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Porter_Goss
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Location: The Wrong Side of Right
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 Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:29 pm Post subject: |
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| merlot wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I remember a few years back in Kirkland, WA some teenager with a broken leg was walking through a park. Three young toughs approached him, attacked him, and "beat him with his own crutches". The toughs got the book thrown at them by a judge. Something about beating a cripple with his own crutches is just beyond all civil forms of beating. |
Reminds me of the most excellent story--Good Country People by Flannery O'Connor where a bible salesman seduces a young women, then steals her wooden leg. |
That is a good story. Wow... flashback to middle school. |
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Porter_Goss
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Location: The Wrong Side of Right
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| I remember a few years back in Kirkland, WA some teenager with a broken leg was walking through a park. Three young toughs approached him, attacked him, and "beat him with his own crutches". The toughs got the book thrown at them by a judge. Something about beating a cripple with his own crutches is just beyond all civil forms of beating. |
I think it's good that there are varying degrees of assault charges. Beating an old woman in the park is not the same as beating some A-hole in a street fight. I hate when the Law makes no distinction. She is pregnant, hitting her could endanger the life of her child. |
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Free World
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Drake Hotel
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 8:43 pm Post subject: |
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| Why were there men at a baby shower? |
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Porter_Goss
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Location: The Wrong Side of Right
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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| Free World wrote: |
| Why were there men at a baby shower? |
Women don't beat themselves. |
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pet lover
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: not in Seoul
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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godless heathen? Why Rteacher, you are so kind! *bats eyelashes in lame attempt to imitate Scarlett O'Hara* 
(not to Rteacher, but the other poster whose name I can't remember how to spell...sorry)---
I was not trolling. Puh-leeze. I've been here how long? Why would I suddenly start trolling now? I was seriously wondering if there was some kind of justification for that which I just hadn't thought of. I find it mind-boggling. As for off-topic, um, I SAID it was bit off-topic, but I also pointed out that this IS the off-topic forum. Technically, I think I could start talking about how Young-Jae licked the back of Dong-On's head as it it were a tasty ice cream cone today in kindergarten. But, I'll refrain. 
When kind of response were you looking for when you posted that? Did you just want everyone to get all outraged and symathetic for the poor woman? What would that accomplish? I had a valid question. I HAVE a valid question. And it IS directly related to what you posted. It was something I thought of when I first read that story (not here, incidentally).
endoftheworld, I won't challenge you to it. I'm sure you are a very creative person. I was just trying to emphasize how much that offended me. But, that would make an interesting thread.....how to truly insult someone without invoking the censor beep.
FreeWorld, I imagine this story could be used as an example on WHY some men are not invited to baby showers...... |
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periwinkle
Joined: 08 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| pet lover wrote: |
godless heathen? Why Rteacher, you are so kind! *bats eyelashes in lame attempt to imitate Scarlett O'Hara*
(not to Rteacher, but the other poster whose name I can't remember how to spell...sorry)---
I was not trolling. Puh-leeze. I've been here how long? Why would I suddenly start trolling now? I was seriously wondering if there was some kind of justification for that which I just hadn't thought of. I find it mind-boggling. As for off-topic, um, I SAID it was bit off-topic, but I also pointed out that this IS the off-topic forum. Technically, I think I could start talking about how Young-Jae licked the back of Dong-On's head as it it were a tasty ice cream cone today in kindergarten. But, I'll refrain.
When kind of response were you looking for when you posted that? Did you just want everyone to get all outraged and symathetic for the poor woman? What would that accomplish? I had a valid question. I HAVE a valid question. And it IS directly related to what you posted. It was something I thought of when I first read that story (not here, incidentally).
endoftheworld, I won't challenge you to it. I'm sure you are a very creative person. I was just trying to emphasize how much that offended me. But, that would make an interesting thread.....how to truly insult someone without invoking the censor beep.
FreeWorld, I imagine this story could be used as an example on WHY some men are not invited to baby showers...... |
Seems Young- Jae didn't eat breakfast this morning. |
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Free World
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Drake Hotel
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 3:22 am Post subject: |
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| pet lover wrote: |
| FreeWorld, I imagine this story could be used as an example on WHY some men are not invited to baby showers...... |
If I had a woman who tried to drag me to that crap, I'd be packing heat too. |
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pet lover
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: not in Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 3:55 am Post subject: |
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| HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH.......oh, please, that is SO not you! Remember, I've witnessed you getting big ole slobbery kisses from little junior kindergarten students. |
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Satori
Joined: 09 Dec 2005
Location: Above it all
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:41 am Post subject: |
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| pet lover wrote: |
| off topic question, but this IS the off topic forum.....why do they make a big deal that she was pregnant? Even if she had been beaten so badly that the baby had died, it is still, legally, just a fetus, a mass of tissue that has no right to live. So why even mention that she is pregnant? |
So when reporting an event, don't mention anything that is not legally relevant?
