|
Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
 Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:34 pm Post subject: |
 |
|
| ddeubel wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Do you not realize how silly this post sounds? Look at your last paragraph. A Christian would NEVER refer to himself as "the messiah"...that would be blasphemy. Hitler was not a Christian. BTW do you have any sources that show that Hitler was a "born, raised and practicing Christian." or are you just making stuff up as you go along as you usually do? |
(1)) Do you realize how silly YOUR post sounds? Trying to debate about current and historical affairs without the faintest notion of basic facts of one of the seminal events of last century............. You believe what you want, fed by just enough nutrition to make you believe you are intellectually alive.
I didn't quote stuff because this should be common knowledge. Sorry to lose my patience (2) but you saying I am silly, just rankles.....if you don't know what pasta is, get out of the kitchen....
| Quote: |
| (3) As time went on, it became clearer that he. was thinking of himself as the Messiah and that it was he who was destined to lead Germany to glory. His references to the Bible became more frequent and the movement began to take on a religious [page 13] atmosphere. Comparisons between Christ and himself became more numerous and found their way into his conversation and speeches |
DD |
1. This is what you do. Start debates without knowing what you are talking about..who in here has agreed with you?
2. Again I am not the only one saying this...other people have agreed with me.
3. A Christian would never compare himself to "a messiah". Or to "Christ" . That would be utter blasphemy. Hitler used a few Christian symbols and imagery for hyperbole in his speechs...that does not make him a Christian.
I took issue to you attempting to call Hitler a Christian. Now I see that you are attempting to backpeddle by trying to make distinctions between being a Christain and being of the church. There is no distinction. Simply because one was raised in a Christian nation in a Christian household does NOT MAKE ONE A CHRISTIAN. By their works they are known. Looking at Hitler's works no sensible person would suggest that he used Christianity as any more than as a prop of imagery in his speech.
Period.
Last edited by TheUrbanMyth on Thu Sep 28, 2006 2:39 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 4:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Rutabaga,
This website was created in the preamble to the Gulf War. Opportunistic and indeed meant in my opinion, to justify American "Christian " aggression. Please note they at no time on the side, condemn WAR but rather say that all Christians must pray for as little killing of innocents as possible....yeah, neo christianity at its best. Just pray and all will be alright, god bless us....
I don't mean to say we shouldn't read this stuff or discount it. Our opinions should be formed from a wide swath of sources...I just want to call it , for what it is. When it comes to interpretations , religious interpretations, we both know, you can find anything to justify your arguement. Those quotations of Muslim scholars and sources are meaningless and but facade.
I especially don't like how this is "ministry", and they ask for $$$$ for them to heal your soul.....and send it to Texas!
| Quote: |
Financial support: You can support the ministry of Answering Islam by sending donations (in the USA) to
Good News for Muslims
P.O. Box 131327
Houston, TX 77219-1327 |
My God! Your God! This is destroying the taste of my coffee this morning...
DD |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:12 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Hehe.. I didn't read the entire web page, DD. While some of it is perhaps factual, and we should not discount a site simply because it has a religious origin-- you're right, it's not a very objective source.
Ken:> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 5:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Hehe.. I didn't read the entire web page, DD. While some of it is perhaps factual, and we should not discount a site simply because it has a religious origin-- you're right, it's not a very objective source.
Ken:> |
Even I agree with this. Practically everyone has some sort of bias. It's just the Christian ones tend to let it affect their work a lot more. Still, stuff from Christian or Athiestic (I am not talking secular) should be checked thoroughly. Just like if I saw a report on how smoking is healthy with tons of links to a cigarette company  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Junior
Joined: 18 Nov 2005
Location: the eye
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 6:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| laogaiguk wrote: |
| Practically everyone has some sort of bias. It's just the Christian ones tend to let it affect their work a lot more. |
I think you'll find that secular links tend to be biased against Christians and generally support those poor muslims.
That is the slant of the world media today. So many conflicts are reported as 'political unrest" or ethnic tensions" when its simply a case of muslims conducting ethnic cleansing. Nigeria is a good example. Whenever muslims kill christians, all you read is "Inter tribal tensions".
Whenever Christians retaliate, you see "Christians kill muslims" everywhere.
Probably because people like ddeubel Atassi or Big bird are in charge of the western media. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| laogaiguk wrote: |
| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Hehe.. I didn't read the entire web page, DD. While some of it is perhaps factual, and we should not discount a site simply because it has a religious origin-- you're right, it's not a very objective source.
Ken:> |
Even I agree with this. Practically everyone has some sort of bias. It's just the Christian ones tend to let it affect their work a lot more. |
I would say it's just the Christian ones that are portrayed as letting it affect their work more.
But maybe I am wrong and you have links to statistics giving evidence to back it up?
Again don't confuse Christianity and those whose claim to it is simply that...a claim. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
laogaiguk
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: somewhere in Korea
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:38 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| laogaiguk wrote: |
| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Hehe.. I didn't read the entire web page, DD. While some of it is perhaps factual, and we should not discount a site simply because it has a religious origin-- you're right, it's not a very objective source.
Ken:> |
Even I agree with this. Practically everyone has some sort of bias. It's just the Christian ones tend to let it affect their work a lot more. |
I would say it's just the Christian ones that are portrayed as letting it affect their work more.
But maybe I am wrong and you have links to statistics giving evidence to back it up?
