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flakfizer
Joined: 12 Nov 2004
Location: scaling the Cliffs of Insanity with a frayed rope.
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 Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 1:38 am Post subject: |
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| SuperHero wrote: |
| tiger fancini wrote: |
| Why is being proud of your country and culture evil? |
Why is it good? what is there to be proud of with regards to the country you were born in? It's just a matter of luck.
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If that is the case, I'm not one can be proud of anything. Can't be proud of your looks or your brains, right? All you have by nature is clearly luck. All you have by nurture is pretty much luck too because you didn't choose or earn your parents or where and how you were raised. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 1:50 am Post subject: |
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What I don't understand about people who seem to very proud of where they're from is the connection between themselves and the achievements of their country.
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Oh please, just cease and desist right now. In my great-grandfather's time, Thomas Edison did some really remarkably creative thinking. How does this not reflect on my character and quality as a person now? You are just being obtuse. |
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Billy Pilgrim
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:14 am Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
I hate nationalism. 
Its just another thing that divides people. Makes one person think they're superior because they happened to be born in a random geographical area. |
Indeed. And it works in another way as well; thinking of an entire group of people as inferior because of the country in which they are born. There is no doubt that Korea has its share of idiots, racists, whiners, complainers and so on, but it is depressing to see how many posters on this board delight in casting their net of disapproval over the whole country.
What exactly is the difference? Some Koreans are inordinately proud of what their countrymen have acheived (ie the printing press, Hangeul etc) to the point of obsession, but just as many posters here seem to take as much delight in their failures, when in both situations they are the product of one or a small subset of Koreans.
There's a big difference between saying (for example) the Italian soccer team are a bunch of whining, cheating jerks (true) and Italians are a bunch of whining, cheating jerks (inflammatory and untrue for the great majority).
I have been in quite a few World Cup threads defending the charges being laid against the entire country of Korea based on a subset of supporters for two reasons: 1. it is only a subset of whiners and fools kicking up a fuss and 2. I see absolutely nothing wrong with a large group of people cheering on a smaller group of people THAT HAVE BEEN SELECTED AS THE BEST AT WHAT THEY DO FROM THAT LARGER GROUP in a simple game. That so many people got so worked up with those Korean supporters who decided to support their team is still mind boggling; it may be symptomatic of a mindset towards blind, harmful nationalism, but IN AND OF ITS SELF it is harmless, natural, and done in the best of spirits.
By targeting the whole of Korea for the World Cup fallout, many foreigners are being just as nationalistic. |
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Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 2:52 am Post subject: |
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| Billy Pilgrim wrote: |
What exactly is the difference? Some Koreans are inordinately proud of what their countrymen have acheived (ie the printing press, Hangeul etc) to the point of obsession. |
The problem with koreans is that they have projected their historically justified mistrust of Japan and China, onto every other nationality on the planet. Hate the Japanese if you must, but don't see every foreigner from the four corners of the earth as a threat too. |
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Billy Pilgrim
Joined: 08 Sep 2004
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:03 am Post subject: |
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| Junior wrote: |
| Billy Pilgrim wrote: |
What exactly is the difference? Some Koreans are inordinately proud of what their countrymen have acheived (ie the printing press, Hangeul etc) to the point of obsession. |
The problem with koreans is that they have projected their historically justified mistrust of Japan and China, onto every other nationality on the planet. Hate the Japanese if you must, but don't see every foreigner from the four corners of the earth as a threat too. |
Not sure why you quoted my post for your comment, seeing as there is next to no relationship between the two.
I agree with you, by the way, for some Koreans (and the media). |
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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:37 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperHero wrote: |
| tiger fancini wrote: |
| If all 'nationalists' were locked up forever, what kind of world can you imagine this being? |
A better world
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This sounds like another 'ism' that I could think of..... At first I thought it might have been an 'asm', but it sure sounds like an 'ism' to me! |
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tiger fancini
Joined: 21 Mar 2006
Location: Testicles for Eyes
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| SuperHero wrote: |
| tiger fancini wrote: |
| Why is being proud of your country and culture evil? |
Why is it good? what is there to be proud of with regards to the country you were born in? It's just a matter of luck. |
Whether its luck or not, I think you'll find that the majority of people in the world are proud of their country and culture, and will defend it in any occassion. I would also hazard a guess that most of these people are peace-loving, tolerant people who are open to learning about and appreciating other cultures too. I really don't understand where the 'evil-ness' comes from, unless you're referring to what I feel is a very small minority.
| SuperHero wrote: |
| tiger fancini wrote: |
| Would there be regional and naional food dishes? Would countries have names? |
Yes. Why wouldn't there be different regional or national food dishes that has little to do with nationalism. |
But by your logic, surely people would be 'proud' of their national food dishes? (well, maybe not us English!  ) They may even go on to believe that their national food dishes are somehow better than other countries national dishes. Fascists!! |
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doggyji
Joined: 21 Feb 2006
Location: Toronto - Hamilton - Vineland - St. Catherines
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| Posted: Thu Jun 29, 2006 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Billy Pilgrim wrote: |
| Junior wrote: |
I hate nationalism.
Its just another thing that divides people. Makes one person think they're superior because they happened to be born in a random geographical area. |
Indeed. And it works in another way as well; thinking of an entire group of people as inferior because of the country in which they are born. There is no doubt that Korea has its share of idiots, racists, whiners, complainers and so on, but it is depressing to see how many posters on this board delight in casting their net of disapproval over the whole country.
What exactly is the difference? Some Koreans are inordinately proud of what their countrymen have acheived (ie the printing press, Hangeul etc) to the point of obsession, but just as many posters here seem to take as much delight in their failures, when in both situations they are the product of one or a small subset of Koreans.
There's a big difference between saying (for example) the Italian soccer team are a bunch of whining, cheating jerks (true) and Italians are a bunch of whining, cheating jerks (inflammatory and untrue for the great majority).
I have been in quite a few World Cup threads defending the charges being laid against the entire country of Korea based on a subset of supporters for two reasons: 1. it is only a subset of whiners and fools kicking up a fuss and 2. I see absolutely nothing wrong with a large group of people cheering on a smaller group of people THAT HAVE BEEN SELECTED AS THE BEST AT WHAT THEY DO FROM THAT LARGER GROUP in a simple game. That so many people got so worked up with those Korean supporters who decided to support their team is still mind boggling; it may be symptomatic of a mindset towards blind, harmful nationalism, but IN AND OF ITS SELF it is harmless, natural, and done in the best of spirits.
By targeting the whole of Korea for the World Cup fallout, many foreigners are being just as nationalistic. |
Yeah, how about this picture? I think in Korea, regarding many issues, pros and cons are often very fiercely clashed. It's like 20% of Koreans on this side argue hard with another 20% of Koreans on the other side. And often you will get to see the doings mostly from one side. That's the nature. Doing is seen and not-doing goes unseen.  Then some uncalled people show up and generalize all Koreans with a single touch of brush saying "oh look at these stupid Koreans.. Koreans are blah blah..." Sometimes I think Korea is just so small in size that it let people make generalizations too easy without enough consideration. |
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