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crazylemongirl
Joined: 23 Mar 2003
Location: almost there...
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 Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 3:50 pm Post subject: |
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| As flip to this, last year a group of about 40 middle and high school kids went to arkansas. Their chaperones were two government officals who spoke no english. So the kid with the best english got stuck looking after all the kids + officals. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 4:14 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, thanks so much for all the responses, especially 3baekwon's and the lengthy email ttompatz sent me.
My kids are older so I'm not anticipating problems with criers, wonderers or first periods. I will, however, try to get a couple of cell phones on a weekly rental basis for whatever country we go to.
I can understand Peppermint's surprise (though am pretty shocked that even a bag like Corporal would stoop to such a scumbag comment) but working at a girls high school you'd be surprised - a while back I was asked by my principal and her friend to be a Girl Scout volunteer. That one I *quickly* wormed out of.
Homer, I like your idea of visiting educational facilities. It's too bad it will be summer because I know several people who work at high schools. It would be so much fun to shock them by taking them to a school with janitors, a day-care, a student parking lot, and students with every colour of hair and numerous body piercings smoking just off campus, lol.
As for the money, it's not a concern for me - as far as I'm concerned my regular monthly salary is sufficient. However Grotto's comment really made me think - I'm going to be sure to demand that the school deposit a very considerable expence and contingency fund in an international credit card account.
Thanks again for all the advice, and if anyone else can share their experiences of international trips please do. It's looking like it's still a toss-up between Canada and the Philippines. |
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Homer
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:24 am Post subject: |
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My advice would be to pad the expenses and pocket an extra 4 or 5 million won or so.
If you take a trip where you are going to be working 24/7 for two weeks straight the pay should reflect that.
While the experience sounds exceedingly rewarding for the students...it also sounds physically and emotionally exhausting for the teacher. |
Always looking for the money bags eh Grotto!  
As one who took canadian HS students to France for a 3 week trip back when I was teaching in Ontario...it is considered...part-of-your-pay....
As for this trip Yum is trying to organize trying to pad his pockets with 4-5 million won for a short trip is just a bad idea.
Asking for a bonus in pay might work however. We did so and got a bonus on our monthly pay when we returned.
What you should plan for is daily unexpected expenses. That means allowing a certain amount per day for those unexpected expenses. You can calculate this by student and for you and your co-worker. It could amount to say 30 CAD per day on top of the food, accomodation, transportation and other such expenses.
As for going in the summer...no worries, many universities are open in the summer and might be worth a visit.
Other schools might be shut down however but might still be worth a visit.
Then there are museums and other interesting places to visit. |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:32 am Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
As for the money, it's not a concern for me - as far as I'm concerned my regular monthly salary is sufficient. However Grotto's comment really made me think - I'm going to be sure to demand that the school deposit a very considerable expence and contingency fund in an international credit card account.
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Well, I guess my suggestions weren't recognized. Only when Grotto brought it up, you had some sort of response. I'm deeply offended (ha). I can't believe how naive you are. I'ts not greed. Like I said (before Grotto who has a half handful of fingers of times repeated what I've already said about other things like what I said was just not acceptable until he said it  ), it's a 24-hr/day job. Do it for free if you like. Have fun. |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:43 am Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
My advice would be to pad the expenses and pocket an extra 4 or 5 million won or so.
If you take a trip where you are going to be working 24/7 for two weeks straight the pay should reflect that.
While the experience sounds exceedingly rewarding for the students...it also sounds physically and emotionally exhausting for the teacher. |
While I agree, 4 or 5 million is excessive and you would never have asked for that. For two weeks, maybe one to two million depending on where you go and expenses. On top of the contract. I'd say 2 million no less than 1.5. Then negotiate for 1.8 That's with breakfast, lunch, dinner, and accomodations included.
4 or 5 is ridiculous. |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:45 am Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
Wow, thanks so much for all the responses, especially 3baekwon's and the lengthy email ttompatz sent me.
My kids are older so I'm not anticipating problems with criers, wonderers or first periods. I will, however, try to get a couple of cell phones on a weekly rental basis for whatever country we go to.
I can understand Peppermint's surprise (though am pretty shocked that even a bag like Corporal would stoop to such a scumbag comment) but working at a girls high school you'd be surprised - a while back I was asked by my principal and her friend to be a Girl Scout volunteer. That one I *quickly* wormed out of.
Homer, I like your idea of visiting educational facilities. It's too bad it will be summer because I know several people who work at high schools. It would be so much fun to shock them by taking them to a school with janitors, a day-care, a student parking lot, and students with every colour of hair and numerous body piercings smoking just off campus, lol.
As for the money, it's not a concern for me - as far as I'm concerned my regular monthly salary is sufficient. However Grotto's comment really made me think - I'm going to be sure to demand that the school deposit a very considerable expence and contingency fund in an international credit card account.
Thanks again for all the advice, and if anyone else can share their experiences of international trips please do. It's looking like it's still a toss-up between Canada and the Philippines. |
Why? |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 9:53 am Post subject: |
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I'm tellin' ya. As soon as you confront them, they give you respect. Sounds like me that you fear something.
They respect authority and confrontation here. If you aren't up front, you get screwed.
I wouldn't want to be responsible for a bunch of kids away from home and get distracted by anything.
