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pocketfluff
Joined: 30 May 2006
Location: Washington, DC (school) and Los Angeles, CA (home)
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 Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Equal does not mean 'the same'. That is all. |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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| tzechuk wrote: |
But while we sit here openly discuss this issue, Korean women and men avoid talking about it.
Even childbirth is embarrassing for some older Korean women!!!! Men in the delivery room? In your dreams!
Sure, in the West, we would get medical help but women here won't because they just don't like to go to the doctor's for this reason. They take over the counter medicine and wait for it to go away.
I suspect the reason why the government has made this a special holiday for women without so much as to need a note from your doctor's is not just to save the women from having to tell their (often) male senior, but also to save the men from having to be told about it directly. So they know, at the back of their minds, why the women are taking a day off, but they wouldn't want to have to discuss or even get told about it. |
WHile I can see what you are saying, still doesn't make it right  |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:16 pm Post subject: |
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My wife is always bedridden for a couple days due to her menstruation. She's been known to faint in public in the past because of it. I think there are enough women with serious menstruation problems that these menstruation leaves are necessary, at least for some.
A better idea would be finding a cure, because I've never heard of these sorts of things happening in other countries. |
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Captain Corea
Joined: 28 Feb 2005
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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But don't you know, according to some here your wife cannot pull her own weight as a worker! 
Some people really don't have a clue. |
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pocketfluff
Joined: 30 May 2006
Location: Washington, DC (school) and Los Angeles, CA (home)
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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| RACETRAITOR wrote: |
My wife is always bedridden for a couple days due to her menstruation. She's been known to faint in public in the past because of it. I think there are enough women with serious menstruation problems that these menstruation leaves are necessary, at least for some.
A better idea would be finding a cure, because I've never heard of these sorts of things happening in other countries. |
I'm sorry to hear your wife has to suffer so much.
May I ask you (and all other women who have debilitating menstrual symptoms) why she doesn't take birth control? It's known to reduce or eliminate periods, which would be a huge relief as well as a health benefit (reduce iron loss). |
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jmbran11
Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
But don't you know, according to some here your wife cannot pull her own weight as a worker!
Some people really don't have a clue. |
 And some people actually take pride in their work, which means, oh my god, actually showing up every day for a start. What a brute I am!
Last edited by jmbran11 on Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:26 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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jmbran11
Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:29 pm Post subject: |
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| Captain Corea wrote: |
If I am given "X" task and complete it in the assigned time, does it really matter if I have that extra day off or not?
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Have you every worked anywhere that would permit this? Just not showing up because you figure you've done enough work for the week? Let me rephrase, have you worked anywhere that would allow a man to do this?
My point is that Korean men (most of the senior level executives) will never see Korean women employees as deserving of the same promotions and work possibilities if they are still under the notion that they are incapacitated monthly. |
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Real Reality
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Location: Seoul
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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Have you addressed this topic, menstrual illness cited in shoplifting, yet?
Menstrual illness cited in shoplifting
The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that cases of theft committed by women who feel compelled to steal during their menstrual periods should be considered special cases caused by mental disorders.
by Park Jai-hyun, JoongAng Ilbo (June 07, 2002)
http://joongangdaily.joins.com/200206/07/200206070045040469900090409041.html
Here is a bonus article excerpt for you to consider.
Menstruation Is Fast Becoming Optional
For young women with a world of choices, even that monthly curse, the menstrual period, is optional.
Thanks to birth control pills and other hormonal contraceptives, a growing number of women are taking the path chosen by 22-year-old Stephanie Sardinha. She hasn't had a period since she was 17. "It's really one of the best things I've ever done," she says.
A college student and retail worker in Lisbon Falls, Maine, Sardinha uses Nuvaring, a vaginal contraceptive ring. After the hormones run out in three weeks, she replaces the ring right away instead of following instructions to leave the ring out for a week to allow bleeding. She says it has been great for her marriage, preventing monthly crankiness and improving her sex life. "I would never go back," said Sardinha, who got the idea from her aunt, a nurse practitioner.
By Linda A. Johnson, Associated Press Writer (May 21, 2006)
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=1987155
Canadian women close to a life without menstruation
globeandmail.com
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20060624.wperiods0624/BNStory/specialScienceandHealth/home |
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kiwiliz
Joined: 20 Apr 2006
Location: New Zealand
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:36 pm Post subject: |
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I have mixed feelings on this. Whilst I would not like to see Menstrual leave spread throughout the world I wonder if maybe someone thought it was a respectful thing to introduce..a way of saying hey, we know you woman go through some horrible stuff being a woman.
But hey, the potential for abuse! those woman who have pain so bad they need time off, or have other issues at this time, are actually in the minority.
Could this be PC gone mad? |
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death from above
Joined: 31 Jul 2005
Location: in your head
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:40 pm Post subject: |
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having a medical condition is one thing.. but the implication of this law is that women are fragile little creatures that need to coddled..
um, they're not. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| jmbran11 wrote: |
| Captain Corea wrote: |
But don't you know, according to some here your wife cannot pull her own weight as a worker!
