American plan very well. As long as the fighting continues, the more reasons can be found to justify the American military presence to the American people, while at the same time giving the Americans more time to develop their presence more permanently over the years. The Iraqi government will become much harsher with little regard for human rights while the U.S. gives a blind eye, (Only a few months ago we saw how the Iraqi authorities treated prisoners) as the war was never over the plight of the Iraqis in the first place. Did the U.S. really give a crap about Korean human rights or democracy? No, just as long as things continued that justified their presence, they Americans never really gave a damn.
Years ago, people would have been saying, "We've got to be in Korea to stop those commies from invading America". These days, Americans are saying that there has to be troops in Iraq to stop those terrorists from attacking America. Maybe they can justify their presence to say they are there to prevent civil war.
How do you think the U.S. and the UK will react if S.A. or other large oil supplying nations decides to cut off oil? Who do you think will control the valves of oil in Iraq? Sure, it's going to take a few years to get Iraq's oil production up and running but you can be sure that Iraq will never have control of its oil during our life time. With American troops stationed in Iraq, it sends a clear message to other oil producing countries, which says "You mess with the supply, and we��ll mess with you".
Yes, it all sounds so noble when America says that they are doing it for democracy and freedom (words that radiate in the minds of Americans) but really it��s more than that. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:13 pm Post subject: |
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| How many military bases are the Americans building in Iraq that will be permanent? 10 or 14? |
Why ought that bother you, especially if they are in the Kurdish areas were they are welcome?
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| Did the U.S. really give a crap about Korean human rights or democracy? No, just as long as things continued that justified their presence, they Americans never really gave a damn. |
When Carter want to withdraw US forces from Korea why do you think Korea got all upset?
Why did the US when Reagan was president save Kim Dae Jung?
At any rate it doesn't look like the US is leaving Iraq anytime soon.
Lethal ��flying gunships�� returning to Iraq
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11657894/ |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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Yes, and how do you spell "quagmire"?
Will they be dropping napalm? Or have they something new and special in mind?
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AP: AC-130 Gunships Returning to Iraq By CHARLES J. HANLEY, AP Special Correspondent
Fri Mar 3, 1:21 PM ET
AN AIR BASE IN IRAQ - The U.S. Air Force has begun moving heavily armed AC-130 airplanes — the lethal "flying gunships" of the Vietnam War — to a base in Iraq as commanders search for new tools to counter the Iraqi resistance, The Associated Press has learned.
An AP reporter saw the first of the turboprop-driven aircraft after it landed at the airfield this week. Four are expected.
The Iraq-based special forces command controlling the AC-130s, the Combined Joint Special Operations Task Force, said it would have no comment on the deployment. But the plan's general outline was confirmed by other Air Force officers, speaking anonymously because of the sensitivity of the subject |
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Hater Depot
Joined: 29 Mar 2005
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| It's an election year and the approval ratings of Bush and the Republicans are abysmal. The Democrats now actually have an edge over Republicans on national security, which is the first time that has been a true statement for probably over 50 years. A pullout is good news for a lot of people but I don't think anybody should see it as a strategic military decision reached after careful and thoughtful consideration of the situation in the Middle East. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 6:53 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="desultude"]Yes, and how do you spell "quagmire"?
Will they be dropping napalm? Or have they something new and special in mind?
this war started before 9-11 , the US just didn't know it. It wont be a quagmire if US forces are in bases in the Kurdish areas. |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:34 pm Post subject: |
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| desultude wrote: |
Yes, and how do you spell "quagmire"?
Will they be dropping napalm? Or have they something new and special in mind? |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
this war started before 9-11 , the US just didn't know it. It wont be a quagmire if US forces are in bases in the Kurdish areas. |
I do believe that it is officially a quagmire right now, as in, many people want to leave, many wish they could take back their decision to go in the first place, and yet we cannot possibly leave.
QUAGMIRE: A difficult or precarious situation; predicament.
Quag- marsh+mire
Yes, I would say we are mired in. But maybe it should be "desert-mire".
Last edited by desultude on Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="desultude"]
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| desultude wrote: |
Yes, and how do you spell "quagmire"?
Will they be dropping napalm? Or have they something new and special in mind?
this war started before 9-11 , the US just didn't know it. It wont be a quagmire if US forces are in bases in the Kurdish areas. |
I do believe that it is officially a quagmire right now, as in, many people want to leave, many wish they could take back their decision to go in the first place, and yet we cannot possibly leave.
QUAGMIRE: A difficult or precarious situation; predicament.
Quag- marsh+mire
Yes, I would say we are mired in. But maybe it should be "desert-mire". |
That's one of the funniest things Joo's said yet.
And in the news from Iraq today where it is no longer a quaqmire because US bases are in Kurdish areas:
03/05/06 ABC: Expert on Iraq: 'We're In a Civil War'
"We're in a civil war now; it's just that not everybody's joined in," said retired Army Maj. Gen. William L. Nash, a former military commander in Bosnia-Herzegovina. "The failure to understand that the civil war is already taking place...
