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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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 Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:29 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| fiveeagles wrote: |
Why do people believe in the big bang? I guess a lie is sometimes easier to believe than the truth. |
Big Bang is not a lie. You seriously confuse the body science with the likes of TV preachers. |
It's not a lie nor is it a scientific truth. It's a theory, with little more empirical evidence to support it than the claim that God exists. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:47 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| Kuros wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| fiveeagles wrote: |
Why do people believe in the big bang? I guess a lie is sometimes easier to believe than the truth. |
Big Bang is not a lie. You seriously confuse the body science with the likes of TV preachers. |
It's not a lie nor is it a scientific truth. It's a theory, with little more empirical evidence to support it than the claim that God exists. |
Scientific "truth" is a little meaningless in science. There's hypothesis and theory. Theory that's on rock solid ground is usually called a "law", ie the law of thermodynamics. |
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Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 5:08 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
| mindmetoo wrote: |
| fiveeagles wrote: |
Why do people believe in the big bang? I guess a lie is sometimes easier to believe than the truth. |
Big Bang is not a lie. You seriously confuse the body science with the likes of TV preachers. |
It's not a lie nor is it a scientific truth. It's a theory, with little more empirical evidence to support it than the claim that God exists. |
Scientific "truth" is a little meaningless in science. There's hypothesis and theory. Theory that's on rock solid ground is usually called a "law", ie the law of thermodynamics. |
Okay, well the Big Bang is an appealing theory (hypothesis?). I like it, anyway. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 3:48 pm Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| Kuros wrote: |
Okay, well the Big Bang is an appealing theory (hypothesis?). I like it, anyway. |
Big bang is definitely solid theory, especially since the discovery of cosmic background radiation. I'm always surprised by people like 5chickens who don't even begin to understand the basics of science yet suddenly feel qualified to determine when science is a lie. "Well, it doesn't agree with a literal reading of my bible so it has to be a lie!"
And like Rteacher, they'll accept any moronic crap on the slimmest of evidence as long as it keeps their bible in order but when it comes to evidence at variance with their religious beliefs, they move the goal post to this extreme level of evidence. |
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Rteacher
Joined: 23 May 2005
Location: Western MA, USA
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| Posted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 4:28 pm Post subject: |
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| I think that you know that you're being hypocritical here - having already admitted that any evidence that tends to disprove the current favored "big theory" (in a particular field) is held to a much higher standard of evidence... |
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:07 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| Kuros wrote: |
Okay, well the Big Bang is an appealing theory (hypothesis?). I like it, anyway. |
Big bang is definitely solid theory, especially since the discovery of cosmic background radiation. I'm always surprised by people like 5chickens who don't even begin to understand the basics of science yet suddenly feel qualified to determine when science is a lie. "Well, it doesn't agree with a literal reading of my bible so it has to be a lie!"
And like Rteacher, they'll accept any moronic crap on the slimmest of evidence as long as it keeps their bible in order but when it comes to evidence at variance with their religious beliefs, they move the goal post to this extreme level of evidence. |
Who said science is a lie? What's your background in science MM2? I have a science degree and worked in the engineering field for 7 years. Not that counts for everything, but I would say I am a bit past the basics.
But with that being said, the evidence overwhelmingly points towards a Creator. It's unfortunate that sin has blinded many in the scientific communtity from observing truth. A sign of that evidence is the overwhelming amount of hatred/intimidation/arrogance you encounter when you don't agree with the theory of Big Bang. |
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huffdaddy
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:22 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
But with that being said, the evidence overwhelmingly points towards a Creator. It's unfortunate that sin has blinded many in the scientific communtity from observing truth. A sign of that evidence is the overwhelming amount of hatred/intimidation/arrogance you encounter when you don't agree with the theory of Big Bang. |
I agree that we are a long ways away from proving the Big Bang. Being basically unrepeatable, it will probably never be proven. But it seems to me that studying the Big Bang / evolution falls within the boundaries of scientific inquiry, while looking at creationism / intelligent design is more of a philosophical / theological inquiry.
Just for the sake of beating around the bush, which version of the "Creation" do you back? The literal 7-day / 6000 year old Earth one, the revised intelligent-design / ???? version, RTeacher's, Tom Cruise's, or some other theory? |
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Grimalkin
Joined: 22 May 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:40 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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Who said science is a lie? What's your background in science MM2? I have a science degree and worked in the engineering field for 7 years. Not that counts for everything, but I would say I am a bit past the basics.
