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Paji eh Wong
Joined: 03 Jun 2003
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 Posted: Wed May 10, 2006 10:31 pm Post subject: |
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The above poster makes a good point. Take a good working environment over a high salary. You'll just blow the extra money on booze and toys to keep you on an even keel.
Negotiating with hagwon bosses is a matter of finding one in dire straights. (And really, you probably don't want a boss that's in dire straights in the first place.) How the job market works is that you've got a huge range of choices and little or no negotiating leverage. Hagwon bosses really don't care about qualifications or experience. One teacher is as good as another. Once you make a choice, that's it, you're done. So you need to choose wisely. |
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splifwiz
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 10:09 am Post subject: |
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da revolutions begins. we must form a teachers....dare i say it...
 UNION |
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splifwiz
Joined: 24 Apr 2006
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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In your case, and this is in all seriousness...
1) Don't teach kids.
2) Worry more about the schedule than the salary. DO NOT TAKE A PLACE THAT HAS SPLIT SHIFTS.
3) Go for a bigger, more established school.
4) Only work in Seoul.
You want to have an international experience before more school, and probably need/want to bank some coin or pay off loans. You only have a year, so Seoul is the place to be, and you don't want to have to work split shifts (7a.m. start, 9p.m. finish). They suck.
Once you finish your law degree, you can come back and probably get a job teaching Enlish at a university. You'd have good company as there are a TON of lawyers over here enjoying a pretty good time of it. Oh, and they make more money than N. American lawyers, too! |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 6:47 pm Post subject: |
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| PRagic wrote: |
In your case, and this is in all seriousness...
1) Don't teach kids.
2) Worry more about the schedule than the salary. DO NOT TAKE A PLACE THAT HAS SPLIT SHIFTS.
3) Go for a bigger, more established school.
4) Only work in Seoul.
You want to have an international experience before more school, and probably need/want to bank some coin or pay off loans. You only have a year, so Seoul is the place to be, and you don't want to have to work split shifts (7a.m. start, 9p.m. finish). They suck.
Once you finish your law degree, you can come back and probably get a job teaching Enlish at a university. You'd have good company as there are a TON of lawyers over here enjoying a pretty good time of it. Oh, and they make more money than N. American lawyers, too! |
I doubt that an English teacher or a lawyer here makes more money than a North American lawyer. |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 11:26 pm Post subject: |
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| I do. I have friends that are lawyers in the N. America, and I have N. American bar cerfified friends here teaching. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 5:32 am Post subject: |
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| PRagic wrote: |
| I do. I have friends that are lawyers in the N. America, and I have N. American bar cerfified friends here teaching. |
http://www.ilrg.com/
According to number (iii) in this link, the average salary of a U.S FIRST-year associate in 2003 was $97,830. I doubt you make more than that.
As I said above. "I doubt that an English teacher or a lawyer here makes more money than a N. American lawyer"
And if they are bar certified what are they do here teaching? They spent all that time and money to get bar certified and then decided to chuck it all in favour of teaching in a foreign country for a lot less money?
Highly unlikely. |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 1:23 pm Post subject: |
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Take away taxes and I still make more.
...and what planet did you get those stats from? Sure, top 10 law school grads that make associate at top firms in major cities may pull that or there abouts, but, then again, they are 100K in dept (at least), paying cost of living out the ying-yang and working 80-100 hour weeks. Average us out per hour and it's no contest. They pay off their debt, pay to live, and save next to nothing. I have no debt, I own, and I bank a bucket of coin a year.
I have a family member that finished up her MBA/Law degree a few years ago, passed the bar, and got a job. Believe me, she isn't making anywhere near 90K.
To each their own. I don't begrudge anyone becoming a lawyer and making a go of it. Just don't look down on people leveraging their degrees over here while enjoying their time. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 6:00 pm Post subject: |
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| PRagic wrote: |
(1) Take away taxes and I still make more.
(2)...and what planet did you get those stats from? Sure, top 10 law school grads that make associate at top firms in major cities may pull that or there abouts, but, then again, they are 100K in dept (at least), paying cost of living out the ying-yang and working 80-100 hour weeks. Average us out per hour and it's no contest. They pay off their debt, pay to live, and save next to nothing. I have no debt, I own, and I bank a bucket of coin a year.
(3) I have a family member that finished up her MBA/Law degree a few years ago, passed the bar, and got a job. Believe me, she isn't making anywhere near 90K.
