Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[navi]

Which ones are correct (they are supposed to mean the same):

1-The heroic ones of the soldiers might do something like that.
2-The heroic ones of soldiers might do something like that.

3-The heros of the soldiers might do something like that.
4-The heros of soldiers might do something like that.

I think 3 and 4 are correct but they don't mean the same as 1 and 2. They mean people who are considered by (the) soldiers to be heros and not the heros among (the) soldiers.

[bud]

Navi, consider the following as a guess more so than as an answer:

I think all of them are correct. I think each of them could take either meaning, depending on the context. I think in 1 and 3, the heroes (or heroic ones) are more likely to be among the group of soldiers. I think in 2 and 4, the heroes are more likely to be outside the group of soldiers.

[bud]

Navi, this question keeps popping up in my brain...

Now I feel more confident that my earlier response was more of an answer than a guess. "Heroic ones" is a very close synonym to "heroes." Sometimes it might be not quite as strong as "heroes," but most times it will be an exact synonym. It doesn't do anything towards hinting at whether the heroes are part of the group of soldiers, or outside that group.

The only grammatical difference is whether you use "the" in front of "soldiers." Without it, "soldiers" becomes a general concept, so we are really talking about all soldiers. Since not all soldiers are aware of each other, it becomes more likely that the common heores are not among them. (Or they are soldiers from history, not among the current group.)

When we use "the," we are now talking about a specific group. The group we are talking about would be known previous to these sample sentences. Since we are talking about a specific group, my guess would be that the bravest among them is what is intended. It's not necessarily so, but I'd say that's the most probable intented meaning.