Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[hela]

Dear teachers,

Is it true that we cannot use SINCE with the simple past except in clauses like:

It has been 2 months SINCE [she ARRIVED in NY.] = clause

but could we also say: "It has been 2 months SINCE she HAS ARRIVED in NY." ??

FOR, on the other hand, can be used with perfect and simple tenses, isn't that right?

Would you please give us some examples?

Many thanks,
Hela

[bud]

Hi Hela,

My intuition says you cannot use since with the simple past. In your example, since begins the clause since she arrived in NY, but I'd say that technically it (the word, the clause) is being used with the present perfect, not the simple past. The simple past is used only to provide detail, but the sentence is in the present perfect. You could not say, "It was two months since..." ... Or look at it like this: since she arrived in NY is just another way of saying since last year (or whatever)... Does anyone out there know differently? Please chime in.

I think probably, "... since she has arrived..." is incorrect. If I'm wrong, then it certainly is a very unusual construction.

You are correct about for:

Simple Past -
She waited for over an hour. (waiting is over)
He owned that house for forty years. (no longer owns it)
It snowed for two days straight. (snowstorm is over)

Present Perfect -
She has waited for over an hour. (still waiting)
He has owned that house for forty years. (still owns it)
It has snowed for two days straight. (still snowing)

Hope that helps.

[helen1]

Hi

I would agree with Bud -

since cannot be used with Simple past - as the simple past refers to something that is complete/finished and since (in this use) suggests a continuation in time - however as with Bud's example it was two months since she arrived in New York since with the simple past can be used in narration

I also agree with Bud that in the example you give the main verb is
has been and therefore present perfect, and that since she has arrived is not possible.

Helen.

[hela]

Hello everyone,

when talking about past time is is true that we always have to use the simple present when we ask a question with "when" and the present perfect in a question with "how long"?

ex: a) When DID you GO to the cinema?
b) How long HAVE they STAYED under the bridge ?� �For half an hour.�

Can we say: �How long DID they STAY under the bridge ?� �For half an hour.� ??

Many thanks,
Hela

[bud]

All of your examples are correct. I think the "rules" in your question are good guidelines, but not absolutes.