Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

What do you think is wrong with American education system?
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Off-Topic Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
RokofKangnam



Joined: 20 Sep 2005
Location: Between a ROK and a Hard Place

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

indytrucks wrote:
I reckon 5 to 1 this thread goes 4-6 more posts before it turns into another USA vs. (insert country here) thread.

Any takers?


Based on the majority of Canadians I've witnessed running around this country, I would say the US schools system is doing a bang up job.

Cool


New Page !
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
splok



Joined: 30 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think you'll find that the problems vary incredibly from school to school. I went to a VERY small school and always thought that it could have been much better. There was pretty much one set of classes for everyone, and if you wanted to go to college, you could take a couple of extra math classes (which pretty much stopped at some basic trig). On the other hand, it was free of many of the problems that larger schools have. I see graduation rates in some areas quoted as being 50-60%, and I can barely believe it. What makes those numbers worse is the lack of basic reading and math skills that students are allowed to graduate with in some areas.

The idea of anyone graduating from my school being illiterate is just unthinkable really. It just couldn't have happened. I think the problem is either that there just aren't adequate standards being applied to educational systems and that the funding isn't adequate to properly execute the standards that are in place. It's a complicated problem, but imo education is the last place that should ever be lacking in funding.

Additionally, I think teachers should be far better trained and far better paid. We should have the most capable members of society teaching our children, and their training and wages should reflect that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
laogaiguk



Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

splok wrote:
I think you'll find that the problems vary incredibly from school to school. I went to a VERY small school and always thought that it could have been much better. There was pretty much one set of classes for everyone, and if you wanted to go to college, you could take a couple of extra math classes (which pretty much stopped at some basic trig). On the other hand, it was free of many of the problems that larger schools have. I see graduation rates in some areas quoted as being 50-60%, and I can barely believe it. What makes those numbers worse is the lack of basic reading and math skills that students are allowed to graduate with in some areas.

The idea of anyone graduating from my school being illiterate is just unthinkable really. It just couldn't have happened. I think the problem is either that there just aren't adequate standards being applied to educational systems and that the funding isn't adequate to properly execute the standards that are in place. It's a complicated problem, but imo education is the last place that should ever be lacking in funding.

Additionally, I think teachers should be far better trained and far better paid. We should have the most capable members of society teaching our children, and their training and wages should reflect that.


If it is anything like the Canadian system (and I am betting it is), again it's parents that raise the illiterate children. Do you know what the teacher has to go through if he/she actually wants to fail a child Shocked Not too mention sometimes keeping a child afterschool interfers with the parents day so they complain about that. Or they complain that their test scores are bad even though the child never does homework... I could go on for awhile. Parents being stupid a$$es thinking their children are not all that bad is the problem, not the teachers. Teachers are fairly well trained now. I don't know what else you want that is feasible in today's economy. They should be paid more though.

During a scuffle between Ontario government and teachers wanting to go one strike, many parents wrote in letters to the paper. Most of the comments were along the lines of
1) They get 2 months off, stop your compaining. They should only get the 3 weeks I do. (Teachers don't really get all that time off, and if you factor in the amount of overtime a teacher puts in, even the lazy ones, they earned that vacation)
2) Why do they need more time off for training during the school year. This really screws around with me as I have to find a sitter...

You can imagine the rest.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SOOHWA101



Joined: 04 Mar 2006
Location: Makin moves...trying to find 24pyung

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="Porter_Goss"][quote="SOOHWA101"]
Porter_Goss wrote:
What do I think is wrong with the American school system?

I am a product of the American Public School System. I knew nothing of American history (other than some of the little blips I originally posted and what I read on my own) until my Freshman year of University.
I'm not suggesting that we didn't learn these events, I'm suggesting that's all we learned.

The fat kid thing was a joke, but seriously.... on average American kids are getting fatter and fatter. Some have suggested this is due to Physical Education cutbacks.


