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Lemonade
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: South Korea
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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 Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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Lemonade, I agree the Hegins pigeon shoot was a terrible thing, but it's not going on anymore! Those links are way out of date and will most likely confuse readers who haven't been following the issue:
http://www.vegan.com/issues/1999/sep99/hegins.htm
Anyway, what exactly is it that you think people on these boards should be doing and aren't already? You don't really know what others may be doing, and we don't know what you're doing either. We can't all be everywhere at once or attend every protest we might like to, but we can still make a big difference for animals by choosing a plant-based diet and not buying or encouraging the purchase of disposable "pets."
People are free to come here and "shoot their mouths off," IMO ... that's what a discussion board is for. After all, this isn't Dave's Save-the-World Cafe, is it? |
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pegpig
Joined: 10 May 2005
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| Posted: Thu May 18, 2006 11:11 pm Post subject: |
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| red dog wrote: |
| I'm not sure what the practice is in Korea, but in North America they often grind male chicks up alive because they have no economic value (or would have more value as fertilizer or some other product). |
OH...........MY..............LORD!!!!
What the animal rights nuts are capable of. Grind up male chicks for fertilizer? What the hell for? To make more money than they would if they sold the chick to be raised for making a perfectly delicious chicken sandwich? Not even close.
Sometimes these nuts should think things through before they submit their creative writing. |
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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pegpig
Joined: 10 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 12:40 am Post subject: |
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Well, I'm off to Popeye's. I'll let you know later if it was a male or female burger.
I don't deny that they'll destroy some males, but grind them up live for fertilizer? A little dramatic even for your side don't you think? |
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 12:43 am Post subject: |
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| That's one of the recommended methods! Read the link from your side. |
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pegpig
Joined: 10 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 12:53 am Post subject: |
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"Death by drowning, suffocation by piling chicks in disposable containers, chloroform, ether, cyanide, thermal exhaustion, or any other method resulting in inhumane death are not acceptable."
These are unacceptable and you'll notice that one of the linked photos that you provided (dying/dead chicks in the dumpster) is not mentioned as an acceptable means of disposal. I read the entire section 1.5 and nowhere does it mention grinding up live chicks as the recommended method of disposal. This is really starting to make me hungry. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 1:18 am Post subject: |
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| Lemonade wrote: |
My point is this: IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! Don't just run your mouth. Talk is cheap. |
So, Professor, do you remain silent unless you can fight the appropriate battle? |
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Lemonade
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 3:15 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Lemonade wrote: |
My point is this: IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! Don't just run your mouth. Talk is cheap. |
So, Professor, do you remain silent unless you can fight the appropriate battle? |
Mindmetoo, when it comes to animals, YOU BET I do. If I can help, I am there in a heartbeat. I was there at the Hegins pigeon shoot rescuing pigeons amongst the KKK, Ted Nugent fans and Nazis pointing guns everywhere saying the most inflamatory things I have ever heard in my life. They didn't stop short of beating up women who were there to rescue the birds. I was on CNN with blood all over my shirt. Call me a drama queen, I really don't care. I know what I experienced. What bothered me the most were the PETA people (stupid people) who promised to be there who managed to show up when the shoot was almost over and without Ingrid or any leader whatsoever. Did they bother to HELP? oh Hell no. They just stood around watching, acting stupid and got in our way of the rescue.
The whole shoot is no longer running anymore, not because of PETA's efforts, but because of people who came from around the world to be real true dedicated activitists - people who actually do something other than run their mouths and protest. It stopped because of the dedicated people who DID SOMETHING other than run their mouths. A LOT of us even went to jail. I certainly came close for crossing a line to rescue a pigeon. FYI, it was well away from the shooting range and by no means did I put my life in danger.
As for the chicks you see, I suggest you do whatever you can to help them. You said you have some in your class? Well, what on earth are you going to do about it? Let it die? If you do that, you are no better than the people who sold the chick in the first place.
At the end of the Hegins Labor Day shoot, there were hundreds left in crates. They were for sale. PETA people told us not to buy them. I helped negotiate a price and we bought about 300 of them. We had several veterinarians on staff. All of us spent the entire night nursing those pigeons back to health. They were severely dehydrated and about to die. By the time morning came, we had to figure out what to do with them. A few of us had some property to keep them in rehab until we could find suitable adoptions for all 300 plus pigeons. Mindmetoo.... don't tell me you can't do ANYTHING to help a chick you see in your teachers room. I don't buy it for one minute. Now, I'm done ranting. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 5:51 am Post subject: |
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| Lemonade wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Lemonade wrote: |
My point is this: IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! Don't just run your mouth. Talk is cheap. |
So, Professor, do you remain silent unless you can fight the appropriate battle? |
Mindmetoo, when it comes to animals, YOU BET I do. |
I didn't ask that, Professor. I asked if you applied your advice to all things that irk you? You know from motorcycles on the sidewalk to crappy weather? "Well I don't like it but I can't do anything about it so I'll just remain silent on the issue."
| Lemonade wrote: |
| Call me a drama queen |
I thought you wanted to be called Professor. But if I had my choice I think I'd call you "future cat lady".
