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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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 Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:16 am Post subject: Renting to illegals declared illegal in Escondido, Calif |
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ESCONDIDO, Calif. - City leaders have approved an ordinance prohibiting landlords from renting to illegal immigrants, the latest in one of many efforts by local governments across the country to crack down on undocumented workers.
More than 100 police officers and sheriff's deputies in riot gear were on hand for the 3-2 vote Wednesday. After the measure was approved, one person ran outside the council chamber and yelled, "The USA wins!" prompting opponents and supporters gathered on the lawn to shout at each other for 30 minutes. Police said no arrests were made.
The American Civil Liberties Union has indicated it will go to court to block implementation of the ordinance, set to take effect Nov. 18.
Councilman Sam Abed, who supported the measure, said it will improve the city's image and reputation, "and certainly our quality of life."
http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20061019/ap_on_re_us/illegal_immigrants_housing_1 |
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matthews_world
Joined: 15 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 4:18 pm Post subject: |
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Wow, man. That's not right! The US was formed on the basis of justice and equality for all. This issue is getting out of control.
The US needs to institute or review it's guest worker program fast! Look at all the spinach that was underplanted and the crops that are gonna rot in the fields this Fall due to this crackdown.
I see huge slums being constructed here, food shortages, inflation and chaos in the near future if we don't give at least the hard-working illegals with clean records some sort of protection under the law. |
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Yo!Chingo
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul Korea
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| Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:50 pm Post subject: |
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| matthews_world wrote: |
| Wow, man. That's not right! The US was formed on the basis of justice and equality for all. This issue is getting out of control. |
Sorry but anyone entering the US without permission is a criminal, and b/c they're not US citizens they don't and shouldn't have the same rights that we do.
| matthew's_world wrote: |
| I see huge slums being constructed here, food shortages, inflation and chaos in the near future if we don't give at least the hard-working illegals with clean records some sort of protection under the law. |
Illegal alien=criminal
None of them have clean records b/c they're all criminals. BTW,yes some fruit and vegetable rotted in the fields. No one has or is starving b/c of it. Illegal labor will go the way of slave labor b/c that's essentially what it is. We'll find machines to replace them and probably soon. |
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wannago
Joined: 16 Apr 2004
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| Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:34 am Post subject: |
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| Yo!Chingo wrote: |
| matthews_world wrote: |
| Wow, man. That's not right! The US was formed on the basis of justice and equality for all. This issue is getting out of control. |
Sorry but anyone entering the US without permission is a criminal, and b/c they're not US citizens they don't and shouldn't have the same rights that we do.
| matthew's_world wrote: |
| I see huge slums being constructed here, food shortages, inflation and chaos in the near future if we don't give at least the hard-working illegals with clean records some sort of protection under the law. |
Illegal alien=criminal
None of them have clean records b/c they're all criminals. BTW,yes some fruit and vegetable rotted in the fields. No one has or is starving b/c of it. Illegal labor will go the way of slave labor b/c that's essentially what it is. We'll find machines to replace them and probably soon. |
Right on the money. The illegals do have recourse. Retrace their steps, go home, and come back LEGALLY. |
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mateomiguel
Joined: 16 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 12:53 am Post subject: |
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| man, imagine if the US had as strict an immigration policy as Korea. eh? You need to bring your American Family History book with you if you want to get a birth certificate for your newborn son. People without 3 generations of US blood in them get rejected. Foreigners can stay for one year if they are registered at the nearest immigration office, and after one year they have to get the hell out or get a $100 fine per day they overstay. Would you consider that "wrong?" Or "injust?" |
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dulouz
Joined: 04 Feb 2003
Location: Uranus
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| Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 5:18 am Post subject: |
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| I've spoken ad nauseum about this topic, my view is well known. The illegals have to leave or be gotten rid one way or the other. |
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Ya-ta Boy
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
Location: Established in 1994
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| Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:38 am Post subject: |
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Boy have I been misreading the title of this thread. I thought it said "Renting of Illegals Declared Illegal..." and thought FINALLY someone was starting to deal with the crux of the issue.
Sadly, it was just a misreading.  Back to blaming the victim. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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| matthews_world wrote: |
Wow, man. That's not right! The US was formed on the basis of justice and equality for all. This issue is getting out of control.
The US needs to institute or review it's guest worker program fast! Look at all the spinach that was underplanted and the crops that are gonna rot in the fields this Fall due to this crackdown.
I see huge slums being constructed here, food shortages, inflation and chaos in the near future if we don't give at least the hard-working illegals with clean records some sort of protection under the law. |
[Did you know that tax dollars go to non-American citizens? If you want to speak about justice, sometimes illegal aliens who receive health care in public hospitals, go to public schools are using funds meant for citizens.
