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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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 Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 11:43 am Post subject: |
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Um, just so we're clear (or a little less unclear, perhaps) I'm not trying to piss you off just trying to reach (and express) my own understanding of this thread. (and I haven't even started the book in question yet!)
Anyway, I like to think that people usually know when I'm trying to piss them off  |
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2006 11:48 am Post subject: |
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| Bulsajo wrote: |
| ...just trying to reach (and express) my own understanding. |
My caveat can be reduced to this: we should perhaps be very wary of Woodward, informed as he is, interesting as he is, notwithstanding.
As far as the rest, I am a little disappointed to see his and his publishers' so obviously cashing in on the war. He could get his information out through investigative reporting via the Post. But he is writing, so far, a trilogy of hard-covers at $30 each instead... |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 4:39 pm Post subject: |
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Bulsajo has made the point clearly enough. I have not seen you, gopher, take the same tack with any other book. Thus, the question is, why this book and why this writer? There are far greater targets out there making money with far less integrity and far less usefulness to the general public. This is not to imply that I am thrilled with him making all that money.
Why a book? I am fairly certain he has reached a far greater audience via books, and a wider one, as opposed to a newspaper article, or a series of them. Why hard cover? That's just how it goes: Hardcover to softcover. The price? Seems a bit much to me. Why don't you write him a letter asking him to drop the profit to reach a wider audience and let more Americans have access? |
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cbclark4
Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 5:16 pm Post subject: |
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If you don't like the price it can be had at the Library.
cbc |
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Pligganease
Joined: 14 Sep 2004
Location: The deep south...
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| Posted: Thu Nov 23, 2006 5:57 pm Post subject: |
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| EFLtrainer wrote: |
| Thus, the question is, why this book and why this writer? There are far greater targets out there making money with far less integrity and far less usefulness to the general public. |
Man, you act like Bob Woodward has just written the "Wyld Stallyns" of non-fiction. Were you that impressed with him when his first two books came out? I'm curious to know if you thought his books were useful and he had so much integrity when he was giving kudos to George Bush and selling paperback advertisements for the Republican Party?
It seems to me you are only loving this guy now that he is condemning the Bush administration. Also, I think you are seriously overstating Woodward's "usefulness to the general public." It goes only as far as the money that can be made from the general public, and I'm willing to bet that if Bush still had high approval ratings you'd still be seeing books from him that tell about the great things Bush and Co. have done.
That's integrity, folks. Don't tell the truth, tell what sells. |
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EFLtrainer
Joined: 04 May 2005
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 2:00 am Post subject: |
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| Pligganease wrote: |
| EFLtrainer wrote: |
| Thus, the question is, why this book and why this writer? There are far greater targets out there making money with far less integrity and far less usefulness to the general public. |
Man, you act like Bob Woodward has just written the "Wyld Stallyns" of non-fiction. Were you that impressed with him when his first two books came out? I'm curious to know if you thought his books were useful and he had so much integrity when he was giving kudos to George Bush and selling paperback advertisements for the Republican Party?
It seems to me you are only loving this guy now that he is condemning the Bush administration. Also, I think you are seriously overstating Woodward's "usefulness to the general public." It goes only as far as the money that can be made from the general public, and I'm willing to bet that if Bush still had high approval ratings you'd still be seeing books from him that tell about the great things Bush and Co. have done.
That's integrity, folks. Don't tell the truth, tell what sells. |
I didn't think I was being subtle. You have completely missed the point. |
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bucheon bum
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Pligganease wrote: |
I'm curious to know if you thought his books were useful and he had so much integrity when he was giving kudos to George Bush and selling paperback advertisements for the Republican Party?
It seems to me you are only loving this guy now that he is condemning the Bush administration. Also, I think you are seriously overstating Woodward's "usefulness to the general public." It goes only as far as the money that can be made from the general public, and I'm willing to bet that if Bush still had high approval ratings you'd still be seeing books from him that tell about the great things Bush and Co. have done.
That's integrity, folks. Don't tell the truth, tell what sells. |
This is stretching it.
Have you read any of the 3? Can you quote a passage where he is "giving kudos to George Bush"? Do you really think the only reason he's critical of Bush because he knew it would sell better?
I do agree, however, that EFLTrainer is supporting him simply because his latest book is critical of Bush. |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 12:22 pm Post subject: |
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To recap: 2 pages (so far) of arguing about books which most of the people in the thread have never read, and probably never will...
... that's why I love this place!
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Gopher
Joined: 04 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Bulsajo wrote: |
| To recap... |
Sorry you feel this way. As I attempted to explain, I have read and enjoyed several of Woodward's accts. Here they are, in case that was not clear: All the President's Men; Veil; and Shadow. (I also skimmed Bernstein's The Final Days, which is also helpful in following Nixon's resignation.) I highly recommend Veil, but also suggest reading Persico's Casey and Gate's memoirs on Casey to get a fully-rounded view of the man -- and to better see, up-close, some of Woodward's shortcomings to better handle him critically.
I also think writing about ongoing wars, particularly this ongoing war, and particularly this President, is highly problematic. I also voiced my general objections to and concerns with Woodward's work, particularly his apparent cashing in on this issue to sell multiple, hardcover books.
My usual camp follower came and launched his usual "I'm going to expose your conspiratorial, partisan, agenda!" tirade to try to descredit my views. In doing so, he confirms his inability -- or worse: unwillingness -- to get out of the "crossfire" (is your view "on the left" or "on the right"?) polarity.
However this may be, you asked, I answered, and, as always, you can do with it what you want...
Last edited by Gopher on Fri Nov 24, 2006 3:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Bulsajo
Joined: 16 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Fri Nov 24, 2006 2:44 pm Post subject: |
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Not directed at you Gopher (I refer you to the qualifier "most" in my sentence);
Not directed at anyone, really, but I think it is an accurate comment.
Heck, I started this thread on the book and I haven't read it (in fact I still haven't even cracked it open yet! I'm trying to finished the complete Yes Minister)
And I do love this place at times, warts and all; I think you assumed sarcasm in my post when there was none... usually sarcasm is a pretty safe bet when it comes to me- but not this time, companero! |
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