Hell, I am educated in nutrition and I still have to work hard as hell to maintain my He-man physique. I can't imagine what the children are faced with. Meaning no guidance or direction.

Also, you may be right. My source monitoring could be tainted. Most of what I learned may have been in college. Although I grew up in Plano, to which 2 of the schools that reside in that ISD score in the top ten of the nations public school education system. But hell, high-school is a "smoky"
memory.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SirFink



Joined: 05 Mar 2006

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Porter_Goss wrote:
I am a product of the American Public School System. I knew nothing of American history (other than some of the little blips I originally posted and what I read on my own) until my Freshman year of University.


I once had a conversation with an 18-year-old high school senior. Straight A's and on her way to college. She had no idea what "Watergate" was. Her excuse: they never taught her that in school. For Christs's sake woman, there are half a dozen movies about it! Not to mention books and frequent mentions on news programs. They never taught me either, but I was well-aware of it when I was her age.

As you yourself said: "what I read on my own." A teen-ager is old enough to take a certain amount of responsibility for their own education. You shouldn't expect everything to come from your teachers. Go to the library and read a stinking book. Maybe *gasp* kids' parents could even have a few educational conversations with their dang kids instead of the usual "what's for dinner?" and "dad, can you drive me to the mall?" But I guess it's easier to blame the schools, teachers' unions, revisionist history, liberals, lack of funding, etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
laogaiguk



Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SirFink wrote:
Porter_Goss wrote:
I am a product of the American Public School System. I knew nothing of American history (other than some of the little blips I originally posted and what I read on my own) until my Freshman year of University.


I once had a conversation with an 18-year-old high school senior. Straight A's and on her way to college. She had no idea what "Watergate" was. Her excuse: they never taught her that in school. For Christs's sake woman, there are half a dozen movies about it! Not to mention books and frequent mentions on news programs. They never taught me either, but I was well-aware of it when I was her age.

As you yourself said: "what I read on my own." A teen-ager is old enough to take a certain amount of responsibility for their own education. You shouldn't expect everything to come from your teachers. Go to the library and read a stinking book. Maybe *gasp* kids' parents could even have a few educational conversations with their dang kids instead of the usual "what's for dinner?" and "dad, can you drive me to the mall?" But I guess it's easier to blame the schools, teachers' unions, revisionist history, liberals, lack of funding, etc.


I read a lot when I was a kid. My parents would reward me if I did, but I could always choose what I wanted to read. They would buy me 2 books a month (anything I wanted) and we went to the library a lot. When I was older (13-16) I had a paper route and all my money went into a used bookstore at the very end of my route (I bought candy there too though Smile ). It's one of the few reasons my English is really good, considering the amount of English training in a computer science degree is not that high and I focused much more on science and math in high school.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
RACETRAITOR



Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea

PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

An American friend of me once referred to wartime Hiroshima and Nagasaki as military installations. I had to explain that I'd just visited Nagasaki and it was a city (which happened to have shipyards or something). He told me it was just what he learnt in school.

There's probably a wide variety in curriculum. Probably if you go to some more liberal schools they'll teach you all about scalphunting and residential schools and Japanese internment camps.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
splok



Joined: 30 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

laogaiguk wrote:

If it is anything like the Canadian system (and I am betting it is), again it's parents that raise the illiterate children. Do you know what the teacher has to go through if he/she actually wants to fail a child Shocked Not too mention sometimes keeping a child afterschool interfers with the parents day so they complain about that. Or they complain that their test scores are bad even though the child never does homework... I could go on for awhile. Parents being stupid a$$es thinking their children are not all that bad is the problem, not the teachers. Teachers are fairly well trained now. I don't know what else you want that is feasible in today's economy. They should be paid more though.


