|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
|
 Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2006 11:13 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| Junior wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
| this is collective punishment that will backfire. |
Wrong, its working. many Lebanese are now asking hesbollah to give it up and stop firing rockets because they (civilians) are the ones who are paying the price. |
What delusional world are you living in? Sunnis and Christians are now rallying behind Hizbollah because of what Israel is doing. What I can't understand is why Israel would want this. |
Lebanon has a pop. of 4 million people. its only 26% that are shiites and support hesbollah. The remaining 74% are largely sunnis and christians and know they owe the destruction to a million Lebanese Shiites clinging to a terrorist organization - for political purposes. They've totally undermined the majority-elected govt that was happy to stay peaceful.
read the lebanese blogs. you'll find most people commenting "hisbollah has to go" and hisbollah is murdering lebanon.
most of the "civilians" being hit in the south ARE hisbollah. they carry placards "we are hisbollah" etc. Seems like a green light to attack as I see it.
The Lebanese govt needed international help to get the Syrians out, but they left their own people behind. trust me, most Lebanese want the Syrians and hesbollah to stop infesting their country and starting wars with the neighbours. |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 1:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
Lebanon has a pop. of 4 million people. its only 26% that are shiites and support hesbollah. The remaining 74% are largely sunnis and christians and know they owe the destruction to a million Lebanese Shiites clinging to a terrorist organization - for political purposes. They've totally undermined the majority-elected govt that was happy to stay peaceful. |
Junior , you have a totally partisan and "wrong" view of Lebanese society. I see and read the blogs and can tell you, what you state is FAAAAARRRRRR from the case. Also in despute are your population figures and your suggestion that the majority govt doesn't support hizbollah. Actually, the govt is behind hizbollah and hizbollah remains a significant member of a minority govt.
Again , you are ill informed and your portrait borders on propaganda. Please see the Christian science monitor article below for more exact info. on Hizbollah in Lebanese society. Also note the high support from a non-partisan institute (american manned) and how it has increased from their poll prior to the war in Feb. Increased dramatically.
Further, Lebanon did not request or ask for Israeli help with Hizbollah and Lebanese society were working slowly to bring peace and prosperity to their country after years of horror and destitution. Israel is disengenious to throw out the arguement they are "helping' Lebanon. REALLY? Are you serious with this comment/view???? My god!
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0728/p06s01-wome.html
The stakes are high for Hizbullah, but it seems it can count on an unprecedented swell of public support that cuts across sectarian lines.According to a poll released by the Beirut Center for Research and Information, 87 percent of Lebanese support Hizbullah's fight with Israel, a rise of 29 percent on a similar poll conducted in February. More striking, however, is the level of support for Hizbullah's resistance from non-Shiite communities. Eighty percent of Christians polled supported Hizbullah along with 80 percent of Druze and 89 percent of Sunnis. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:27 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Hizbollah started rocket attacks in response to Israeli air strikes. Yesterday their most deadly rocket attack so far was against a military target. If they had the sophistication, do you think they'd attack Israeli military or civilian targets? Actually, like their bloodthirsty neighbours to the south, they'd probably do both. |
Isreal is going after Hizzoballah cause it is an organziation that is commited to total war with Israel forever.
They would have hit Israel with rockets were it not due to the threat of Israel airforce.
Hizzbollah blows up Jewish community centers overseas - explain that one.
Anit zionist attack or anti Jewish attack?
Bum Suk why doesn't Hizzbollah just give up their war. They attacked Israel first - no? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 2:05 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ddeubel wrote: |
| Quote: |
Lebanon has a pop. of 4 million people. its only 26% that are shiites and support hesbollah. The remaining 74% are largely sunnis and christians and know they owe the destruction to a million Lebanese Shiites clinging to a terrorist organization - for political purposes. They've totally undermined the majority-elected govt that was happy to stay peaceful. |
Junior , you have a totally partisan and "wrong" view of Lebanese society. I see and read the blogs and can tell you, what you state is FAAAAARRRRRR from the case. Also in despute are your population figures and your suggestion that the majority govt doesn't support hizbollah. Actually, the govt is behind hizbollah and hizbollah remains a significant member of a minority govt.
Again , you are ill informed and your portrait borders on propaganda. Please see the Christian science monitor article below for more exact info. on Hizbollah in Lebanese society. Also note the high support from a non-partisan institute (american manned) and how it has increased from their poll prior to the war in Feb. Increased dramatically.
