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river1974
Joined: 20 May 2003 Posts: 525 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 8:52 pm Post subject: that |
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Dear teachers:
In the radio set, what actually happens is that turning the tuning knob lengthens or shortens the electron path inside the radio.
Could I omit "that" in the above?
Thanks. |
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bud
Joined: 09 Mar 2003 Posts: 2111 Location: New Jersey, US
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Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 9:59 am Post subject: |
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I'm pretty sure it's ok. |
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TALA
Joined: 14 Mar 2005 Posts: 52
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Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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I'm wondering whethere there is a rule of omitting "that"? Can "that" alway be omitted?
Like, I know that he keeps a pet dog. I think that we can omit that, right? |
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bud
Joined: 09 Mar 2003 Posts: 2111 Location: New Jersey, US
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Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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I don't know of a rule, but that doesn't mean there isn't a rule... But no, sometimes it is needed... You are correct that it can be deleted in your example.
I learned years ago in a business writing class that "that" can very often be eliminated in sentences such as these. (I think it is necessary in this sentence.) Eliminating the unnecessary ones makes for much less monotonous writing. (I doubt my own approach is very useful for ESL: I eliminate it and then judge whether or not the sentence "sounds" correct.) |
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river1974
Joined: 20 May 2003 Posts: 525 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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The fact that he has fully recovered makes me feel good. (noun+that)
In the above, could "that" be omitted? |
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river1974
Joined: 20 May 2003 Posts: 525 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 7:36 pm Post subject: |
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I just found another example regarding the "noun+that" construction as follows.
As you have been informed by the Notification *that* the captioned application has entered into the substantive examination procedures from now on,...
Could "that" be omitted?
Thanks. |
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bud
Joined: 09 Mar 2003 Posts: 2111 Location: New Jersey, US
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Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 10:48 am Post subject: |
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Both of them are tough calls, River. I'm really not sure about either of them.
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The fact that he has fully recovered makes me feel good. (noun+that) |
My guess is probably not.
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As you have been informed by the Notification *that* the captioned application has entered into the substantive examination procedures from now on,... |
Again, I think probably not.
Sorry I can't be more of more help. |
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river1974
Joined: 20 May 2003 Posts: 525 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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Thank you bud. I've checked the grammar reference and found "that" here in my examples is used as an "appositive". Maybe in such usage, "that" could not be omitted. (just my conjecture) |
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bud
Joined: 09 Mar 2003 Posts: 2111 Location: New Jersey, US
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Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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We've already exceeded my knowledge on this topic much earlier in the thread!
Good work, River! |
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