Oh, no doubt that it is largely the parents' fault, but fixing that goes beyond a normal discussion of an educational system (although maybe it shouldn't). What the kids are taught in school is directly under control of the education system, but fixing the parents isn't. I understand that it may not be as simple as just failing a student, but shouldn't it be? It might not be possible to force parents to be productive in a child's education, but shouldn't it be possible to at least prevent them from being destructive to the educational system's efforts? I know that's probably crazy talk, but the thread is asking what the problems are.

Also, dumping far more money into education may not be typically considered feasible by whoever decides if such things are feasible or not, but I would contend that anything less than dramatically over funding education is incredible shortsighted. The education of our current students is what the success of our future economy is built on. We are shortchanging it at our own peril.

Oh, and it may be a somewhat smaller complaint, but along with an increased focus on health, I think schools really need some focus on personal finance. Students should really graduate with some understanding of interest, debt, saving, etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Yo!Chingo



Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul Korea

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zappadelta wrote:
Quote:
Ok Spinoza's g/f


Spinoza's gf?


OOPS...Zappa'g g/f...what's the dif? I wouldn't know him from Adam if I saw him anyway! BTW if that' all you have to say about my post I'm disappointed. I put 5 whole minutes into that one!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
SuperFly



Joined: 09 Jul 2003
Location: In the doghouse

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 3:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had an opportunity to attend a private American school overseas in Athens back in the 70's & 80's. It was a pleasant surprise to us when we found out that our regular classes in Athens were somewhat more advanced than their equivalent in the Florida (Capitol) public school we attended upon our return to the land of round doorknobs.

Yes, I can remember that far back gdammit. Razz
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Bulsajo



Joined: 16 Jan 2003

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 8:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

RokofKangnam wrote:
indytrucks wrote:
I reckon 5 to 1 this thread goes 4-6 more posts before it turns into another USA vs. (insert country here) thread.

Any takers?


Based on the majority of Canadians I've witnessed running around this country, I would say the US schools system is doing a bang up job.

Cool


New Page !

Woah, now that could be interpreted in so many ways...
certainly not the least of which is your herculean attempts at fulfilling Indytrucks' prophetic words.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
going_places



Joined: 10 Mar 2006
Location: NY, NY

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 7:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In my opinion, as a person educated in both the American public school system, one private, as well as state university, there seems to be an overall lacking with regard to the following areas:

1) Low expectations and teachers who want a cushy job with summers off. I was always a curious kid and was never pushed, both my parents worked and I was an only child. Television was my babysitter, best friend and spiritual advisor.

2) Teachers are either scared of teaching, or assume that kids already have, "common sense" in a hopelessly politicly correct climate. Many things become the parents responsibilty to teach by default and parents assume the same of the schools they are sent to. I believe that school, on some level, is a mode of convience for many parents. Critical thinking skills are not generally not taught; and if they are at all, too late in life. I didn't get a solid foundation in logic until taking some Philosophy courses in college that are not always required as Gen Ed.

3) Teachers assume that kids understand grammar.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
zappadelta



Joined: 31 Aug 2004

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
zappadelta wrote:
Quote:
Ok Spinoza's g/f


Spinoza's gf?


OOPS...Zappa'g g/f...what's the dif? I wouldn't know him from Adam if I saw him anyway! BTW if that' all you have to say about my post I'm disappointed. I put 5 whole minutes into that one!



Sorry, Chingo, Forgot to say thanks. You made some really good points and I appreciate your time.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
IchiTK



Joined: 02 Feb 2006
Location: on my way...

PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imbroglio wrote:
What's wrong with it is that it is being dominated and run by liberals.



Twisted Evil


What's wrong with it is that it is being dismantled, subverted, and underfunded by conservatives.

Cool
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dulouz



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Uranus

PostPosted: Sat Apr 08, 2006 5:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Mexicans filed a lawsuit to a communist judge's court that argued that the USA has to provide an education for every child on the planet regardless of immigration status. They won, and its been nothing but a big flushing sound ever since. Its refered to as "basket case".

We have also spared the rod and spoiled the child. Liberals destroyed the education system as they destroyed The US.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Off-Topic Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International