Korean Job Discussion Forums

Sofa_King · Joined: 03 Mar 2005 Location: South Korea

I have a grammar question that was asked by one of my co-workers that I can't figure out. He came to me with these two sentences and asked me which one is correct.

I want to tell you that the day will surely come when your dream is realized.

I want to tell you that the day will surely come when your dream will be realized.

Which one is correct? It seems to me that both can be correct depending on the context before this sentence. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

tek75 · Joined: 15 Jun 2006

I'll take a stab at it. Although both are probably acceptable in colloquial English, it seems that the first sentence is the one that is grammatically correct.

I think it's because the future tense marked by the word "will" carries over to the subsequent clause. Therefore, the second "will" in the second sentence is redundant.

Let's look at another pair of sentences. 1) I will tell you when I find out. 2) I will tell you when I will find out. Again, the second "will" in the second sentence is completely redundant.

Anyhow, that's my theory.

poet13 · Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:19 pm Post subject:

I agree with the first sentence. I think the second "will" is redundant.

but...

and I may just be muddying the water here....or just plain wrong 9please tell me if I am, but...
doesnt this, "I will tell you when I will find out.", mean that at at some point in the future you will learn when something is going to happen at another point further in the future?
ah...example....
Person A "I will tell you when I will find out."

one week passes....
Person A "Hey, I heard the test results will be out next week."

So doesnt that mean that person A is informing someone of when they will know something? It's an awkward way to say it, but is it technically correct?

Fredbob · Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:24 pm Post subject:

I want to tell you that the day will surely come when your dream is realized.
A day will come when the event of your realization is in the past.
Time focus, the feeling just after the realization is complete.

I want to tell you that the day will surely come when your dream will be realized.
A day will come and on the day you will realize the dream.
Time focus, the sensation of the process of realization.

Really splitting hairs and even in written English either would be fine but the second one focuses on the feelings associated with the process, the first focuses on the feeling associated with have completed the process.

In other words,
The first focuses on the feelings related to the accomplishment of the task, the second on the task itself and the feeling associated with its undertaking.

refikaM · Joined: 06 May 2006 Location: Gangwondo

In standard correct English, "will" is not used in a time clause. The future tense is used only in the main clause of the sentence. If you teach your students to use "will" in a time clause, you are teaching them incorrect English. Check any grammar reference book and this should be explained.

Woland · Joined: 10 May 2006 Location: Seoul

refikaM · Joined: 06 May 2006 Location: Gangwondo

I'm sorry, but both of the OP's sentences are NOT grammatically correct. In a future sentence with a time (adverb) clause, the main clause is in the future (with will or any other form of the future), and the time clause is in the simple present (or as in the OP's sentence simple passive).For example, it's not correct to say:

When I will get home, I will make dinner. OR
I will call you after I will get home. OR
Before they will leave for vacation, the students will be given a quiz.

The grammatically correct structures are:

I will call you after I get home.
When I get home, I will make dinner.
Before they leave for vacation, the students will be given a quiz.

This is pretty basic grammar and is clearly explained in any proper grammar reference book. Any ESL teacher with substanial experience teaching students who need to know correct English for passing standardized English exams (or who has substantial experience teaching academic English) like the TOEFL can corroborate this simple rule. Is there anyone out there who can back me up?!

Hope this helps......

Woland · Joined: 10 May 2006 Location: Seoul

Woland · Joined: 10 May 2006 Location: Seoul

I checked in my office tonight.

'When' in the OP's sentences is functioning as an adverbial relativizer, which should be obvious when we see that we can move the 'when'-clause to a position immediately following the initial noun phrase:

The day when your dream will be realized will come.

There is no restriction on the use of 'will' in relative clauses, which helps explain why both of the OP's sentences are grammatical. I'm not sure what restrictions hold on extrapositioning of relative clauses overall, but I'm sure that it is motivated by information structure where it is possible, like here.

None of this says anything about the aspect/modality difference of the OP's sentences, which is where the real issue is.