But with that being said, the evidence overwhelmingly points towards a Creator. It's unfortunate that sin has blinded many in the scientific communtity from observing truth. |
I also have a science degree and personally it shocks me that anyone with any scientific training can believe in a god instead of having at the very least serious serious doubts.
I think it would be truer to say that blind faith and wishful thinking has blinded many in the scientific community from observing truth!  |
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laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:42 am Post subject: |
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| There's not a doubt in my mind he got his degree at a Christian university, which would be like getting a degree in Japanese history in Korea or a degree in Women's studies in Iran! |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 4:02 am Post subject: |
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I don't get the fuss.
I have a coffee cup that bleeds. I posted about it last winter. If I were British I could say it's a bleedin' miracle, but Gaea in her wisdom chose not to curse me with that cross to bear. |
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Rteacher
Joined: 23 May 2005
Location: Western MA, USA
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 4:45 am Post subject: |
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Most older universities considered great at least started out as Christian schools, including Harvard, and Oxford. Of course they gradulally got more secular and humanistic after the "Enlightenment" period.
Harvard Divinity School is one of five university-based, non-denominational divinity schools in the United States (the other four being at the University of Chicago, Vanderbilt University, Wake Forest University and Yale University).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harvard_Divinity_School
Because theology is not allowed to be taught at state universities in the U.S., many students interested in that field must attend private schools like Texas Christian University or BYU or smaller colleges like Wheaton.
Not to take this even further off topic, but it seems to me that the most highly regarded Christian schools in the U.S. are the Catholic ones like Boston College, Georgetown, Notre Dame, Loyola of Chicago, Marquette, Saint Louis University, and Catholic University...
So, "Christian school" shouldn't just automatically linked with the likes of Oral Roberts and Jerry Falwell. |
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mindmetoo
Joined: 02 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 5:02 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| fiveeagles wrote: |
| A sign of that evidence is the overwhelming amount of hatred/intimidation/arrogance you encounter when you don't agree with the theory of Big Bang. |
Cosmic background radiation. Explain that one, 5chickens. |
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 8:25 am Post subject: |
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| laogaiguk wrote: |
| There's not a doubt in my mind he got his degree at a Christian university, which would be like getting a degree in Japanese history in Korea or a degree in Women's studies in Iran! |
Try UBC-Okanagan, Biotch!
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fiveeagles
Joined: 19 May 2005
Location: Vancouver
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 8:46 am Post subject: Re: "Miracle" Water Spouting From Tree |
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| mindmetoo wrote: |
| fiveeagles wrote: |
| A sign of that evidence is the overwhelming amount of hatred/intimidation/arrogance you encounter when you don't agree with the theory of Big Bang. |
Cosmic background radiation. Explain that one, 5chickens. |
So, you don't have much of a background in science, eh?
Buddy. I am still waiting for a reply on spontaneous generation; how the universe went from Inorganic to Organic and why this can't be duplicated in the labs.
Or so many other things.
| Quote: |
I agree that we are a long ways away from proving the Big Bang. Being basically unrepeatable, it will probably never be proven. But it seems to me that studying the Big Bang / evolution falls within the boundaries of scientific inquiry, while looking at creationism / intelligent design is more of a philosophical / theological inquiry.
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Macro-Evolution is a high-pie in the sky philosophy. Science can be separated from Evolution and is not purely based upon its ideals. Yeah, some of the greatest discoveries have been by secularists, but so too by people of faith. However, to reason that science is solely based upon a belief that is based in evolution is ridiculous.
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| Just for the sake of beating around the bush, which version of the "Creation" do you back? The literal 7-day / 6000 year old Earth one, the revised intelligent-design / ???? version, RTeacher's, Tom Cruise's, or some other theory? |
If you believe that death came through sin, which I do, then I believe you have two options to believe in. Either it is a 7-day/6000 year old Earth or that is millions of years old. The later is known as the gap theory where in Genesis 1, there is a gap in God's creation. Where people don't know how long God took between certain steps. I am not going to get into the depth of it here, but from what I have seen and read I believe the evidence points towards 7days/6000 years. However, I am not an expert in Geology and so I am open to the fact that it could be hundreds of millions of years old and still have faith in God. |
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Grimalkin
Joined: 22 May 2005
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| Posted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 11:18 am Post subject: |
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| but from what I have seen and read I believe the evidence points towards 7days/6000 years. |
In that case I wouldn't go bragging about my science degree if I were you.
With or without a science degree mindmetoo has it all over you! |
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