Again don't confuse Christianity and those whose claim to it is simply that...a claim. |
I am not going to provide stats for that, don't be stupid. It would be impossible, and not worth it. Would you like me to prove 1 + 1 = 2 too? Seriously, how many evolutionists incorporate evolution into every thing they do? Show me a Christian whose opinion wasn't influenced by that silly 2000 year old story book in most ways. That kind of argument is just trying to deflect away from the point.
Just for you though, when I said Christian, I should have said religious (as Muslims, Rteacher, etc do to). |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kuros
Joined: 27 Apr 2004
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 7:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ddeubel wrote: |
Leslie,
I just spent an hour going through "your" website. Yeah, Christian - Muslim dialogue at its best!!! Not one Muslim scholar writing anything and the whole site must be some Christian funded (ie. read government $$$$) org.anization). The interpretations are a joke and so too is the slant and "let's shake hands while I spit in your soup" manner they argue with.
Just a joke and I think you seriously should get informed from other places than this. Maybe you are and do -- but just saying this reference is without standard or authority.
DD |
How's sticking your fingers in your ears working out for you? The website has an agenda to be sure but the text is well cited.
The jizya is well-known, and its completely natural that in Islamic society there was discrimination against non-Islamics and non-Arabs. The triumph of Islam if anything was how well Islamic converts who weren't Arab did in Arab society. But the ancient Islamic world was not modern-day America with equal rights for all. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:04 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ChimpumCallao wrote: |
[
Big Bird, you are coming off as very shrill and obnoxious and over-defensive.
|
I don't mind how I come off to you. You come off as catty, ignorant and uninformed, prone to ascribing opinions and views to others (that they may not in fact have) and actually rather racist.
My style on these boards can be quite combative, and I like it that way. I find it difficult to suffer fools such as yourself.
| impudent chimp wrote: |
| Someone who is old and obviously isn't riding on their looks should perhaps turn down the hag a bit. Remember your spirit. |
Join the ranks of silly schoolyard taunters, it seems about your intellectual level. Can you be more imaginative? The only women who come to forums to 'ride off their looks' are those on Asian Bride. This place is for debate, not winning the Ms Ape of the Year competition. FWIW, the first time my husband saw my face he knew at once that he was going to marry me. So you won't hit any insecurity there. Try again. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Junior wrote: |
I think its time Big bird dusted off her burqah.  |
Yes, it might keep the hot sun off. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Big_Bird
Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Location: Sometimes here sometimes there...
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 8:09 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
Leslie's reference (it is not her personal web page) ....
Ken:> |
Moldy - never seen Gone With the Wind? Take time to watch the credits roll next time. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ddeubel
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:27 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
How's sticking your fingers in your ears working out for you? The website has an agenda to be sure but the text is well cited.
The jizya is well-known, and its completely natural that in Islamic society there was discrimination against non-Islamics and non-Arabs. The triumph of Islam if anything was how well Islamic converts who weren't Arab did in Arab society. But the ancient Islamic world was not modern-day America with equal rights for all. |
Please read my post and not just respond off the top of your head! I stated matter of factly, it was good to read this sort of stuff and sort through it. What I objected to was the bias wasn't acknowledged and it was posted as some authoratative text -- which it sure as hell ain't.
I agree with the smell of your post -- that Islamic society has discrimination and its downside. What I disagree is villianization, categorization (because Islamic society is VERRRRRRY diverse and because it is wrong and simple minded) and especially talking about a religion without the backdrop and bright lights of cultural sensitivity.
Yes, there are inalienable rights. I agree. But there also is the freedom of a culture to organize itself as it sees fit. You mix up the two as always, besides the labeling and stupidity you throw up.......
DD |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ddeubel wrote: |
Just a joke and I think you seriously should get informed from other places than this. Maybe you are and do -- but just saying this reference is without standard or authority.
DD |
If you think Mr Hartwig is incorrect then you might do better to refute his argument than to dismiss it because of where Leslie found it. Just a suggestion. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Moldy Rutabaga
Joined: 01 Jul 2003
Location: Ansan, Korea
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 10:54 pm Post subject: |
|
|
It was not my intention to stir up this side issue!-- To reiterate, I do not think a source is invalidated because it's affiliated with a religious organization, but in this case the website obviously has a rather strong advocacy purpose. I would be equally skeptical with a secular website dedicated to supporting an ideological position. (I meant no offence to Leslie. I don't follow the Gone with the Wind reference.) I think we all agree, or should agree, that reading widely to obtain several viewpoints before reaching conclusions is a good thing. Nevertheless, it should be said again that the article's sources seem reliable even if the interpretation of them is less objective.
Ken:> |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Leslie Cheswyck
Joined: 31 May 2003
Location: University of Western Chile
|
| Posted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 11:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Moldy Rutabaga wrote: |
It was not my intention to stir up this side issue!-- To reiterate, I do not think a source is invalidated because it's affiliated with a religious organization, but in this case the website obviously has a rather strong advocacy purpose. I would be equally skeptical with a secular website dedicated to supporting an ideological position. (I meant no offence to Leslie. I don't follow the Gone with the Wind reference.) I think we all agree, or should agree, that reading widely to obtain several viewpoints before reaching conclusions is a good thing. Nevertheless, it should be said again that the article's sources seem reliable even if the interpretation of them is less objective.
Ken:> |
Hi,
I was responding to Ddueble there. And yes, I agree with your point in your last two sentences. I make no secret of my biases here. And if I had wanted to hide the ultimate source of my link, then I wouldn't have attached the link in the first place. But it contained enough of what I felt I needed to get my point across. You make a decision and then move on with it.
The Gone With The Wind reference: Leslie Howard
Used to be my avatar, until one day it turned into a big red X.  |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