Further, Lebanon did not request or ask for Israeli help with Hizbollah and Lebanese society were working slowly to bring peace and prosperity to their country after years of horror and destitution. Israel is disengenious to throw out the arguement they are "helping' Lebanon. REALLY? Are you serious with this comment/view???? My god!
http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0728/p06s01-wome.html
The stakes are high for Hizbullah, but it seems it can count on an unprecedented swell of public support that cuts across sectarian lines.According to a poll released by the Beirut Center for Research and Information, 87 percent of Lebanese support Hizbullah's fight with Israel, a rise of 29 percent on a similar poll conducted in February. More striking, however, is the level of support for Hizbullah's resistance from non-Shiite communities. Eighty percent of Christians polled supported Hizbullah along with 80 percent of Druze and 89 percent of Sunnis. |
Even if Junior's specious reasoning were accurate, it would merely prove that Israel is punishing 3 out of 4 million people who support its point of view on Hizbulla. Do moderate Israelis get won over to the Hizbullah cause by randomn rocket attacks on their neighbourhoods? No - so why does he think the reverse would be happening in Lebanon? What a wanker. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 6:55 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
Even if Junior's specious reasoning were accurate, it would merely prove that Israel is punishing 3 out of 4 million people who support its point of view on Hizbulla. Do moderate Israelis get won over to the Hizbullah cause by randomn rocket attacks on their neighbourhoods? No - so why does he think the reverse would be happening in Lebanon? What a *beep*. |
So what wuld the U.S. do if Canada kidnapped 2 American soldiers and declared the destruction of America their ultimate aim? Maybe stockpiled thousands of missiles and claimed America was illegally occupying the sidewalk that exists on one side of Niagara. What if 87% of Canadians supported a Russian invasion and allowed the entire border area to be contolled by Russian militia. Hmm. Do you think America would do anything about it? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 7:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Junior wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
Even if Junior's specious reasoning were accurate, it would merely prove that Israel is punishing 3 out of 4 million people who support its point of view on Hizbulla. Do moderate Israelis get won over to the Hizbullah cause by randomn rocket attacks on their neighbourhoods? No - so why does he think the reverse would be happening in Lebanon? What a *beep*. |
So what wuld the U.S. do if Canada kidnapped 2 American soldiers and declared the destruction of America their ultimate aim? Maybe stockpiled thousands of missiles and claimed America was illegally occupying the sidewalk that exists on one side of Niagara. What if 87% of Canadians supported a Russian invasion and allowed the entire border area to be contolled by Russian militia. Hmm. Do you think America would do anything about it? |
Where do you get the 87% support figure? In earlier posts didn't you imply that 74% of Lebanese don't support Hizbullah? Make up your mind. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 10:28 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
Where do you get the 87% support figure? In earlier posts didn't you imply that 74% of Lebanese don't support Hizbullah? Make up your mind. |
Avoiding the question? 
If as you say most lebanese support hesbollah, an organisation who's stated aim is the destruction of Israel, then surely all the more reason to eliminate them?
You think israel is a special case that should be denied the right to protect itself- even though a large militia intent on attacking it was ammassed along its border, stockpiling weapons, kidnapping its soldiers and other provocations. What country would allow that? (Ok, south Korea, I know) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Yu_Bum_suk
Joined: 25 Dec 2004
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2006 10:41 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Junior wrote: |
| Yu_Bum_suk wrote: |
Where do you get the 87% support figure? In earlier posts didn't you imply that 74% of Lebanese don't support Hizbullah? Make up your mind. |
Avoiding the question?
If as you say most lebanese support hesbollah, an organisation who's stated aim is the destruction of Israel, then surely all the more reason to eliminate them?
You think israel is a special case that should be denied the right to protect itself- even though a large militia intent on attacking it was ammassed along its border, stockpiling weapons, kidnapping its soldiers and other provocations. What country would allow that? (Ok, south Korea, I know) |
On one hand (when discussing Hizbullah's appeal) you imply that 74% of Lebanese don't support it are upset about the problems its caused. On the other hand (when discussing the legitimacy of Israel's attacks on civilians) you imply that 87% of Lebanese support it. You're pulling figures out of your ass to defend the indefensible. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 3:37 am Post subject: |
|
|
If Hizzbollah isn't looking to destroy Israel and is really open to peace then Israel has used too much force.
If Hizzbollah is a group that seeks to destroy Israel then Israel's actions for the most part at least are understandable if not justified.
Any problems with that? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:21 am Post subject: |
|
|
Kidnapping 2 soldiers of a neighboring country is an act of war, and if they were trying to provoke the sleeping giant they got what they wanted.
What possible justification can hisbollah have? israel withdrew from lebanon, behind the exact border, to inches, decreed by international observers.
6 years later hisbollah has accumulated 1000's of missiles and decreed death to israel with a huge militia, a grave threat that needs to be crushed.
Why bother? For the trumped up excuse that israel is occupying "the Sheba farms"- a tiny area, that belongs to Syria and which Israel has agreed to let go in any case. Its ridiculous, and reveals again that Arabs do not want peace no matter what concessions Israel gives. Israel is left with no option but to deal out regular fumigation, doing the west a service in the process. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
EdInstead
Joined: 20 Jul 2006
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:33 am Post subject: |
|
|
This war will continue until someone nukes a city in the USA. Hopefully, by that time, enough of the Muslim wackos will have joined together in the Middle East that the USA can feel it's OK to carpet-bomb, or nuke, the entire place.