Maybe you should work for Red Cross or the like. I don't know, man. You should get paid extra for this. If you don't, sham on you. Really. You're looking after kids 24 hrs/day. If you're responsible, you'll look for the extra pay. If they are responsilbe, they'll pay it. If no extra pay, no do. I'm not talking about greed.
Plus, ifyYou do this with no extra pay then what are you saying about yourself and your abilities? |
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Grotto
Joined: 21 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 11:02 am Post subject: |
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I'm tellin' ya. As soon as you confront them, they give you respect. Sounds like me that you fear something.
They respect authority and confrontation here. If you aren't up front, you get screwed.
I wouldn't want to be responsible for a bunch of kids away from home and get distracted by anything. |
Confronting them is one thing, but you still have to play spin doctor and do it the right way otherwise they get quite pissy!
I wholeheartedly agree with the statement that you have to be up front though....and get agreements/money up front...Koreans have a tendency to forget after the fact |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
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I'm tellin' ya. As soon as you confront them, they give you respect. Sounds like me that you fear something.
They respect authority and confrontation here. If you aren't up front, you get screwed.
I wouldn't want to be responsible for a bunch of kids away from home and get distracted by anything. |
Confronting them is one thing, but you still have to play spin doctor and do it the right way otherwise they get quite pissy!
I wholeheartedly agree with the statement that you have to be up front though....and get agreements/money up front...Koreans have a tendency to forget after the fact |
If you don't get it before, it's gone. |
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jacl
Joined: 31 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 12:57 pm Post subject: |
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| In theory. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 4:13 pm Post subject: |
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I'm really not in my job for the money. I get paid well and on time and have received bonuses for extra work done in the past and the job is really rewarding. So that's not really a concern. My only concern is having a contingency fund, medical insurance, etc., in case anything goes wrong.
I completely see Grotto and Jacl's point; however, I really feel that my school is a lot different from most Korean institutions. So far I haven't had to be really confrontational with my school about anything that's come up - working Saturdays, water problems, the school wanting me to take in a new teacher as a roommate - and I'm pretty sure my school will find some way to reward me if I take a bunch of students on an overseas trip. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| working Saturdays, water problems, the school wanting me to take in a new teacher as a roommate |
Oh dear, a roomate would suck, never know who would pitch up. I assume saturdays are optional at your school?
Re: your foreign trip- sounds like a great time. If I had a similar choice I'd opt for the Gold coast /N.end of Australia. Not hard to make them feel at home from time to time, with a few Korean-speaking restaurants etc thrown in. Also, there are very well run opportunities for your students to take in a new Aboriginal culture, appreciate the environment (reef), the weathers great: facilities and transport are easy: and plenty of Koreans living there so not too difficult to get some local translator to help out with extra support if need be. Climates great too, and many very tourist oriented activities available. It would take a lot of organisational weight off your shoulders. |
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Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| working Saturdays, water problems, the school wanting me to take in a new teacher as a roommate |
Oh dear, a roomate would suck, never know who would pitch up. I assume saturdays are optional at your school?
Re: your foreign trip- sounds like a great time. If I had a similar choice I'd opt for the Gold coast /N.end of Australia. Not hard to make them feel at home from time to time, with a few Korean-speaking restaurants etc thrown in. Also, there are very well run opportunities for your students to take in a new Aboriginal culture, appreciate the environment (reef), the weathers great: facilities and transport are easy: and plenty of Koreans living there so not too difficult to get some local translator to help out with extra support if need be. Climates great too, and many very tourist oriented activities available. It would take a lot of organisational weight off your shoulders. |
The roommate and working Saturdays I was able politely to avoid without kicking up much fuss, thankfully.
Interesting idea. I've never been to Australia, but then I've never been to the Philippines, either. On our initial cost estimations Sydney was one of the most expensive to fly to, unfortunately. |
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rapier
Joined: 16 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| Grotto wrote: |
My advice would be to pad the expenses and pocket an extra 4 or 5 million won or so.
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An all expenses paid trip is a nice bonus, and YBS has a good relationship with his school.
Why would you recomend messing that up by trying to rob them of 5M won? |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 11:09 pm Post subject: |
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| rapier wrote: |
| Grotto wrote: |
My advice would be to pad the expenses and pocket an extra 4 or 5 million won or so.
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An all expenses paid trip is a nice bonus, and YBS has a good relationship with his school.
Why would you recomend messing that up by trying to rob them of 5M won? |
I don't know if YBS's school pays him for sitting on his can (office hours when they're no classes, seat-warming duty, etc.) but that would matter to me if I were handed such a task. I mean, even if the school wasn't asking him to actually go on the trip w/the students, but just plan it for them -- that by itself would take a massive amount of time, above & beyond normal teaching duties, wouldn't it? And when he's on the trip, he'll be on duty 24/7. Whether or not the kids get in trouble, get out of hand, whatever, that's still a lot of work and worry. I'd certainly ask for a big chunk of the proceeds for that, and I wouldn't accept the school defining such extra payment as a "bonus" or some big favour they're doing for me. Because it's not. It's extra work that deserves to be fairly compensated. I'm not saying he should cheat them or gouge them, however.
That YBS seems happy to do this and is looking forward to it is just great. But that really doesn't alter the fact that the time & energy he's giving them deserves to be fairly compensated. Now, if they are giving him a free choice -- "take it or leave it, and you won't lose your job if you'd just rather not get involved for the amount we're willing to pay you", then that's okay. (btw, are they giving you the option of declining, YBS?) |
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