(4) To each their own. I don't begrudge anyone becoming a lawyer and making a go of it. Just don't look down on people leveraging their degrees over here while enjoying their time. |
(numbers are mine)
1. You make more than $97000 US a year? 
2. I gave you the link. Click on the number (iii) and it gives you the NATIONAL AVERAGE, nothing about top ten schools. That is the average for U.S lawyers nation-wide. They may be in debt but after they pay that off, they are making a lot more money even after taxes. (BTW bar-certified people working here as teachers have the same debt and have to pay that on a lower salary) And that is only FIRST YEAR associates. As you go up you make a lot more. If you make partner you can rake in a half-million+. Click on the below link at the bottom of this post. It's all there.
3. Like I said, that's AVERAGE. Some people make less (like your friend) and some people make more.
4. No one is looking down on people. It was an honest question. People who finish law school and get bar certified have spent a lot of time, money and emotional/mental investment in this pursuit. Obviously they are highly motived to pursue the law as a career either because the enjoy it or want to make money. And you are saying that people like that would toss all that time and expense out the window to do something unrelated?
http://www.ilrg.com/employment/salaries/ |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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No, but I make around that depending on the year. I meant that I make more if you consider the taxes taken out in the U.S. and especially Canada on a salary in the 100K ballpark! I do teach at university, mainly because I want to publish more and keep an affiliation, not for the salary. It's nice to have 6 months off a year paid.
Again, you are right. It is a life choice. There are lawyers, medical professionals, and corporate V.P.s in the family, and they do make great coin. None of them making that high of a salary works under 60 hours a week. I'd be surprised if new lawyers put in less than 70-80. If you have that drive, and want to do those hours, then go for it. Not something I'd look forward to after 3 years of more school. When I got the Ph.D., it was because I could look forward to working less and making more!
And the fact that your quoted salary is an average favors the opinion in my original posting. Sure, there are lawyers in big cities making the huge salaries, but the average Joe Lawyer out of State University law school working in second and third tier cities or suburbia probably won't hit those figures, although that could largely depend on what they specialize in. If they can, more power to them. Just saying I wouldn't bank on it.
Believe me when I say that people DO toss it all and move here to work. I've worked for three universities here, and all have had at least one ex-lawyer. Talk to anyone in a university, and they'll most likely tell you the same.
If you are young and planning on going to law school, go in with your eyes wide open. It's a long haul. |
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jmbran11
Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 8:33 pm Post subject: deleted message |
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r.
Joined: 06 May 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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| I I make near six figures in the coming year in Korea, I would definitely put law school on hold. But that is not going to happen. |
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PRagic
Joined: 24 Feb 2006
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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No, it won't, but if you work enough, you'll be able to bank enough to at least go into law school debt free and/or with some financial padding. It takes a few years to make the contacts necessary to generate good coin, and you have to find your niche.
Good luck to you. |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| princess wrote: |
| No matter what, most schools pay around the 2.0-2.1 range. How sad, but true. I was offered 2.6 recently, but it was in a place 5 hours outside of Seoul and the hours were terrible...M, W, F 9AM-7:30PM, and T, TH 9AM-8:30PM.....I'd be dead in a month! |
Was that for teaching? |
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dogbert
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210
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| Posted: Sun May 14, 2006 11:03 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| PRagic wrote: |
| I do. I have friends that are lawyers in the N. America, and I have N. American bar cerfified friends here teaching. |
http://www.ilrg.com/
According to number (iii) in this link, the average salary of a U.S FIRST-year associate in 2003 was $97,830. I doubt you make more than that.
As I said above. "I doubt that an English teacher or a lawyer here makes more money than a N. American lawyer"
And if they are bar certified what are they do here teaching? They spent all that time and money to get bar certified and then decided to chuck it all in favour of teaching in a foreign country for a lot less money?
Highly unlikely. |
Of course, not all lawyers work as associates at large law firms. Not to mention that those that do will be working well over a 40-hour week for that salary.
********
Sidelines help lawyers keep their day jobs
By Emily Sweeney The Boston Globe
FRIDAY, MAY 12, 2006
After spending all day in court prosecuting accused criminals, John McLaughlin, an assistant district attorney in Plymouth, Massachusetts, often drives his 1998 Ford Explorer to a second job - at a funeral home in East Milton Square, a nearby town.
Suzanne Dunleavy, an assistant district attorney who also works in Plymouth, spends her nights and weekends teaching Irish step dancing classes for extra money.
Other cash-strapped prosecutors moonlight tending bar, wiping tables, mopping supermarket floors or painting houses. One drives the Zamboni resurfacing machine at a local ice rink.
The starting salary for assistant district attorneys in that city south of Boston is $35,000, about par for U.S. cities - and, say the young prosecutors, not enough to live on and pay off their law school loans, which can run into the tens of thousands of dollars.
While not all states keep such statistics, Massachusetts figures that 15 percent of all assistant district attorneys in the state work second jobs, according to a 2004 survey by the state District Attorneys Association.
......
http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/05/12/yourmoney/mmanage13.php |
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