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hermes.trismegistus
Joined: 08 Sep 2005
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 Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| A web page that uses a picture of Darth Vader. Wow they really want people to take them seriously. |
Horay for intellectual laziness:
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| Although safety testing of natural products, including soy products, is not required, the possibility that widely consumed soy products may cause harm in the human population via either or both estrogenic and goitrogenic activities is of concern. (NCBI) |
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Soy-containing foods and dietary supplements are widely consumed for putative health benefits (e.g. cancer chemoprevention, beneficial effects on serum lipids associated with cardiovascular health, reduction of osteoporosis, relief of menopausal symptoms). However,
studies of soy isoflavones in experimental animals suggest possible adverse effects as well (e.g. enhancement of reproductive organ cancer, modulation of endocrine function, anti-thyroid effects). This paper reviews the evidence in humans and animals for anti-thyroid effects of soy and its principal isoflavones, genistein and daidzein. (link) |
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Thus, oxidative metabolism appears to be common among isoflavones and may have implications for their biological activities. As genistein but not daidzein exhibits clastogenic activity in cultured mammalian cells, the role of oxidative metabolism for the genotoxicity of
isoflavones is of particular interest. (link) |
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The estrogenic soy isoflavone, genistein, stimulates growth of estrogen-dependent human breast cancer (MCF-7) cells in vivo. Genistin is the glycoside form of genistein and the predominant form found in plants. It is generally believed that genistin is metabolized to the aglycone genistein in the lower gut. However, it is unclear if the rate of metabolism of genistin to genistein is sufficient to produce a level of genistein capable of stimulating estrogen-dependent breast cancer cell growth. Our hypothesis was that dietary genistin would stimulate tumor growth similar to that observed with genistein in athymic mice. To test this hypothesis, genistin or genistein was fed to athymic mice containing xenografted
estrogen-dependent breast tumors (MCF-7). Mice were fed either genistein at 750 p.p.m. (parts per milllion) or genistin at 1200 p.p.m., which provides equal molar concentrations of aglycone equivalents in both diets. Tumor size was measured weekly for 11 weeks. At completion of the study, half of the animals per treatment group were killed and tumors
collected for evaluation of cellular proliferation and estrogen-responsive pS2 gene expression. Incorporation of bromo-deoxyuridine into cellular DNA was utilized as an indicator of cellular proliferation. Dietary genistin resulted in increased tumor growth, pS2 expression and cellular proliferation similar to that observed with genistein. The remaining mice were switched to diets free of genistin and genistein. When mice were placed on isoflavone free diets, tumors regressed over a span of 9 weeks. Next, we examined how effectively and where metabolism of genistin to genistein occurred in the digestive tract. We present evidence that demonstrates conversion of genistin to its aglycone form genistein
begins in the mouth and then continues in the small intestine. Both human saliva and the intestinal cell-free extract from mice converted genistin to genistein. In summary, the glycoside genistin, like the aglycone genistein, can stimulate estrogen-dependent breast cancer cell growth in vivo. Removal of genistin or genistein from the diet caused tumors to regress. (link) |
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| We found that dietary phytoestrogens: significantly decrease body and prostate weights, do not alter brain aromatase levels and significantly change during adulthood the structure of the sexually dimorphic brain region (i.e. anteroventral periventricular nucleus; AVPV) in male, but not in female rats. Since most commercial animal diets contain significant concentrations of phytoestrogens their influence on brain structure should be considered. (link) |
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BACKGROUND: This study has addressed concerns about possible effects of feeding human infants soy formula milk (SFM).
METHODS: This is a feeding study in marmosets, using a mainly co-twin design. From 4-5 until 35-45 days of age, co-twin males were fed by hand
with either standard (cow) formula milk (SMA = controls) or with SFM for approximately 8 h each day (2 h at weekends) and intake related to bodyweight. Blood samples were collected at 18-20 and at 35-45 days of age in 13 sets of co-twins plus two non-twin males per group and, at the later age, seven sets of co-twins were killed and the testes and pituitary gland fixed for cell counts.
RESULTS: Weight gain and formula intake were similar in both feeding groups. SMA-fed males had mean testosterone levels of 2.8-3.1 ng/ml, typical of the "neonatal testosterone rise", whereas SFM-fed males exhibited consistently lower mean levels (1.2-2.6 ng/ml); paired comparison in SMA-and SFM-fed co-twins at day 35-45 revealed
53-70% lower levels in 11 of 13 co-twins fed with SFM (P = 0.004). Further evidence for suppression of testosterone levels in SFM-fed males came from comparison of the frequency of low testosterone levels (<0.5 ng/ml). In historical controls aged 35-45 days, two out of 22 values were <0.5 ng/ml, a similar frequency as found in control SMA-fed males (one out of
15 values <0.5 ng/ml). In contrast, 12 out of 15 values for SFM-fed males were <0.5 ng/ml (P < 0.001). There was no consistent relationship between SFM intake/g and testosterone levels. Paradoxically, the mean number of Leydig cells per testis was increased by 74% (P < 0.001) in co-twins fed SFM, when compared with their SMA-fed brothers, whereas no
significant changes were found in numbers of Sertoli and germ cells. Because of the lack of gonadotrophin assays, the number of immunopositive LHbeta and FSHbeta cells in the pituitary gland, and their ratio, were determined but no consistent difference was found between SMA- and SFM-fed twins.
