Korean Job Discussion Forums

[dodgybarnet]

First off can I just say that those of you who do post on these "is this contract dodgy?" threads are simply amazing. I've read through many of them in the 3 years I've lurked on Daves and learnt loads from them. With that in mind I think I've found a contract that is basicly, well, okay.

Maybe I'm missing something though, so if anyone has any thoughts I'd appreciate hearing them.

Note: The contract was sent to me as a semi-protected PDF so I had to cut it up into images. I've blacked out the schools name where it appears, although if you're interested it is a chain school teaching adults (not YBM though, who in their right mind would work somewhere that doesn't offer housing??).

Anyhow:



Well 1a is certainly refreshing! A good sign.

2a to 2d sound like the usual bluster. i.e be a good teacher and bring some extra material with you if you like to make the classes more interesting. Not a problem as I've got good material.

2e is, according to a teacher that works there, not an issue. Teacher meetings occur maybe once every 3 months, and the owner does the usual "be good teacher" "make student happy" stuff.



Fine.



I'm totally cool with split shifts - Siesta when you get home, and you have all day to do stuff. Makes me so productive and splits up the workload.

50 minutes class = 60 mins teaching then = excellent.

120 hours is fine, although it doesn't mention the OT rate for 120 to 150 hours. They told me it's 16,000 per hour which is pretty cack, so I'll try to get that raised, then the amount stated here in the contract.

Working Saturdays: According to them, and the teacher I spoke to in private, this never happens, so I'm gonna get it removed. No, I'm gonna get it to say NO WEEKENDS.

Negotiating salary at the moment. I know the "paid on 15th" thing sucks, but this is a big company so A) they wont change accounting for me, and B) as it's a big company I know, well am pretty sure, that I will get paid, which is the important thing.



5c - pay tax at home? La-La-La-La-La-La-La-La-La...

5d - Fine. I know that for our pay level, Pension can be less than 9%, but personally I cant be arsed mucking about with this one. What, get 8.75% instead? I'll let that one go I think.



Fine.



Not an issue - gonna live at my girlfriends place so taking the allowance.



Again, gonna get this removed as I'm gonna live elsewhere. 300,000 is a bit low (got 400,000 at last job) but feeling that I'll let this slide. Maybe.



Full of legalese but sounds about right, right? English translation is "you get half your airfare now, half at the end, if you leave early you pay it all back"

Doesn't mention paying for Visa run. Gotta have that put in.



6 weeks? Oh well, again big company = gonna get paid and can�t change accounting just for me.



Fine. According to them the random day of in a month can be any day of the week though. At my last place it was always a monday. Bummer.



R-E-S-P-E-C-T
Find out what it means to me
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
Take care, TCB
Oh sock it to me, sock it to me, sock it to me, sock it to me...



a) no jay walking then!
b) takes all the fun out of it
c) got 3 alarms
d) gotta turn up
e) gotta turn up
f) public morals? The have them here?
g) no nailing the students
h) no itaewon shenanigans
i) no burning the school to the ground
j) you no be disrespecting yo boss man



Bugger me if this doesn't sound like a real western contract!



Human rights!



Nice and legal.



Sure.



Nice and friendly.



In writing no less.



Now that's a golden thing to have in a contract!



18a � If the North invades I don�t have to teach! If I die I don�t have to teach!



Not an issue, going back home to get married (October 2007 � yay!)



Keep this contract confidential? Woops. Oh well, as I haven't signed it yet that cant stand!

- - - - - - -

So if anyone has anything to add, I�d be happy to hear it!

[soviet_man]

It sort of looks like a standard "YES Youngdo English School" contract with a few minor things changed. Am I right?

I'm assuming therefore your pay would be somewhere around 2.2 - 2.4 although the overtime (at 16,000w) is certainly lower than usual.

The 3 other things which are different from the standard YES Youngdo contract (and it seems almost word-for-word that is what it is) would be that this contract is unusually silent or vague about:

* having your classes observed

* mandatory preparation/arrival time (and if your first class is at 6.30am - this would be a big issue).

* attendance at compulsory staff meetings.


Overall, I think it is better than any YBM contract (if you had your heart set on teaching adults) but also worse than the contracts being offered for YES Youngdo kids hagwons. So I would generally be leaning against signing it.

[dodgybarnet]

It sort of looks like a standard "YES Youngdo English School" contract with a few minor things changed. Am I right?

Close, but no cigar. It's someone else, although I'm against naming them as the Mods don't like it, and nor would my propective school I'd say.

I'm assuming therefore your pay would be somewhere around 2.2 - 2.4 although the overtime (at 16,000w) is certainly lower than usual.

I'm asking for 2.2 although they are umming and erring about it. The standard was 2 mil but that sounds low considering I have experience and a basic TEFL.

for OT, 16,000 is low, and I'm in negotiations with them over this. Generally though, why would you bother with OT at even 25,000, when you can get a private for like 45,000?? (ranting about the naughtiness of Privates is covered in other threads BTW).

* having your classes observed

Observed classes? Never heard of this before. If they want to watch then they can. I'm good, and I make students laugh. No worries.

* mandatory preparation/arrival time (and if your first class is at 6.30am - this would be a big issue).

I asked a teacher privately and she said no worries, turn up just before class, teach it, then bugger off. I'm hessitant to push this into writing on a contract though, as it makes me sound like a slacker (okay I AM a slacker).