Actually in any case, it seems that "assaulting a pregnant woman" is indeed a distinct legal catagory from "assault". Basically it's the whole point of interest in the story. People, in general, find the assault of pregnant women more abhorent than other kinds of assault, for obvious and perfectly natural reasons. |
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pet lover
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: not in Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 5:38 am Post subject: |
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| But that's exactly why I find it so puzzling...if that woman can abort her baby the very next day by choice, she's killing the baby. That is just as dead as if the man had hit her hard enough to kill the baby. |
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Summer Wine
Joined: 20 Mar 2005
Location: Next to a River
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:43 am Post subject: |
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| Even if she had been beaten so badly that the baby had died, it is still, legally, just a fetus, a mass of tissue that has no right to live. So why even mention that she is pregnant? |
I am so glad I don't live in a world where I have to agree with everyone. |
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DanielInKorea
Joined: 28 Nov 2005
Location: Not a small village
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:57 am Post subject: |
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| pet lover wrote: |
| off topic question, but this IS the off topic forum.....why do they make a big deal that she was pregnant? Even if she had been beaten so badly that the baby had died, it is still, legally, just a fetus, a mass of tissue that has no right to live. So why even mention that she is pregnant? |
I'm still trying to work out if you are actually serious. And I think you are.
Ok "pet lover", I am a Christian, and I hope that statement doesn't just cause you to disregard the rest of my post on principle. Please be open minded and hear me out.
I am amazed and somewhat glad I have had the opportunity to listen to someone like you. You are the epitome of what it means to be materialistic (philosophical sense). You have taken the incorrect reasoning of the materialistic worldview to its ultimate conclusion, and you have arrived at the logical outworking of what you believe. A baby murdered inside the womb is ok because it's just a 'fetus.'
Unfortunately for you, most other materialists are inconsistent in what they believe, and therefore you are ridiculed on this forum. Most people who believe that killing a baby inside the mother's womb is ok don't believe it's ok for the baby to be killed by someone else if the mother doesn't want that. Therefore, the only thing that protects the baby is the mother's will. I'm amazed that you see that logical inconsistency and don't fall for it.
Now for my next question...
Abortion is a harmful procedure that hurts the mother. Surely it would be safer to wait until the baby is born and then killing it, right? I mean, they already have that partial birth abortion (Dilation and Extraction) thing, right? When the baby is being born you kill it. But think about it. Wouldn't it be better to just have the baby and then kill it afterwards? It would be much safer for the mother's health. I am honestly, no joking, desirous to hear your opinion on this subject.
Please respond in an informative and polite manner.
Daniel |
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anyway
Joined: 22 Oct 2005
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Love it when Christians ask others to be open minded and informative...as if they all searched out the widest variety of information they could find, analyzed it with open minds, and all came to the same conclusion. |
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pet lover
Joined: 02 Jan 2004
Location: not in Seoul
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 2:47 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="DanielInKorea"]
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You have taken the incorrect reasoning of the materialistic worldview to its ultimate conclusion, and you have arrived at the logical outworking of what you believe. A baby murdered inside the womb is ok because it's just a 'fetus.' |
You misunderstand. I am completely against abortion. I do NOT believe it is okay to murder a baby. If I did, I'd probably use a more pro"choice" term and call it a fetus, right? That should have been a major clue to you. In you still don't get it, I AM AGAINST ABORTION.
| Quote: |
| Surely it would be safer to wait until the baby is born and then killing it, right? I mean, they already have that partial birth abortion (Dilation and Extraction) thing, right? When the baby is being born you kill it. But think about it. Wouldn't it be better to just have the baby and then kill it afterwards? It would be much safer for the mother's health. I am honestly, no joking, desirous to hear your opinion on this subject. |
Considering that I am completely against abortion, I think that you can understand how even reading the above is horrifying to me. I am AGAINST ABORTION. I wouldn't get an abortion if I were raped--because the baby would still be HALF MINE, not to mention a valid person with the right to live.
I do not know how to write in a more clear manner than what I've already attempted in previous posts.
I am trying to understand the justification that a society that permits the murder of unborn children and yet gets in an uproar when a pregnant woman is beaten (as in, more than a woman who is not pregnant) to the extent that her pregnancy is what makes the headline in this incident) ....what justification that society is using.
I don't get it.
It is "shocking" IN THIS SOCIETY for a pregnant woman to get beaten (because of the unborn child within). But it is also perfectly acceptable and not newsworthy IN THIS SOCIETY for a woman to have her unborn child murdered.
How on earth does that make sense?
I would like to know what possible justification there could be for it.
I'm interested in hearing from pro-choice people on this, not pro-life because pro-lifers are likely just as confused and outraged about this as I am.
How on earth does this make sense? |
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Free World
Joined: 01 Apr 2005
Location: Drake Hotel
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 4:17 pm Post subject: |
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| pet lover wrote: |
| I'm interested in hearing from pro-choice people on this |
1) I don't think that all of us "pro-choice people" support abortion when the mother is seven months pregnant.
2) I think it is the mother's right to choose. Not some baby shower gangster's right to choose. The woman in this story wants the keep the child.
That said however, I do understand what you are saying. The law doesn't give the fetus any rights until it is born, yet the general public is outraged when an unborn fetus is assaulted. What can I say, we are hypocrites. |
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