CONCLUSIONS: Based on the average isoflavone content of the SFM brand used, intake of isoflavones was estimated at 1.6-3.5 mg/kg/day in the
SFM-fed marmosets which is 40-87% of that reported in 4 month human infants fed on a 100% SFM diet. It is therefore considered likely that similar, or larger, effects to those shown here in marmosets may occur in human male infants fed with SFM. Whether the changes described result in longer-term effects is under investigation. (link) |
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| Critically, dietary genistein at concentrations that produced serum genistein levels substantially less than those in soy-fed infants produced marked thymic atrophy. These results raise the possibility that serum genistein concentrations found in soy-fed infants may be capable of producing thymic and immune abnormalities, as suggested by previous reports of immune impairments in soy-fed human infants. (link) |
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It has been suggested that dietary estrogens neutralize the effect of synthetic chemicals that mimic the effects of estrogen (i.e., xenoestrogens, environmental estrogens). Genistein, a dietary estrogen, inhibits the growth of breast cancer cells at high doses but additional
studies have suggested that at low doses, genistein stimulates proliferation of breast cancer cells. Therefore, if dietary estrogens are estrogenic at low doses, one would predict that they stimulate estrogen-receptor positive breast cancer cells to enter the cell cycle. Genistein and the fungal toxin zearalenone were found to increase the activity of cyclin dependent kinase 2 (Cdk2) and cyclin D1 synthesis and stimulate the hyperphosphorylation of the retinoblastoma susceptibility gene product pRb105 in MCF-7 cells. The steroidal antiestrogen ICI 182,780 suppressed dietary estrogen-mediated activation of Cdk2. Dietary estrogens not only failed
to suppress DDT-induced Cdk2 activity, but were found to slightly increase enzyme activity. Both zearalenone and genistein were found to stimulate the expression of a luciferase reporter gene under the control of an estrogen response element in MVLN cells. Our findings are consistent with a conclusion that dietary estrogens at low concentrations do not act as
antiestrogens, but act like DDT and estradiol to stimulate human breast cancer cells to enter the cell cycle. (link) |
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| CONCLUSIONS: Major changes in behavioural measures of anxiety and in stress hormones can result from the soya isoflavone content of rat diet. These changes are as striking as those seen following drug administration and could form an important source of variation between laboratories. (link) |
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| CONCLUSIONS: Perinatal genistein exposure results in transient and lasting alterations in masculinization of the reproductive system. These results extend our knowledge of the effects of early genistein exposure on male development and may have implications for human health in terms of potential relationships of endocrine disrupters and urogenital abnormalities thought to be increasing in incidence in boys and men. (link) |
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| These data taken together demonstrate alterations in the ovary following neonatal exposure to genistein. Given that human infants are exposed to high levels of genistein in soy-based foods, this study indicates that the effects of such exposure on the developing reproductive tract warrant further investigation. (link) |
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These results indicate that consumption of dietary phytoestrogens resulting in very high plasma isoflavone levels (in many cases over a relatively short interval of consumption in adulthood) can significantly alter sexually dimorphic brain regions, anxiety, learning and memory. The findings of these studies identify the biological actions of phytoestrogens,
specifically isoflavones and their metabolites, found in animal soy-containing diets on brain and behavior and implicate the importance of phytoestrogens given the recognized significance of estrogens in brain and neural disorders, such as Alzheimer's disease, especially in women. (link) |
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| CONCLUSION: Administration of levothyroxine concurrently with a soy protein dietary supplement results in decreased absorption of levothyroxine and the need for higher oral doses of levothyroxine to attain therapeutic serum thyroid hormone levels. (link) |
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| Insomnia was more frequent over the 6-month study in the soy group, whereas hot flushes, night sweats, and vaginal dryness improved from baseline in the placebo group but not in the soy group. |
Nope. No reason to avoid soy.
Namaste. |
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Zyzyfer
Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: who, what, where, when, why, how?
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 8:49 am Post subject: |
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| pwned? lolwtfbbxinsertthreeletteracronymsherehahwtf. |
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TheFonz
Joined: 01 Dec 2005
Location: North Georgia
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 10:55 am Post subject: |
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rteacher wrote:
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Baldness runs in my family, but my brother credits his full head of hair to never wearing a hat ...
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I hardly ever wear a hat because of this reason. If you wear hats alot it thins your hair out. Combing your hair excessively can also damage your hair. Always use a comb when your hair is wet and then use a brush when it is dry. And limit your brush strokes to less than 15. Worrying about hair loss adds to the stress that causes hair loss. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| hermes.trismegistus wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| A web page that uses a picture of Darth Vader. Wow they really want people to take them seriously. |
Horay for intellectual laziness:
Nope. No reason to avoid soy.