03/05/06 UPI: Pace Plays Down Iraq Violence
Despite hundreds killed in secular attacks in Iraq this week, Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Gen. Peter Pace said he is optimistic for Iraq's future. "I don't think we're getting the goodness out to the American people the way we should," he said.
03/05/06 AP: Report - Iraqi Detainees Still Being Tortured
Amnesty International charges detainees in Iraq are still being tortured by their captors despite the negative attention generated by the Abu Ghraib prison abuse scandal.
03/05/06 AFP: Two Iraqi soldiers killed in Tikrit
Two Iraqi soldiers were also killed by gunmen who fired on their vehicle in Saddam Hussein's hometown of Tikrit on Sunday, while police said the bodies of three men, two of them Shiites, were discovered in Nabai...
03/05/06 AP: Four killed in scattered gunfire in Baghdad
At least four people _ a policeman, a taxi driver and two electricity workers _ were killed in scattered gunfire in Baghdad and south of the capital, police said.
03/05/06 AP: Two killed in shooting in west baghdad
two relatives of an influential Sunni leader were killed in a drive-by shooting in another part of west Baghdad. The Shiite-led Interior Ministry denied involvement in either attack.
03/05/06 thetimesonline: Policeman killed in Musayyib
South of the capital, a policeman was killed and his son injured in a drive-by shooting in the mainly Sunni town of Musayyib. Police found two more bullet-riddled bodies, with hand and legs bound, in Kazimiyah, a northern Shiite suburb of Baghdad.
03/05/06 sunherald: Wounded Corporal greets old friends
Cpl. Zach Schudrowitz...has spent the last several months in a burn unit in San Antonio. He was recovering from injuries received when his amphibious assault vehicle, or Amtrac, blew up last May, killing eight Marines...
03/05/06 AP/AFP: Attack on Iraq Mosque Kills at Least Three (update)
Iraqi police say gunmen have attacked a Sunni mosque in west Baghdad, killing at least three people and wounding at least six others. Police officials say the attackers stormed the al-Nour mosque in Baghdad's Jihad neighborhood...
03/05/06 RTE: US military denies reports over Iraq pullout
The US military in Iraq has said British newspaper reports that US and British troops would start leaving the country by the spring of next year were completely false.
03/05/06 Xinhua: Insurgent sniper shoots dead US soldier (not confirmed)
"A sniper shot dead a U.S. soldier in the Sorah intersection in central Dhuluiyah town while the U.S. troops were near an Iraqi army checkpoint at the site," a witness told Xinhua on condition of anonymity.
03/04/06 nationaldefensemagazine: Insurgency Tactics Test Helicopters' Staying Power
The Army has spent nearly $2 billion outfitting helicopters with high-tech sensors and flares that help foil shoulder-launched missiles, but none of these devices can prevent choppers from getting shot out of the sky by rocket-propelled grenades...
03/04/06 DoD Identifies Army Casualties
Spc. Christopher S. Merchant, 32, of Hardwick, Vt., died in Ar Ramadi, Iraq, on March 1, when his HMMWV came under attack by enemy forces using a vehicle-borne improvised explosive device and rocket-propelled grenade.
03/04/06 AFP: 2 killed as attackers open fire in mosque
Two people died and another three were injured after armed attackers opened fire in a Shia mosque in the northern Iraqi town of Kirkuk, AFP reported, citing Iraqi security forces.
03/04/06 Xinhuanet: Iraqi interior minister plans to dissolve militias
Iraqi Interior Minister Bayan JabrSolagh said Saturday that the Iraqi government is implementing a plan to dissolve militias. "I have sent a letter to all militias, ordering them to dissolve themselves," Solagh told reporters
03/04/06 LATimes: Military Will Keep Planting Articles In Iraq
The U.S. military plans to continue paying Iraqi newspapers to publish articles favorable to the United States after an inquiry found no fault with the controversial practice, the top U.S. general in Iraq said Friday.
03/04/06 Reuters: Six policemen were injured when a roadside bomb
Six policemen were injured when a roadside bomb exploded near their patrol in Baquba...police said. In a separate incident a girl was killed and eight other civilians injured when a roadside bomb exploded in Baquba, police said.
03/04/06 duluthsuperior: Purple Heart hero takes war injuries in stride
On June 1, [Bill] Vaughn was driving a tractor-trailer from a machine shop...Driving slowly and carefully, he hardly flinched at the concussion of an enemy mortar. It detonated about a football field away from his truck.
03/04/06 thefacts.com: Students write to wounded Brazoswood grad
Navy Petty Officer Brandon Crocker...The 21-year-old medic, who was attached to a Marine unit, was injured Feb. 25 in a battle in Iraq. Official details of the incident were unavailable Friday.
03/04/06 wnep.com: Injured Soldier Recovers at Home
Sergeant Michael Scott Bennet...On February 15 the National Guardsman with the 109th was seriously injured while on patrol just outside Ramadi, Iraq.
