|
Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Students and Teachers from Around the World!"
|
| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
BourneNOIR
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 113
|
 Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 6:41 am Post subject: Attacking U.S. = Attacking people around the world |
 |
|
What's actually driving some people wanting to destroy the US? The Islamic fascists, namely.
I admit, no country is perfect. The US sucks in some of its domestic and international policies, but is it really necessary to kill its people on purpose by committing acts of terrorism? What are these people trying to achieve? What do these people want?
I'm a citizen of the US, but I'm no "Yank" as many think of an American. As a matter of fact, I'm a Taiwanese American, and just like many of the citizens here we're all immigrants from another country. Do these people realize that there's really no single definition of "American"? Here in the US, there are Muslims, Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Pagans, any many other people with different religious beliefs. Living in the US for a majority of my life has taught me to tolerate, respect, and learn about different people of different background. Do these Islamic fascists know that when they kill "Americans" they're also killing Muslims, Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Pagans, etc.? What's common for these people are that we're all taking advantage of the enormous amount of democracy and freedom to improve our lives, is that wrong in the eyes of Islamic facists?
Yes, the US is nosy in many respects. It is extremely influential in many of the international policies. But it can't really help it, because it's such a large and complex nation composed of so many people from different backgrounds. Sometimes certain polices will hurt other countries, and I guess that's how the US is making enemies. Then again, many countries have double/multiple standards to protect its self-interest. For example, most Democratic countries in Western Europe are supporting Communist China as opposed to a Democratic Taiwan. It just so happens that the US is the biggest target and scapegoat.
People complain about war in Iraq. Yes, it's bad. But did these same people complain to those who were responsible for the terrorist attack on 9/11? Did these same people complain to Saddam Hussein about the mistreatment of the Iraqi people? Did these same people hold demonstration rallies in Middle East with signs that say "Stop Terrorism Against the US" or "Stop Hiding in the Shadow Like a Coward and Fight in the Open" or "Stop Suicide Boming"?
All countries have flaws, all governments have corruptions. It's the quality of life of the people that counts. I guess if the US feels that the quality of life of its citizens are threatened, it will forcefully "neutralize" the source (both direct and indirect) of the threat by injecting Democracy into the country so it'll be more like the US. That's the one-line explanation of the war in Iraq.
Last edited by BourneNOIR on Mon Aug 14, 2006 12:28 pm; edited 2 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
alks
Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 3
Location: mexico
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 7:40 am Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
| BourneNOIR wrote: |
What's actually driving some people wanting to destroy the US? The Islamic fascists, namely.
I admit, no country is perfect. The US sucks in some of its domestic and international policies, but is it really necessary to kill its people on purpose by committing acts of terrorism? What are these people trying to achieve? What do these people want?
I'm a citizen of the US, but I'm no "Yank" as many think of an American. As a matter of fact, I'm a Taiwanese American, and just like many of the citizens here we're all immigrants from another country. Do these people realize that there's really no single definition of "American"? Here in the US, there are Muslims, Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Pagans, any many other people with different religious beliefs. Living in the US for a majority of my life has taught me to tolerate, respect, and learn about different people of different background. Do these Islamic fascists know that when they kill "Americans" they're also killing Muslims, Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Pagans, etc.? What's common for these people are that we're all taking advantage of the enormous amount of democracy and freedom to improve our lives, is that wrong in the eyes of Islamic facists?
Yes, the US is nosy in many respects. It is extremely influential in many of the international policies. But it can't really help it, because it's such a large and complex nation composed of so many people from different backgrounds. Sometimes certain polices will hurt other countries, and I guess that's how the US is making enemies. Then again, many countries have double/multiple standards to protect its self-interest. For example, most Democratic countries in Western Europe are supporting Communist China in favor of a Democratic Taiwan. It just so happens that the US is the biggest target and scapegoat.
People complain about war in Iraq. Yes, it's bad. But did these same people complain to those who were responsible for the terrorist attack on 9/11? Did these same people complain to Saddam Hussein about the mistreatment of the Iraqi people? Did these same people hold demonstration rallies in Middle East with signs that say "Stop Terrorism Against the US" or "Stop Hiding in the Shadow Like a Coward and Fight in the Open" or "Stop Suicide Boming"?
All countries have flaws, all governments have corruptions. It's the quality of life of the people that counts. I guess if the US feels that the quality of life of its citizens are threatened, it will forcefully "neutralize" the source (both direct and indirect) of the threat by injecting Democracy into the country so it'll be more like the US. That's the one-line explanation of the war in Iraq. |
for years united states as many countries in europe have been devastating and destroying many countries in america, asia and africa, people are traying to defend their country, their families; now we can see that the true reason for iraq's attack was pettrolium and that the judish are so inhuman that no matter bombs are killing children and disarmed people, now i remember why adolph hitler said "germany didn't lost the war, the world do", and why judish are known as the "damn race", and so you could understand what is happening, they control economies through banks, mainly, fmi, worl bank and many transnationals companies who explote natural resources, people, and corrupt goverments, and the onu is just a burocratic organism just to support all of these attrocities
_________________
i'm interested in prexctising english thruogh reading articles analyses |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BourneNOIR
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 113
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:45 am Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
| alks wrote: |
| for years united states as many countries in europe have been devastating and destroying many countries in america, asia and africa, people are traying to defend their country, their families; |
Where did you learn that? Devastating and destroying countries? I admit US did participated in international issues that failed miserably with disastrous outcomes. But does that mean it's alright to kill all Americans? Even those who just emigrated there for a better life? Even those who are not Jewish? Your profile says you're from Mexico. Do you know how many illegal immigrants from Mexico flock to the US for a better life? Do you know that by trying to kill all Americans the Islamic fascists will also end up killing your fellow Mexicans?