Some people really don't have a clue. |
And some people actually take pride in their work, which means, oh my god, actually showing up every day. What a brute I am! |
So for you, simply showing up is a sign of pride in your work? I mean, hell who cares how well you work, just show up. Right? You are a moron. if someone is physically too ill to work how is showing up for work a sign of pride, and conversely, how is not showing up a sign of lack of pride? get a clue idiot. |
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jmbran11
Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:01 pm Post subject: |
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| jinju wrote: |
So for you, simply showing up is a sign of pride in your work? I mean, hell who cares how well you work, just show up. Right? You are a moron. if someone is physically too ill to work how is showing up for work a sign of pride, and conversely, how is not showing up a sign of lack of pride? get a clue idiot. |
Do we have to resort to name-calling every time someone disagrees with your opinion? I didn't say showing up is enough, I said doing a good job requires actually being at work, for a start. I do take pride in my work, so I wouldn't stick my colleagues with my responsibilities because I don't feel well. Every woman who is menstrating is not "too physically to ill to work." I work for a large company, and when another instructor is absent, it is a problem. Your colleagues have to cover for you, double their load, and it is a big pain for them. In fact, I have to go prep right now for a class I'm not prepared to teach because another instructor is absent.
I'm not a moron or an idiot. If you can do your job well without even going to work, then kudos to you. You have a very sweet deal.
Last edited by jmbran11 on Thu Jul 06, 2006 3:27 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:05 pm Post subject: |
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| jmbran11 wrote: |
| jinju wrote: |
So for you, simply showing up is a sign of pride in your work? I mean, hell who cares how well you work, just show up. Right? You are a moron. if someone is physically too ill to work how is showing up for work a sign of pride, and conversely, how is not showing up a sign of lack of pride? get a clue idiot. |
Do we have to resort to name-calling every time someone disagrees with your opinion? I didn't say showing up is enough, I said doing a good job requires actually being at work, for a start. I do take pride in my work, so I wouldn't stick my colleagues with my responsibilities because I don't feel well. Every woman who is menstrating is not "physically to ill to work." I work for a large company, and when another instructor is absent, it is a problem. Your colleagues have to cover for you, double their load, and it is a big pain for them.
I'm not a moron or an idiot. If you can do your job well without even going to work, then kudos to you. You have a very sweet deal. |
One doesnt need to be at work to do work. Infact other than jobs like teaching or physical work, where one physically HAS to be there, many jobs simply dont require you to be at work physically to do work. Office work can be completed at home. My father works partly out of his office but mostly out of his office at home, and he works for a large company akin to a chaebol or a multinational here in Korea. So simply put, you havent got a clue. |
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periwinkle
Joined: 08 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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| laogaiguk wrote: |
| It's setting back the woman's movement, which it really doesn't need. There are still so many areas it needs to advance, not go back. If people with ADHD or much worse can work fine in the world, then there is no need for this. If it IS really bad, they should go to a doctor, get a note and get a leave of absence (paid) for it. This should not be open to just anyone. |
I work with a guy that has Parkinson's (or is it Lou Gehrig's? Anyway, he has almost no mobility  ). He can barely move until his meds kick in. Unfortunately, they work for only a few hours, and then he's back in his wheelchair again. He even needs someone to take him to the toilet. He NEVER, EVER calls in sick. Behavior to aspire to, if you ask me (hey, if you need sick days, take them, but this man really, really impresses me- really nice guy, too).
I think if you do have a severe condition like endometriosis, you should be excused with sick leave (it IS legal to call in sick. It's illegal to disallow it...). Also, are you only allowed 1 day for mentrual leave? As some posters have mentioned, some people are bedridden or experience pain for several days, so giving 1 day off a month is moot, IMO.
I wonder how this law was passed, and the reasoning behind it. There are some Arabic countries that dictate that women are to be confined to their homes while they menstruate, as they are "dirty" during that time.  I doubt this is the reasoning, but I wonder if there is some kind of cultural reason for it, like Tzechuk mentioned.
Tzechuk, what's up with the older generation? I had no idea they would have been horrified to have their husband in the room. They didn't want their dainty image destroyed, perhaps?? 
Funny- Koreans seem pretty open about bodily functions to me. I met this girl a couple of weeks ago, and a few minutes into our conversation, she told me she had problems with constipation... 
Last edited by periwinkle on Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:33 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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jmbran11
Joined: 19 Jan 2006
Location: U.S.
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 10:21 pm Post subject: |
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| jinju wrote: |
| One doesnt need to be at work to do work. Infact other than jobs like teaching or physical work, where one physically HAS to be there, many jobs simply dont require you to be at work physically to do work. Office work can be completed at home. My father works partly out of his office but mostly out of his office at home, and he works for a large company akin to a chaebol or a multinational here in Korea. So simply put, you havent got a clue. |
If you have a job where you don't need to "physically" be at work, then this policy doesn't apply to you. It applies to people who generally do have to be present at work to do their work but are excused monthly because they are female. Make your point, share your opinion, but you don't have to insult me.
And, this is a teacher's forum, so most of us do physically have to be at work. Can you really justify expecting the males to cover for their female counterparts every month? I can't (unless males also get a day off each month).
Everyone has to work on days when we would prefer to stay in bed, when we are sick, when we are hungover, when we have emotional issues. That's part of the professional world. Periwinkle is right, actual illness is one thing, but assuming all females are ill because they are female sets the equal rights movement back 100 years. |
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