Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Canuckophile]

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/18/us/18ramsey.html

And thank heaven it doesn't mention Korea.

[Canuckophile]

yes in 2001 he was CONVICTED of POSSESSION of child porn - he lost his job and was supposed to report to court but then disappeared - if his resume time-line is correct, that's when he landed at Incheon. Read the NYT article

[laconic2]

[Canuckophile]

On a second reading, the article isn't clear on this point - I read it quickly. Maybe he did jump the country before the court date. Sorry.

[Bibbitybop]

"This IS a big deal- a VERY big deal."

No it's not. One killer. One crime. Not a big deal. Sad, but it happens every day. Is it big because he was an ESL teacher? It is more relevant to us, but doesn't make it a big deal. To Mr. Ramsey, yes, it is a huge deal. To you...well, get out more often.

[Canuckophile]

Maybe it will be a Big Deal and maybe it won't, but it certainly could be.

Apparently (based on the resume) this guy BECAME an ESL teacher immediately after he was caught with child porn in the US and bailed (article not clear on whether he hung around for trial ). He hops from job to job and continent to continent - usually as an ESL teacher or child care giver. The resume is esp creepy, if you read it, on the child care giver stuff.

Given the fact that this is a highly publicized case, it certainly could be a Big Deal for the ESL industry. There may well be strong reaction in many countries (SK would be top of THAT list) - whether it would result in some good things (like getting contracts signed early enough to get criminal record checks on time) or some bad things (most likely is reluctance to hire single men teachers) is hard to say.

But yes, it could be a Big Deal. His overseas teaching jobs have been mentioned frequently, and that may well affect hiring practices for ESL.

[ThePoet]

OHHH The sky is falling!!!!!!!

Puhlease! this thread is so charged with emotion and so lacking in logic it isn't even funny.

First, you are convicting this guy of something he may or may not have done. He has not gone through the due process of the court system and yet you want him strung up, and made an example of. I've always been told that a person is innocent until proven guilty. Even if it is guilt by media attention.

Second, Kerr was arrested and charged for possession of child pornography but he bolted before conviction, which means he still hasn't been proven guilty. Therefore he would not have a criminal record because a criminal record would only show what he has been convicted of. However, there may be a different department somewhere that states he has an outstanding warrant. The same as millions of other people who haven't paid speeding tickets or other major to minor crimes. For this person, even a criminal record check would have been sufficient to stop him from working with young people.

Third, someone mentioned that some ESL teachers are escaping criminal pasts. Once someone has done the time for their crime, they shouldn't have to 'escape' from anything. If they've gone to prison and paid their debt to society, who are we to say they need to pay more. Why is it anyone's right to force another not to pursue a decent job and to live beyond their past. Remember, a criminal past could be anything from resisting arrest during a traffic altercation, drunk driving, sex crime, robbery, etc. Do you really believe that someone who got caught smoking a doobie under the stands at a football game should actually have that crime to escape from the rest of their lives? I know that there are many teachers I teach with who, although they may or may not have criminal records, have done drugs on vacation. It is illegal in Korea. Does this mean we lop off their heads and drag them up so they cannot make a decent living here?

The sad thing here is, a person can commit one sex crime or even be accused of it, and they can never escape it, even though the chances are higher they will never commit such a crime again (the statistics state that pedophiles are sometimes incurable and have a higher likelihood to re-commit, however, many many other types of sex crimes are one time only). Everybody wants this person dead...but a guy can steal their whole lives or slander or fraud, and 5 years after stopping the practice, they can be unconditionally pardoned and become a model citizen for everyone.

And what about the person who works at a Uni in Korea...the students there are not children. If a man touched a girl inappropriately once, should they be banned from working at a uni because their criminal record check comes back positive?

[Gwangjuboy]

[wylies99]

[corroonb]

ThePoet said

[Canuckophile]

The Poet wrote:
"And what about the person who works at a Uni in Korea...the students there are not children. If a man touched a girl inappropriately once, should they be banned from working at a uni because their criminal record check comes back positive?"

Uh, yes. I teach at a uni and I think they are mostly children - they are mature students but hardly mature adults. Even in the US, there are prohibitions against student-teacher romances because there is usually a major age gap and if not that, at least a major maturity gap. Plus the teacher is an "authority" figure (big deal in Korea) and certainly in position to take advantage.

The Poet wrote:
"The sad thing here is, a person can commit one sex crime or even be accused of it, and they can never escape it, even though the chances are higher they will never commit such a crime again (the statistics state that pedophiles are sometimes incurable and have a higher likelihood to re-commit, however, many many other types of sex crimes are one time only)."


First - what is "sad" here - that the person committed the sex crime or that he can't "escape from it"? Yuck. You are one twisted dude, Poet. And as another poster wrote, you don't know what you're talking about that "the chances are higher they will never commit such a crime again." Dead opposite.

Anyone who wants a "fresh start" from a previous lifestyle that included drugs, alcohol, assault/battery, and above all sex crimes should be free to do so - but please NOT teaching children

Teaching children is not quite the same as pumping gas, doing construction, repairing cars, being a computer programmer, etc. It requires close interaction with a vulnerable population.

And in fact, pedophilia is "incurable". (Castration doesn't help - sex is in fact more in our heads than our sex organs, but chopping off the offender's head is not a medically feasible solution.)

As I understand it, it's a sexual orientation. Most of us (about 90% of men and 95% of women) are straight. About 10% of men and 5% of women are gay. I have never read the statistics (if there are any) of those who are also pedophiles (straight or gay) - but this is overwhelmingly in the male population.

Studies show, for ex., that lesbian women simply don't have a sexual orientation toward children, and most straight women who get involved with child sexual abuse (as distinct from those women who get involved in "romances" with children, typically teenage boys) are involved with some man who is a pedophile.

Teaching ESL is not a good career path for people w ho are straightening out their lives - please use some common sense here. If you need to clean up your act, please pick another profession.

[TheUrbanMyth]

[ThePoet]

Canuckophile,

there are no reasons to take an argument to personal attacks. calling me a twisted individual for stating what I believe is correct based on what I have read on the subject is not called for.

And I stand by what I have said earlier. All people who commit crimes have an opportunity never to commit such crimes again. Yes, the recividism rate is higher among some sex crimes especially pedophilia, but that doesn't mean you use the same brush on everyone. I believe we should never lump everyone into the same corral.

Also, this is a very emotionally charged issue, and has been for hundreds of years. That is why accusing someone of such a crime can ruin a person's life, even if he is never convicted. Some girls have used the "I'll cry rape if I don't get something from you" very effectively. Even movies have shown this as 'cute' sometimes. There are ALWAYS two sides to a story.

Poet

[wylies99]

urbanmyth- Politicians think only of the next election. Beyond that? Thye'll jump off that bridge when they get to it.

[poet13]

"And in fact, pedophilia is "incurable". (Castration doesn't help - sex is in fact more in our heads than our sex organs, but chopping off the offender's head is not a medically feasible solution.)

It's not?