I do understand why someone would be an illegal alien. If I were in their position, I might do it. They are taking advantage of the corruption of the U.S. government and those in the corporate sphere who were against stemming the flow of illegals. However, it is the responsibily of Mexico to institute reforms to make the lives of their poor better and the same for the U.S. when it comes to their citizens. Illegal aliens are not green-card holders or citizens.
Did you know Mexico and Brazil have a higher standard of living than many African countries? What if 1 million Africans wanted to come to Mexico or Brazil? Do you think they would allow that? The respective governments would go ballistic. |
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Ryst Helmut
Joined: 26 Apr 2003
Location: In search of the elusive signature...
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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| dulouz wrote: |
| I've spoken ad nauseum about this topic, my view is well known. The illegals have to leave or be gotten rid one way or the other. |
Once a cancer has spread....preventitive measures, however...
!shoosh,
Ryst |
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daskalos
Joined: 19 May 2006
Location: The Road to Ithaca
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 12:48 pm Post subject: |
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I am very sorry and saddened that life sucks so much in Mexico that people would rather be criminals than stay there, but that is the fault of the oligarchy in Mexico.
See, the oligarchy in the US figured out a long time ago that it needed a huge middle class to act as a buffer between it and the poor. Mexico's oligarchy has historically depended more on the lax immigration-law enforcement in the US as its poor-folk pressure valve. That they have been aided historically in this by the US oligarchy is lamentable, but it doesn't create a legally or morally binding precedent.
It staggers the imagination, though, to think that any controversy can attach itself to a law that makes it illegal to rent to people in the country illegally. |
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matthews_world
Joined: 15 Feb 2003
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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Unless your family was born from straight Native American stock then you all well know that the US was formed and founded by foreigners who made the country great. The US has always had an open border.
Now we're shooting ourselves in the foot because we haven't had the policy nor the manpower needed to police immigration correctly.
These are pretty drastice measures being taken and whose to say whether it's unconstitutional or not but foreigner workers have been the backbone of the greatest economy in the world.
Remember Chavez in the '50s after the war? He was originally Mexican-American, The NFWA became big under his tutelage as he organized unions.
It's gonna take another Chavez to get these illegals the rights we reserve. Hell, we're guest workers here in Korea. Why not those in our own home countries. |
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Ryst Helmut
Joined: 26 Apr 2003
Location: In search of the elusive signature...
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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Guest Worker - yes
Illegal - no
I came to America legally.
My relatives came to America legally.
My wife came to America legally.
I went to Korea legally.
Oh, the concept!
!shoosh,
Ryst
Native schmative |
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mithridates
Joined: 03 Mar 2003
Location: President's office, Korean Space Agency
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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Interesting stats on immigration (and yes, I know it doesn't address illegal vs. illegal but rather Hispanic immigration as a whole):
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For Hispanics, Poverty Is Relative
By Marcela Sanchez
Sunday, October 22, 2006; Page B07
The cat is out of the bag: The majority of Latino immigrants in the United States are poor. By one calculation, up to three-fifths are "working poor" or "lower middle class," with annual incomes of less than $30,000.
The bad news seems worse when one considers that as Hispanics gained in the U.S. population, the share of Hispanics in poverty doubled, from 12 percent in 1980 to 25 percent in 2004. Recent immigrants fared worse. In 2006 the U.S. government drew the poverty line at $20,000 annually for a family of four, or a little more than $1,600 a month. But for those newly arrived from Latin America, the average monthly salary was $900, according to a report released last week by the Inter-American Development Bank (IDB).
But if immigrants, especially Hispanics, are card-carrying members of the U.S. underclass, society at large is having a hard time convincing them of it: Latino immigrants are too busy working, buying cars, purchasing homes and even investing abroad.
Such a lifestyle is not exactly the picture of poverty. The poor are supposed to be the down and out -- the hungry and depressed standing in bread lines. Under this stereotype, they struggle for basic goods and services and are left outside the mainstream, unable to get ahead.
Yet observers of the Latino experience in the United States say that Hispanic immigrants generally don't fit this mold for two basic reasons: choices and attitude. Immigrants cut what corners they can to keep rent, health care, sundry expenses and taxes to a minimum. They also leave family behind, clearly the most painful among their money-saving strategies to reduce the number of dependents in the United States.
The income they pull together from their jobs is pumped into work-related expenses and living essentials, putting 90 percent of their earnings back into the U.S. economy, according to the IDB. They invest most of the rest of their incomes in their homelands.
The IDB report found that immigrants will send home about $45 billion in 2006, creating one of "the broadest and most effective poverty alleviation programs in the world." It also found that the majority of migrants want to buy a family home or open a small business in their home country. One-third said they had already made investments, mainly in real estate. These are not the actions of the economically deprived.