03/04/06 LATimes: Rural killings clash with calm in Iraq
Suspected Sunni Arab insurgents killed at least 19 electric power plant employees and poor Shiite Muslim laborers during a rampage in a rural, religiously mixed stretch of the country, officials said yesterday.
03/04/06 AP: Talabani says he has assurances U.S. forces to stay as long as needed
President Jalal Talabani on Saturday underscored the need for a unity government in Iraq after a spasm of sectarian killing and said he had been assured U.S. forces would remain in the country as long as needed - "no matter what the period."
03/04/06 AP: Four more handcuffed, shot-up bodies found
Police on Saturday found at least four more handcuffed, shot-up bodies dumped in Baghdad and south of the capital.
03/04/06 AP: Shiite lawmaker seriously wounded by gunmen
A Shiite lawmaker, meanwhile, was seriously wounded when gunmen fired on his car near Basra. An aide for Qasim Attiyah al-Jbouri was killed and two bodyguards injured, police Capt. Mushtaq Kadhim said.
03/04/06 Reuters: Seven civilians killed by mortar fire near Salman Pak
A mortar round landed in a crowded market near a bus station and killed seven people and wounded 20 in the town of Gisr Diyala near Salman Pak
03/04/06 Reuters: Car bomb kills 2, wounds 3 policemen near Baghdad
A car bomb near a police checkpoint killed two civilians and wounded three police officers in the town of Salman Pak, southeast of Baghdad, on Saturday, police said.
03/04/06 montgomeryadvertiser: Alabama soldier killed in Iraq
Army Staff Sgt. Dwayne Peter Lewis was killed while on patrol with his unit in Baghdad, his wife said. Military officials confirmed the death, but did not immediately release details. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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Eventually the Iraqi army improves to be able to take on the insurgents then the US will be able to stay out of much of the combat. Then US forces can be used for geo political objectives.
There is a lot of fighting in Iraq , but there was a lot of mass killing in Iraq before the US was there.
How does US forces in Kurdistan make Iraq a quagmire. Especailly if Iraqi army does much of the fighting? |
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desultude
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Location: Dangling my toes in the Persian Gulf
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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Yu_Bum_suk- obviously you are not listening to Gen. Peter Pace, who must be viewing the war from the Crawford ranch.
| Quote: |
Iraq's Not on Verge of Civil War, General Says
By PAULINE JELINEK, AP
[b]Gen. Peter Pace says that much progress is being made toward training Iraqi forces to take over security of the country.
The Pentagon's top general acknowledged Sunday that "anything can happen" in Iraq, but he said things aren't as bad as some say. "I wouldn't put a great big smiley face on it, but I would say they're going very, very well from everything you look at."[/b] |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| desultude wrote: |
Yu_Bum_suk- obviously you are not listening to Gen. Peter Pace, who must be viewing the war from the Crawford ranch.
| Quote: |
Iraq's Not on Verge of Civil War, General Says
By PAULINE JELINEK, AP
[b]Gen. Peter Pace says that much progress is being made toward training Iraqi forces to take over security of the country.
The Pentagon's top general acknowledged Sunday that "anything can happen" in Iraq, but he said things aren't as bad as some say. "I wouldn't put a great big smiley face on it, but I would say they're going very, very well from everything you look at."[/b] |
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The war isn't as bad as many internet posters sitting at their computers are posting. Again, that doesn't mean it is a good situation.
Most of the violence is being committed in three provinces. Suleimaniya looks like the Utah of the Middle East. Negotiations with many Sunni resistance leaders has resulted in a meltdown of the organized Sunni insurgency (against the US at least).
Yes, there may be a civil war. Which would be pretty bad. |
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Alias
Joined: 24 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
Eventually the Iraqi army improves to be able to take on the insurgents then the US will be able to stay out of much of the combat. Then US forces can be used for geo political objectives.
There is a lot of fighting in Iraq , but there was a lot of mass killing in Iraq before the US was there.
How does US forces in Kurdistan make Iraq a quagmire. Especailly if Iraqi army does much of the fighting? |
No Iraq unit is ready. Even the Pentagon admitted as much a couple of weeks ago. The promise that Iraqi soldiers could handle the situation themselves has been setback again and again. I would not be surprised if 1 year from now we are still in the same boat. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 1:43 am Post subject: |
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| Alias wrote: |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
Eventually the Iraqi army improves to be able to take on the insurgents then the US will be able to stay out of much of the combat. Then US forces can be used for geo political objectives.
There is a lot of fighting in Iraq , but there was a lot of mass killing in Iraq before the US was there.
How does US forces in Kurdistan make Iraq a quagmire. Especailly if Iraqi army does much of the fighting? |
No Iraq unit is ready. Even the Pentagon admitted as much a couple of weeks ago. The promise that Iraqi soldiers could handle the situation themselves has been setback again and again. I would not be surprised if 1 year from now we are still in the same boat. |
Yes, but half of the Iraqi battalions demonstrate Type II readiness. They are able to lead in combat but still require American support. Although, it is sad that the only independent battalion slipped back from Type I into Type II readiness. |
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