Korean Job Discussion Forums

kingplaya4 · Joined: 14 May 2006

I would like all the right wingers who support our incarceration rates to spend about six weeks in one of our prisons. I'm sure Bill O'Reilly and Rush Limbaugh could fight off the homeboys with their aggressive opinions towards the Iraq war.

Don't give me that crap that you would never do something to get in prison, there are a lot of rich white elites in this country who are far worse criminals than many inmates, and no, not everyone in prison is guilty or deserves to be there.

I saw a video of this sixteen year old boy in Texas who had set fire to a public dumpster. He was convicted of felony arson, and for some reason put in with adults. He was white, about 5' tall and 105 pounds. After repeated rapings by gangsters, and several pleading applications to be put into protective custody which were rudely and callously denied, he hanged himself after only a few weeks in prison.

Certainly he was more vulnerable than most inmates, but his case is not particularly unusual, particularly for the unfortunate whites that are too broke to avoid prison. Now the point could be made that we need to crack down on prisoner behavior, and although that point has some merit, a lot of the problems are because of overcrowding, private prisons that are out to make money rather than rehabilitate and protect the vulnerable, and throwing tons of non-violent inmates in with rapists and murderers. (Who probably needn't be locked up at all).

I do believe our crime rate has decreased, but at what cost? Our taxes are very high relative to the social benefits we get, our debt is spiralling, and rehabilitation is not occuring. Non-violent prisoners that manage to survive their ordeal graduate prison hardened and more dangerous. Violent prisoners learn to become even more ruthless. Aids is being brought home to our communities.

I used to be one of the most patriotic people you can find, but I hate what this country has become. We need to make less decisions based on emotions and being "fed up" with this or that, and really consider what the long term implications of our decisions are.

Wangja · Joined: 17 May 2004 Location: Seoul, Yongsan

Gopher · Joined: 04 Jun 2005

Wangja · Joined: 17 May 2004 Location: Seoul, Yongsan

If that's the case - big if - then simply add the figures for the western crime of "manslaughter" to western murders, and Bob's your uncle!

Gopher · Joined: 04 Jun 2005

How about the other "if," Wangja?

Is all statistical gathering and reporting equally honest and reliable around the world, uniformly so?

Wangja · Joined: 17 May 2004 Location: Seoul, Yongsan

Well, if sourced from OECD, CIA etc, yes I think so.

bigverne · Joined: 12 May 2004

On the other hand · Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Location: I walk along the avenue

On the other hand · Joined: 19 Apr 2003 Location: I walk along the avenue

Okay, maybe I'm reading too much into this, but...

Wangja · Joined: 17 May 2004 Location: Seoul, Yongsan

rollo · Joined: 10 May 2006 Location: China

Dear Deubel

Those were some interesting statistics. But I am very interested in the home ownership statistics. The last I read on home ownership in the U.s. was 73%. I have read that in mutiple sources.

I do believe the statistics that you cite are not including those Americans who owe on their mortage. Also their is a great deal of difference in how home ownership is defined.

Not criticizing you but I am wary of those stats.

Now to the original topic. apparently many consider the number of incarcerated in the U.S. to reflect a greater malaise.

New laws called for mandatory sentences. Massive immigration mostly legal brought many attendant social problems.

Crime rate in U.S. has been decling steadily for the past ten years.

Would suggest mandatory sentencing laws. Also much , much tougher DUI laws. Since Mothers against Drunk Driving has monitors in the courtroom, judges are hesitant to give probation to a drunk driver.

These I think are the reason for the growing prison population,rather than an explosion in crime or disregard for human rights.

Also community policing policy means that cops can not ignore or overlook many petty crimes but are required to act on each incident.

I do believe that the executions in the U.S. are legal executions, I mean their is a trial. Now if you do not believe in the death penalty that is fine but why would the legal actions of another countries government be any business of citizens of another country. Very Strange! Has anone noted the increase in the number on people being prosecuted for purse snatching in Namibia.

I mean if jealous of America, you should hate the game not the player!

supernick · Joined: 24 Jan 2003 Location: Seoul

Good points Rollo.

I have also read that violent crime has decreased in the U.S. The present figures reflect more on longer sentences, prison terms for DUI and maybe better policing. Also other countries have different forms of penalities. I like how they do it in Italy; after being released from proson, you have to pau back the money it cost for the prison term.

ddeubel · Joined: 20 Jul 2005

I don't think any culture is more "criminally minded" than another. Especially given the same cultural framework and living conditions.........

I did point out a few times the curious fact that there is not more crime in the U.S. -- only that what the govt defines as "criminal" , is more "liberally" (or conservatively, what have you...) enforced and it incarcerates more people. Also, statistics point to the unassailable conclusion that "violent" crime is much more prevalent than in almost all other parts of the developed world (but my I hate that term, "developed" but I will use it....the tyranny of language!). See the comparison of the two graphs I posted previously.............

rollo · Joined: 10 May 2006 Location: China

Ddeuebl

Great post. Wish others took as much time and thought out as carefully what they write as you do.

Capital punishment is a tough one. I understand the objectin to it. But the majority of the American people are for it. As long as it is done in a fair and transparent manner , it is the will of a democratic society.

Try checking the background of T.Kummar of Amenesty International!

I do not wish to debate the morality of capital punishment. But this is a choice of a people, not of a government. Democracy is not always the action of the wisest.

I merely wante to point out that the high rate of imprisonment in the U.s. was not due to an increase in crime nor a facist takeover of the justice system but was due to some systemic causes. Some of which are welcome. Such as tougher DUI sentences and tougher sentences for guns.