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Let's be respectful, intellectual rather than emotional...
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sundubuman



Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: seoul

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ddeubel wrote:
Forget Iraq, let's just look at how Bush has helped create a world where America is seen NOT as a beacon of freedom but as controlling, impetuous, bullies. And then the constitution, erosion of freedom in country.....and , and , and,,,,,,

STAY ANGRY!

DD



stick to canuckistan genius...
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EFLtrainer



Joined: 04 May 2005

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 6:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

riley wrote:
EFL Trainer, are you actually saying, "You're either with me or against me"? Remember what happened to the last genius who said that?

Oh yeah, he was re-elected in 2004. Carry on with your jihad/crusade.


This is nonsense. Literally. It makes zero sense.
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EFLtrainer



Joined: 04 May 2005

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 6:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sundubuman wrote:
ddeubel wrote:
Forget Iraq, let's just look at how Bush has helped create a world where America is seen NOT as a beacon of freedom but as controlling, impetuous, bullies. And then the constitution, erosion of freedom in country.....and , and , and,,,,,,

STAY ANGRY!

DD



stick to canuckistan genius...


Is canuckistan genius different from, say, evil genius? Or, idiot savant? How about Kentucky Fried Genius? Wasted genius?

Razz
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Adventurer



Joined: 28 Jan 2006

PostPosted: Mon Oct 16, 2006 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gentlemen, there are too many people who are disgusted with both the Democratic and Republican parties. They are a hindrance to democracy, because they have blocked, time and time again, the emergence of other parties who can viably "inhabit" the legislature. People in England, France, Italy, and Germany have a vibrant multi-party system. In Canada, it is between the European and American systems.

As far as I am concerned, the Republican party has been very aggressive for the past 20 years. The Soviets were in decline somewhat prior to the Afghan invasion and the Republicans expedited the end of the Cold War, but the way that war was ended planted the seeds for another conflict - a conflict with Islamic radicals who were largely trained by those who speak of themselves being tough on "terror".

I recall watching on a satellite television of many of the ideas that reminded one of the Patriot Act. I watched that program before the Patriot Act was even written. So, I was not surprised by it. It was what many Republicans like Oliver North thought of in the past. Let us not forget that North and others armed the Contras in violation of the will of the democratically elected legislature.

Both parties have failed the country. However, the Republican Party is failing America even more. They are not standing up for the constitution by listening to the telephone conversations of Americans without obtaining warrants. An American can be imprisoned for a long time without following following Common Law stare decisis or precedent by requiring the government to produce evidence in accordance with the principal of Habeas Corpus.

You could argue that the president shold be impeached for these violations. However, at this moment, the system of checks-and-balances is not working. The legislature, for too long, has been shirking its duty to uphold the constitution.

It is sad when over half the population does not have faith in the electoral system. Machines that tabulate the votes are often owned by partisans including those who have contributed to Republican causes. No other Western state has their elections in the hands of private parties. I don't know about others on this board, but I am alarmed at an America that is not the America I used to know.
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EFLtrainer



Joined: 04 May 2005

PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 1:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Adventurer wrote:
Gentlemen, there are too many people who are disgusted with both the Democratic and Republican parties. They are a hindrance to democracy, because they have blocked, time and time again, the emergence of other parties who can viably "inhabit" the legislature. People in England, France, Italy, and Germany have a vibrant multi-party system. In Canada, it is between the European and American systems.

As far as I am concerned, the Republican party has been very aggressive for the past 20 years. The Soviets were in decline somewhat prior to the Afghan invasion and the Republicans expedited the end of the Cold War, but the way that war was ended planted the seeds for another conflict - a conflict with Islamic radicals who were largely trained by those who speak of themselves being tough on "terror".

I recall watching on a satellite television of many of the ideas that reminded one of the Patriot Act. I watched that program before the Patriot Act was even written. So, I was not surprised by it. It was what many Republicans like Oliver North thought of in the past. Let us not forget that North and others armed the Contras in violation of the will of the democratically elected legislature.

Both parties have failed the country. However, the Republican Party is failing America even more. They are not standing up for the constitution by listening to the telephone conversations of Americans without obtaining warrants. An American can be imprisoned for a long time without following following Common Law stare decisis or precedent by requiring the government to produce evidence in accordance with the principal of Habeas Corpus.

You could argue that the president shold be impeached for these violations. However, at this moment, the system of checks-and-balances is not working. The legislature, for too long, has been shirking its duty to uphold the constitution.

It is sad when over half the population does not have faith in the electoral system. Machines that tabulate the votes are often owned by partisans including those who have contributed to Republican causes. No other Western state has their elections in the hands of private parties. I don't know about others on this board, but I am alarmed at an America that is not the America I used to know.


Agreed, but this comes back to the people: there are four years between presidential elections. That is enough time to get a serious third party started. However, there are a couple other things we need to do: Goodbye to the Electoral College. One person, one vote. Goodbye to winner-take-all elections. One person, one vote. Goodbye to PACS and business donations: Companies are not people and should not be treated as such. If individuals want to pool their individual donations, fine, but nothing above and beyond that, and no double-dipping. Brown had it right: limit contributions. While your wealth may give you the power to buy whatever you wish, it does not give you the right to buy more influence on governance than I can. Finally, get rid of war chests. Any money left over goes into a general fund distributed to ALL candidates in the next election, OR, must be returned to donors.

Etc.
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