Cities and towns were carpet-bombed in WWII. Civilians were spared at first, but it got to the point where, to win, it was realized that everything had to be targeted. The West is not fighting a full match against Hizzbollah and their backers. They have been poking fingers in their eyes, just pissing them off.
One of these days, after a nuke hits NY harbor, the PC American crowd will go into "OH SHIT" mode right quick. Then, the gloves will hopefully come off, and we can wipe these people off of the planet.
The dumb thing is that we're sitting on our hands until then, fooling ourselves into thinking we can secure any kind of peace with muslim fundamentalist idiots, and the general populations who back them both vocally and silently. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:49 am Post subject: |
|
|
| EdInstead wrote: |
| This war will continue until someone nukes a city in the USA. Hopefully, by that time, enough of the Muslim wackos will have joined together in the Middle East that the USA can feel it's OK to carpet-bomb, or nuke, the entire place. |
I agree with that, but think it's equally likely that it will be Mossad or some proxy that sets off the bomb, since they would benefit massively from that. Israel is vindicated, given carte blanche to nuke whoever it wants, establish their "greater Israel"; the US gets martial law indefinitely, GWB, or more likely, Cheney or someone, becomes dictator "just until the war on terror is over", Halliburton gets the rebuilding contract... win, win all round.
I can picture it now - within minutes the media will be putting blame on whoever is the current boogey man, a passport from one of the bombers is miraculously found to have survived the nuclear explosion, and so on...
They definiely could do it. Would they? I don't know, but anythings possible. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 7:52 am Post subject: |
|
|
nothing like a good conspriacy theory from someone who luvs David Icky.
By the way greater israel (not a good idea anyway ) would be as big a state like Ohio. Yes of all the things possible in the world the most horrible.
Shows where your heart is deadman. Don't feel too bad Igotthisguitar agrees with all your posts.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 2:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
nothing like a good conspriacy theory from someone who luvs David Icky.
By the way greater israel (not a good idea anyway ) would be as big a state like Ohio. Yes of all the things possible in the world the most horrible.
Shows where your heart is deadman. Don't feel too bad Igotthisguitar agrees with all your posts. |
So, are conspiracy theories always false? Do you include that in your definition of the word?
Do you deny Mossad has the capability? So you think it's something they just wouldn't do?
Detonating a nuke on US soil would be one way to usher in the New World Order. It doesn't even have to cause ANY casualties.
The patriot act would not have been passed if it were not for the 9/11 trauma. Panicking and traumatising a population is the only way you can get them to surrender their freedom without a fight.
Opposition to the imposition of a global govt is to strong under normal circumstances. A massive and traumatic event would be needed to precipitate it. I'm suggesting one scenario that is possible.
Who are the main architechts and main beneficiaries of a new world order? The Rothschilds. Who created Mossad? The Rothschilds (Lord Victor rothschild in particular)
I don't think the scenario is so far fetched. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
|
| Posted: Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:33 pm Post subject: |
|
|
[quote="deadman"][
| Quote: |
| So, are conspiracy theories always false? Do you include that in your definition of the word? |
The vast majority of the time they are. The vast majority of the time they are made by those not looking to find answers but to spread disinformation and misinformation for some sick political and/ social goal.
| Quote: |
| Do you deny Mossad has the capability? So you think it's something they just wouldn't do? |
both especially the later.
| Quote: |
| Detonating a nuke on US soil would be one way to usher in the New World Order. It doesn't even have to cause ANY casualties. |
wouldn't it kill a lot of people?
| Quote: |
| The patriot act would not have been passed if it were not for the 9/11 trauma. Panicking and traumatising a population is the only way you can get them to surrender their freedom without a fight. |
The US already had a similar law called RICO. It makes sense to use the same techniques against terrorists as they government already uses against gangters.
The Patriot act is not particularly severe. Even with it the US is one of the most free and tolerant nations in the world. Other nations have had far more severe laws during times of war.
You are not even from the US so why do you care so much?
| Quote: |
| Opposition to the imposition of a global govt is to strong under normal circumstances. A massive and traumatic event would be needed to precipitate it. I'm suggesting one scenario that is possible. |
It is possible that you will find 10,000 dollars in the street- go look for it.
| Quote: |
| Who are the main architechts and main beneficiaries of a new world order? The Rothschilds. Who created Mossad? The Rothschilds (Lord Victor rothschild in particular) |
??
The Rothchilds are the architechts and main beneficiaries of the "New World Order" (Didn't George Bush's father come up w/ that expression.)
| Quote: |
| Who created Mossad? The Rothschilds (Lord Victor rothschild in particular) |
Is that what David Icke says?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossad (Didn't see anything like that there)
Ok ?? Moonbat detector.
| Quote: |
| I don't think the scenario is so far fetched. |
Well so what. You more or less discredited yourself on this post. Well, that is not a bad thing at all.
Last edited by Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee on Tue Aug 08, 2006 6:46 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