Hispanic immigrants don't necessarily feel excluded or underserved either. In an education survey, the Pew Hispanic Center and the Kaiser Family Foundation found two years ago that Hispanic immigrants were notably positive about the quality of public school education in their areas. More pointedly, the survey concluded that Hispanics are not a "disgruntled population that views itself as greatly disadvantaged or victimized."
What Hispanics do with their money and how they live reflect not deprivation or exclusion but an attitude of abundance. Poverty is relative. Less than $20,000 a year may rank an immigrant as statistically poor, but this income may be seen as a fortune to someone who was making less than a tenth of that back home.
So at the end of the day what do we have? A growing number of immigrant poor? Well, yes. A growing number of depressed and downtrodden? No. Hispanic immigrants, like their immigrant predecessors, are optimists. The IDB found that even though 64 percent of remittance senders have an annual household income of less than $30,000, most believe their economic situation in the United States is good (58 percent) or excellent (10 percent), and they are confident about the future.
All this, of course, makes poor fodder for those who would cast immigrants as an underclass. The poor who strive, spend and invest do not easily fit the argument, so often used in recent months, that immigrants are a drag on the U.S. economy.
Yes, because of immigration, the ranks of Hispanics among the poor in this country have grown. But while their incomes initially may be lower than those of native workers, economists such as Jared Bernstein of the Economic Policy Institute have found that they "improve more quickly" than those of natives.
Those who use poverty to disparage immigration will continue to argue that immigrants -- especially those here illegally -- hurt the U.S. economy. The reality is that rather than increasing poverty rates here, Hispanic immigrants are helping decrease poverty rates south of the border -- and with that they are doing more than anyone else to stem the future flow of immigration. |
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Yo!Chingo
Joined: 06 Dec 2005
Location: Seoul Korea
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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| matthews_world wrote: |
Unless your family was born from straight Native American stock then you all well know that the US was formed and founded by foreigners who made the country great. The US has always had an open border.
Now we're shooting ourselves in the foot because we haven't had the policy nor the manpower needed to police immigration correctly.
These are pretty drastice measures being taken and whose to say whether it's unconstitutional or not but foreigner workers have been the backbone of the greatest economy in the world.
Remember Chavez in the '50s after the war? He was originally Mexican-American, The NFWA became big under his tutelage as he organized unions.
It's gonna take another Chavez to get these illegals the rights we reserve. Hell, we're guest workers here in Korea. Why not those in our own home countries. |
I love the fact that you're bringing up the America is great b/c of immigrants ploy, and that our gates have always been open. Gimme a break  Every country has the right to control it's borders. Why is America so different?!? Yes, 99.9% of Americans are from people who immigrated. So what? When they set foot on the North American continent it was welcomed and they were for the most part accepted by the people there. Now our LAWS have changed and you have to wait to come to America. These illegals don't want to wait so they wetback it across the border and then want all the same rights as those who followed the law. I and most of the American public are calling BULL SH#T! Now we're gonna build a wall 
I guess you and the other idiots lose! That includes the Mexican government. Now maybe they can start taking care of their own S#it and get a frickin' clue. |
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Adventurer
Joined: 28 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:32 pm Post subject: |
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| matthews_world wrote: |
Unless your family was born from straight Native American stock then you all well know that the US was formed and founded by foreigners who made the country great. The US has always had an open border.
Now we're shooting ourselves in the foot because we haven't had the policy nor the manpower needed to police immigration correctly.
These are pretty drastice measures being taken and whose to say whether it's unconstitutional or not but foreigner workers have been the backbone of the greatest economy in the world.
Remember Chavez in the '50s after the war? He was originally Mexican-American, The NFWA became big under his tutelage as he organized unions.
It's gonna take another Chavez to get these illegals the rights we reserve. Hell, we're guest workers here in Korea. Why not those in our own home countries. |
Have you heard of the Celts and Anglo-Saxons of the British Isles?
I am sure you have. The Celts, like the Native Americans, were an aboriginal people preceding the Anglo-Saxons. They are now heavily mixed. In the U.S., so many Caucasians mixed with Native Americans.
We cannot change the fact that the Native Americans were killed and ethnic cleansed anymore than the Celts and their druids were massacred. England, in an European sense, was a nation of immigrants and invaders. America is still America and England is still England.
America is more of a mixed country, that is true, but it does not mean
America should not have a stable order, culture etc......
I came to Korea legally I did not break any laws by coming to Korea.
I went through a process. I am documented in this country.
Chavez was a noble man. He did a good job for those who were picking in the fields. Illegal aliens are people. No one disputes that. However, when the government is doing nothing to stem the flow of so many coming in, then drastic measures like these will occur, and many will have no choice but to support them because the government does nothing.
Where is your concern for America? |
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