Namaste. |
None of those quotes sound like a bad reason to avoid soy. Bottom line: the Japanese probably consume more soy than anyone. And they have the world's longest life spans.
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| CONCLUSIONS: Perinatal genistein exposure results in transient and lasting alterations in masculinization of the reproductive system. These results extend our knowledge of the effects of early genistein exposure on male development and may have implications for human health in terms of potential relationships of endocrine disrupters and urogenital abnormalities thought to be increasing in incidence in boys and men. (link) |
I follow the link. Here's the abstract:
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| Outbred CD-1 mice were treated neonatally on Days 1-5 with the phytoestrogen, genistein (1, 10, or 100 micro g per pup per day), and ovaries were collected on Days 5, 12, and 19. Ribonuclease protection assay analysis of ovarian mRNA showed that estrogen receptor beta (ERbeta) predominated over ERalpha in controls and increased with age. Genistein treatment did not alter ERbeta expression, however, ERalpha expression was higher on Days 5 and 12. ERbeta was immunolocalized in granulosa cells, whereas ERalpha was immunolocalized in interstitial and thecal cells. Genistein treatment caused a dramatic increase in ERalpha in granulosa cells. Genistein-treated ERbeta knockout mice showed a similar induction of ERalpha, which is seen in CD-1 mice, suggesting that ERbeta does not mediate this effect. Similar ERalpha induction in granulosa cells was seen in CD-1 mice treated with lavendustin A, a tyrosine kinase inhibitor that has no known estrogenic actions, which suggests that this property of genistein may be responsible. As a functional analysis, genistein-treated mice were superovulated and the number of oocytes was counted. A statistically significant increase in the number of ovulated oocytes was observed with the lowest dose, whereas a decrease was observed with the two higher doses. This increase in ovulatory capacity with the low dose coincided with higher ERalpha expression. Histological evaluations on Day 19 revealed a dose-related increase in multioocyte follicles (MOFs) in genistein-treated mice. Tyrosine kinase inhibition was apparently not responsible for MOFs because they were not present in mice that had been treated with lavendustin; however, ERbeta must play a role, because mice lacking ERbeta showed no MOFs. These data taken together demonstrate alterations in the ovary following neonatal exposure to genistein. Given that human infants are exposed to high levels of genistein in soy-based foods, this study indicates that the effects of such exposure on the developing reproductive tract warrant further investigation. |
Lots of things that have effects in rats have no effect in humans. It's a starting point but that's all. |
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hermes.trismegistus
Joined: 08 Sep 2005
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 6:38 pm Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| None of those quotes sound like a bad reason to avoid soy. Bottom line: the Japanese probably consume more soy than anyone. And they have the world's longest life spans. |
I think you mean to say, "None of those quotes sound like a good reason to avoid soy." And to that, I'd have to laugh.
As for the Japanese, it seems obvious you don't have much experience with matters like this, so let me make it abundantly clear: modern forms of soy, especially those consumed in the West, have different bio-chemical compositions than soy consumed in the East.
In addition, soy in the East usually gets consumed in very small quantities. (Historical Use of Soy)
So really, if you'd care to chance the increased risk of several forms of cancer and the deleterious effects on the gonads, knock yourself out. Social Darwinism occasionally helps the species.
The soy industry, like the dairy (milk) industry (White Poison), was hoisted on the public as a propaganda campaign of disinformation and leads to disease and infirmity. Those who ignore the evidence do so at their own risk.
Namaste. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu May 25, 2006 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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| hermes.trismegistus wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| None of those quotes sound like a bad reason to avoid soy. Bottom line: the Japanese probably consume more soy than anyone. And they have the world's longest life spans. |
I think you mean to say, "None of those quotes sound like a good reason to avoid soy." And to that, I'd have to laugh.
As for the Japanese, it seems obvious you don't have much experience with matters like this, so let me make it abundantly clear: modern forms of soy, especially those consumed in the West, have different bio-chemical compositions than soy consumed in the East.
In addition, soy in the East usually gets consumed in very small quantities. (Historical Use of Soy)
So really, if you'd care to chance the increased risk of several forms of cancer and the deleterious effects on the gonads, knock yourself out. Social Darwinism occasionally helps the species.
The soy industry, like the dairy (milk) industry (White Poison), was hoisted on the public as a propaganda campaign of disinformation and leads to disease and infirmity. Those who ignore the evidence do so at their own risk.
Namaste. |
What's funny is you actually believe all that. |
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hermes.trismegistus
Joined: 08 Sep 2005
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| Posted: Fri May 26, 2006 8:56 am Post subject: |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| What's funny is you actually believe all that. |
I believe nothing. I don't even believe I'm sitting here typing this.
Don't project your limited perspectives on others.
I operate based on probability and don't accept premature certainty. In the case of soy and dairy, we have ample probability of negative impact to justify concern.
This, to me, seems like responsible science.
Irresponsible science, to me, would include ignoring the evidence and excessively filtering information.
But, again, feel free to take all the chances with your body that you want.
Namaste. |
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