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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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 Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 7:34 pm Post subject: What would you take in lieu of a pay raise? |
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Imagine that your boss comes to the annual nego table offering you a big, fat, sparkling™ goose egg -- a 0% salary increase, which of course is effectively a pay cut considering inflation. Anyway, that's his offer: "You agree to keep working at last year's pay, and I agree not to sack your ass. Deal?"
Assuming you really wanted to stay on, what would you want at your current place of work in lieu of more cash? Or, if this has actually happened to you in the past, what did you bargain for (whether you got it or not) instead of a raise? |
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Leopard-Skin Pill-Box Hat
Joined: 01 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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Did you already ask him about it? If I think I deserve a raise and none is forthcoming, I usually ask about it. Some might say this in not Korean style or whatever, but I'm not Korean (and anyway I do it with all due respect etc.).
If you have discussed it and he plainly said no (also to getting a bonus), then that's pretty much that I would think. Not sure of any substitutes... You could try negotiating something like working less hours, but that might be even more tedious.
I think it all boils down to how useful you are. If you think he really needs you around, you might call his bluff, but if you're more or less expendable then I doubt there's much you can do. |
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willneverteachagain
Joined: 17 Dec 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| ask for a better house or less hours. if he's not going to offer u anything move on and look for a school that actually wants u and tel him to *beep* off |
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eamo
Joined: 08 Mar 2003
Location: Shepherd's Bush, 1964.
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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| For me it would be a toss-up between a better apartment or more vacation. |
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jinju
Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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| A pay raise. |
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Kyrei
Joined: 22 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:15 pm Post subject: |
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| A handshake and a hearty goodbye. |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:51 pm Post subject: |
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Okay, let me revise the premise here:
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| Assuming you REALLY, REALLY wanted to stay on -- because even at last year's pay it's better than what other places are offering, because it's work you like and want to continue doing, because this job with this company is a strategic step towards your greater goals, etc., etc. -- what would you want at your current place of work in lieu of more cash? |
There now. Accept the premise as stated and stop trying to wriggle out of it, some of you. 
Rule of the Game #1: You are staying where you are. Moving to another company isn't an option. Maybe in later years, but not at this point.
Rule of the Game #2: A pay raise is not an option, so stop saying that, Jinju.
FTR, this isn't about me. At least not now. My current boss is a hard-assed stubborn old mule, there's just no negotiating with him. This is about the rest of you.
To kick this off, here are things I've finagled out of previous tightfisted employers, either in lieu of any salary hike at all or as compensation for an unsatisfactorily small one:
(not limited to jobs in the ROK)
-- an extra week (!) of vacation
-- a bigger office w/better view
-- Economy  Business Class upgrade on vacation tickets
-- an end to tedious, time-wasting weekly reports that served no purpose other than to chew up my time and interrupt real work
-- a personal secretary/assistant (previously had to share one)
-- car & driver for morning/evening commute (more of a hassle than I expected, so when they carped about it, I happily exchanged it for a monthly transportation stipend
-- new computer, monitor, printer & fax (stupid Mickey Mouse battles over limited supplies, always being last in line for upgrades, I finally put my foot down)
Stuff I angled for but never got:
-- bigger & better accommodations
-- OT pay
-- promotion w/o additional pay |
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hubba bubba
Joined: 24 Oct 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 8:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Vacation. |
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The Bobster
Joined: 15 Jan 2003
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:00 pm Post subject: |
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| eamo wrote: |
| For me it would be a toss-up between a better apartment or more vacation. |
Yeah, or one hour less per day on the job and assurances that he would sign the paperwork to let me teach legally part-time elsewhere If he can't give me a pay raise, I gotta make the money elsewhere, I figure ...
Why would I stay, though? If I don't have enough on the ball to be at least 7 - 15% better at my job in the same place after 12 months at it, he's a fool to want me to there at all ... and why would I want to work for a fool?
The only reason I might consider staying is if I like the venue for reasons having nothing to do with the fool who's paying me. Lotta factors could feed into a scenario like that, actually. |
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faster
Joined: 03 Sep 2006
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:03 pm Post subject: |
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In my previous job, I had topped out in salary, so my last contract included an extra 4 weeks unpaid vacay and an extra 2 weeks paid vacay (in addition to the one paid / one unpaid I already had).
I'll take time over money anytime, as long as my material needs aren't threatened. |
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PimpofKorea
Joined: 09 Dec 2006
Location: Dealing in high quality imported English
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:37 pm Post subject: |
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| A BJ from his wife or daughter everyday for the next year would definitely win me over. |
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JongnoGuru
Joined: 25 May 2004
Location: peeing on your doorstep
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| The Bobster wrote: |
| eamo wrote: |
| For me it would be a toss-up between a better apartment or more vacation. |
Yeah, or one hour less per day on the job and assurances that he would sign the paperwork to let me teach legally part-time elsewhere. If he can't give me a pay raise, I gotta make the money elsewhere, I figure... |
Income is one part of the equation, savings is the bottom line. I sometimes managed to reach my income/savings targets merely by economising, and had a lot of room for that. Or by mixing a small amount of fiscal conservatism with a little moonlighting (at home, computer-based, at night, cash & carry, no paper trail). Finally, employers are only one source of income, and earned (from the sweat of one's labour) income is only one category in the total income picture. We need to consider there are others as well, and they can outpace any pay raise we might or might not get.
| Quote: |
| Why would I stay, though? If I don't have enough on the ball to be at least 7 - 15% better at my job in the same place after 12 months at it, he's a fool to want me to there at all ... and why would I want to work for a fool? |
Ideally, sure. But the real world, the business world, is very far from ideal. Individual companies and entire industries will lurch from boom to bust, from feast to famine, and back again. Just ask U.S. airline employees who've taken pay cut after pay cut. Just ask all the Koreans & other Asians who were "downsized", who worked for banks & companies & chaebol that no longer exist post-IMF. Or ask the thousands of Koreans who work for those companies that have only managed to survive the fall-out because everyone across the board agreed to wage or bonus freezes. I've been in situations like that, and it wasn't because I wasn't "on the ball" or because my boss was a "fool" that I wasn't offered a salary hike.
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| The only reason I might consider staying is if I like the venue for reasons having nothing to do with the fool who's paying me. Lotta factors could feed into a scenario like that, actually. |
Yes. Those are among the very factors that led me to stay and negotiate for non-salary benefits. There are workplaces so disagreeable that they would have to pay me (or you) well beyond what we're worth to them, just as there are good places where we'd choose to remain in spite of higher salaries elsewhere. |
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RACETRAITOR
Joined: 24 Oct 2005
Location: Seoul, South Korea
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 9:51 pm Post subject: |
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| hubba bubba wrote: |
| Vacation. |
That to me is more important than more money. |
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Leopard-Skin Pill-Box Hat
Joined: 01 Apr 2007
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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um... frankly it's hard to say. The obvious ones people have already suggested would be less hours or more vacation. Other than that, it pretty much depends on your specific situation I would think. It's hard to give advice when we don't know the fine print.
How about this: if you want more money, ask for more hours, with a possibility of overtime pay (i.e. outside you contract schedule, paid by the hour). |
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merlot
Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Location: I tried to contain myself but I escaped.
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| Posted: Tue May 22, 2007 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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They couldn't possibly pay me more and I get all the time off I request, tax-free US dollars, a five day work week with a half day off on Fridays and a nice work environment.
I guess the only thing left is a car, but actually they do give me one when clients are in town--a Mercedes SUV, no less.
So, I suppose a personal car is what I'd try and negotiate, but that ain't happening. |
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