| Lemonade wrote: |
| Well, what on earth are you going to do about it? Let it die? If you do that, you are no better than the people who sold the chick in the first place. |
Well, see, this is why I posted the original message. Since you're a mighty professor, you should have noticed I wasn't just complaining but trying to elicit information from other teachers.
| Lemonade wrote: |
| Mindmetoo.... don't tell me you can't do ANYTHING to help a chick you see in your teachers room. I don't buy it for one minute. Now, I'm done ranting. |
I crushed its skull between some rocks. A quick death versus a slow death I felt was the humane thing to do. |
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Lemonade
Joined: 04 Jan 2006
Location: South Korea
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 6:41 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
I crushed its skull between some rocks. A quick death versus a slow death I felt was the humane thing to do. |
TROLL!!! |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri May 19, 2006 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Lemonade wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
I crushed its skull between some rocks. A quick death versus a slow death I felt was the humane thing to do. |
TROLL!!! |
Like I'm going to raise a chicken in an officetel? |
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Sat May 20, 2006 5:33 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Lemonade wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
I crushed its skull between some rocks. A quick death versus a slow death I felt was the humane thing to do. |
TROLL!!! |
Like I'm going to raise a chicken in an officetel? |
I assume this is a sick joke. Just when you think the level of taste on these boards can't get any worse ... |
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Sat May 20, 2006 5:41 am Post subject: |
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| pegpig wrote: |
"Death by drowning, suffocation by piling chicks in disposable containers, chloroform, ether, cyanide, thermal exhaustion, or any other method resulting in inhumane death are not acceptable."
These are unacceptable and you'll notice that one of the linked photos that you provided (dying/dead chicks in the dumpster) is not mentioned as an acceptable means of disposal. I read the entire section 1.5 and nowhere does it mention grinding up live chicks as the recommended method of disposal. This is really starting to make me hungry. |
I can't open up the PDF on this computer, but it definitely does state that grinding chicks up alive in a "macerator" is acceptable and "humane." The other methods aren't sanctioned, but if they weren't happening anywhere then I assume there would be no reason for the code to mention them ... would there?
Last edited by red dog on Sat May 20, 2006 6:11 am; edited 1 time in total |
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red dog
Joined: 31 Oct 2004
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| Posted: Sat May 20, 2006 6:09 am Post subject: |
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| Lemonade wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Lemonade wrote: |
My point is this: IF YOU DON'T LIKE SOMETHING DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT!!! Don't just run your mouth. Talk is cheap. |
So, Professor, do you remain silent unless you can fight the appropriate battle? |
Mindmetoo, when it comes to animals, YOU BET I do. If I can help, I am there in a heartbeat. I was there at the Hegins pigeon shoot rescuing pigeons amongst the KKK, Ted Nugent fans and Nazis pointing guns everywhere saying the most inflamatory things I have ever heard in my life. They didn't stop short of beating up women who were there to rescue the birds. I was on CNN with blood all over my shirt. Call me a drama queen, I really don't care. I know what I experienced. What bothered me the most were the PETA people (stupid people) who promised to be there who managed to show up when the shoot was almost over and without Ingrid or any leader whatsoever. Did they bother to HELP? oh Hell no. They just stood around watching, acting stupid and got in our way of the rescue.
The whole shoot is no longer running anymore, not because of PETA's efforts, but because of people who came from around the world to be real true dedicated activitists - people who actually do something other than run their mouths and protest. It stopped because of the dedicated people who DID SOMETHING other than run their mouths. A LOT of us even went to jail. I certainly came close for crossing a line to rescue a pigeon. FYI, it was well away from the shooting range and by no means did I put my life in danger.
As for the chicks you see, I suggest you do whatever you can to help them. You said you have some in your class? Well, what on earth are you going to do about it? Let it die? If you do that, you are no better than the people who sold the chick in the first place.
At the end of the Hegins Labor Day shoot, there were hundreds left in crates. They were for sale. PETA people told us not to buy them. I helped negotiate a price and we bought about 300 of them. We had several veterinarians on staff. All of us spent the entire night nursing those pigeons back to health. They were severely dehydrated and about to die. By the time morning came, we had to figure out what to do with them. A few of us had some property to keep them in rehab until we could find suitable adoptions for all 300 plus pigeons. Mindmetoo.... don't tell me you can't do ANYTHING to help a chick you see in your teachers room. I don't buy it for one minute. Now, I'm done ranting. |
It's really great that you helped save those birds, Lemonade. I didn't mean to belittle your efforts in any way and I'd certainly like to become more active for the animals once I get back on my feet again ... after all the setbacks and frustrations I've experienced recently. I'd also like to see more (intelligent) discussion of these issues at Dave's, so that we (I mean the animal people among us) can figure out how to channel our energies as productively as possible. Sometimes it's hard to know which efforts are worth supporting, but I strongly believe that the creation of a vegan world needs to be our top priority. We have a long way to go, and many brilliant and dedicated people have failed to make much progress in this area, so it would be arrogant to suppose that I can succeed where they've all failed. Serious discussion (as opposed to the sort of idiotic humour we've seen lately) seems like a good place to start. |
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