* attendance at compulsory staff meetings.

says so in part 2e, and the teacher said that it's like every 3 months for an hour. Personally I would love them as my old school never had anywhere to raise ideas about improving the school.

So I would generally be leaning against signing it.

Really? I thought it wasnt so bad really. Sure the OT is low, but it has no obvious "we'll screw you the moment you start" open clauses.

Thanks for your input though soviet_man, much apprecited. I free vodka shot for you at the next Daves Seoul Pissup.

[jacl]

Overtime paid for hours over 150 per month?

This contract is crappy.

[hellofaniceguy]

How can anyone teach 150 classes a month and do a decent job? Even if you are paid for them....it is stupid. And the sooner teachers wise up...the better off in the long run all will be.
I'd say teach no more than 100 50 minute classes a month at hogs. 25 a week, 5 a day. Let another fool work like a slave, be tired all the time, burn out, etc...hey....the school is getting paid for the classes YOU are teaching....why should you be making the owner money only to not be respected or appreciated?
Forget hogs...land a gig at a uni and teach 10-15 classes a week.

[jacl]

[prairieboy]

6 weeks for your severance! Is that legal under Korean labour law?

[dodgybarnet]

Overtime paid for hours over 150 per month?

OT for hours worked between 120 and 150 is like 16,000 which is crapola (2,000,000/120=16,000 therefore it's not technically OT, but the same salary/hour), but I say WHY work overtime for any amount when you can do privates for way more (not that I'd do privates of course, nu huh). My old job had overtime (of over 120 hours) at a rate of 24,000 / hour. Guess how many hours of overtime I did in a year? Zero. Therefore I could care less.

land a gig at a uni and teach 10-15 classes a week.

Sure thing - if you could just point me in the direction of a place offering such a job to me, a teacher with 1 year of experience and a basic TEFL certificate. Any available at your Uni? I have nice hair.

Split shifts? 6:30 am to what? 9:30 pm?

Sorry, maybe I didn't make this clear, the western teachers only teach between 6.30AM to 11.30AM, then 6.30PM to 9.30Pm. The three 1-hour classes in the morning will be concurrent in most cases, and I will get this written into the contract. Obviously this means that there is a possible 2-hour gap between morning classes in the worst-case-scenario. I will get wording that states this will not occur (like "the 3 morning classes must be within a 4 hour period" That said, Gangnam is nice enough and I like Coffee shops with Wifi. It could be worse. It's not all take take take, I can compromise.

If you're teaching 30 classes, get paid for it!

Nowhere in the contract does it mention that any work done will not be paid. In the current contract here, anything over 120 hours is still only 16,000/hour which I've said is bad, but I'll get that ammended.

6 weeks for your severance! Is that legal under Korean labour law?

I appreciate that this is dodgy and would like it changed, although I don't quite 'get' what the fervour is about this? I'll be leaving Korea with a wedge of cash, why would I care that 2 mill comes later? Only the fear of not getting it at all alarms me, but as it's a large company I'm less worried than I was a my last independant hagwon. It took me nearly a year to spend my Korean savings last time, so waiting 6 weeks is fine.

Sorry if I sound like I'm defending a 'bad' contract, it's just that the points raised sound more like heckles. No offense though - Its good to see things from all viewpoints.

[Grotto]

6:30 to 9:20 I wouldnt agree to this as they are not talking splits they are just saying that they have the right to arrange classes within this timeframe. You say you are fine working splits but I would make them put in 2 blocked shifts per day.,

How many classes will you teach per day?

Tear up that 150 hour a month nonsense....anything over 120 is OT

Dont accept less than 25,000 won for a 40 minute class OT rate.

OT rate is time and a half...how do they calculate the regular rate? 2.2/120=18,333 X 1.5= 27,500 even at 2mil it works out to 24,000 an hour.

[alabamaman]

Clause 3: Fine

Clause 4:

Pay date
* Self explanatory
Overtime over 150 hours
*Unacceptable
Makeup hours if you don't work 120 hours
*If they don't provide you with enough hours to be worked that's on them!
No contractual language stating what you are doing outside of the 100 actual teaching hours
*I would assuming you're prepping... Get it written in the contract though.
No contractual language stating what you're doing on Saturdays that you have to work.
*I would think you're doing workshops, so get contractual language clarigying what you're going to be doing.
*No contractual language stating how long your classes are!
*No contractual language stating what days you work!

Clause 5:

Korean Pension Fund
*Contractual language stating how much will be deducted in Korean Won

Clause 6:

*This is clause written horribly! It doesn't say how much your boss will deduct from you monthly salary each month, the % of your monthly salary he will deduct each month, and the total amount of the lump sum your boss will pre-pay every three months.

Clause: 7

*Ask for a higher living allowance if in fact you got that much at your last job.

Clause: 8

*What's the total cost of the ticket?
*If you choose to stay in Korea after finishing labor contract you should get cash equivelant of ticket and the date you will receive it on....

Clause: 9
* Severance on last day!

[dodgybarnet]

Thanks for all the help guys, much appreciated. I'm waiting for them to get back with a confirmed salary offer, then I'll hit them with the contract 'refinements'.

Whilst I wait, I'm back to surfing job boards just in case. Fun fun fun.

Thanks again.