| alks wrote: |
| now we can see that the true reason for iraq's attack was pettrolium and that the judish are so inhuman that no matter bombs are killing children and disarmed people, |
I understand there are poor countries, rich countries, and countries in between. All these countries see things differently. Poor countries will hate rich countries for being rich. If the US is in Iraq only for the petrol, it could have just blasted its way through Baghdad, kill everyone in its path, screw the innocent Iraqis, replace any government in power with its own government, claim Iraq as a territory of the US, start pumping oil to the US, and disregard how the Iraqis feel, especially how the oil crisis is today.
| alks wrote: |
| now i remember why adolph hitler said "germany didn't lost the war, the world do", and why judish are known as the "damn race", and so you could understand what is happening, they control economies through banks, mainly, fmi, worl bank and many transnationals companies who explote natural resources, people, and corrupt goverments, and the onu is just a burocratic organism just to support all of these attrocities |
I don't understand your reasoning and I'm not going to talk about race. If you play the race card, I can definitely outplay you. If you believe what Hitler said, you're one sad human being. There are other countries that influence the world economy, are you going to get them too? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
flying_pig319
Joined: 01 Jul 2006
Posts: 369
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 5:18 pm Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
I agree with you about 100%, Noir, especially about the racial things.
Looking for a scapegoat will never do any good.
_________________
peace-monger |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ieltsinsider
Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 170
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 5:46 pm Post subject: sense! |
|
|
It seems that we have one more reasonable person on this forum!
BourneNOIR, you raise some excellent points. I particularly like the one about multicultural America. We get so many people saying, "Hey, all the religions and people's of the world should live in peace." Though America isn't a perfect example of that, it is as close as we have in the modern world. So, what happens? Some people want to destroy it and others just seem to want to criticise it!
As I have said so many times here, rememebr that the Islamic Fascists want to kill every single person who does not agree with their particular view of Islam. This means that they even want to kill most Muslims! You cannot even start to compare American foreign policy with these psychos!
On another issue, as a European, I am utterly sickened by Europe's attitude to China. We'll be selling them hi-tech weapons soon and creating instability in East Asia. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
k.m.m
Joined: 23 Jul 2006
Posts: 121
Location: Riyadh
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:41 pm Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
| BourneNOIR wrote: |
What's actually driving some people wanting to destroy the US? The Islamic fascists, namely.
. |
I think Al qaeda is just A BUSH BOOGEMAN ?
http://reopen911.org/Is%20Al%20Qaeda%20Just%20a%20Bush%20Boogeyman.htm
If Osama bin Laden does, in fact, head a vast international terrorist organization with trained operatives in more than 40 countries, as claimed by Bush, why, despite torture of prisoners, has this administration failed to produce hard evidence of it?
� How can it be that in Britain since 9/11, 664 people have been detained on suspicion of terrorism but only 17 have been found guilty, most of them with no connection to Islamist groups and none who were proven members of Al Qaeda?
� Why have we heard so much frightening talk about "dirty bombs" when experts say it is panic rather than radioactivity that would kill people?
� Why did Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld claim on "Meet the Press" in 2001 that Al Qaeda controlled massive high-tech cave complexes in Afghanistan, when British and U.S. military forces later found no such thing?
Los Angeles Times - Los Angeles, Calif.
Author: ROBERT SCHEER
Date: Jan 11, 2005
???????????
9/11: The Fake Opposition
A message by Peter Meyer
sent to a mailing list on 2003-11-27
For every action, there is an opposite and equal reaction. This is true in physics and true in warfare.
http://www.serendipity.li/wot/fake_opposition.htm
????
Osama bin CIA Agent................
http://www.public-action.com/911/ob_cia.html
????????? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ieltsinsider
Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 170
|
| Posted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 10:05 pm Post subject: tell osama |
|
|
If Al Qaeda is a myth and Bin Laden is a CIA agent, Bush should definitely be told. But first, tell Bin Laden himself. He seems to have forgotten.
Enough evidence has been found, but some people won't be satisifed until they see a bank transfer order with "This money comes from the Al Qaeda account in ... and is going to ... a member of Al Qaeda" on it.
Trials take time. One of the 'problems' of living in a democracy - you can't just accuse someone and put a bullet in their head without consequences. If a person in Britain commits a crime, they are considered innocent until proven guilty. The person can still be guilty, even though they are being considered (for legal purposes) innocent. A person could still be guilty even after being found innocent, e.g. they could get off on a technicality. A lot of the people arrested in Britain were only arrested because they refused to talk to police voluntarily. Once arrested, they had to account for themselves. Again, blame the legal system, not the police.
Dirty bombs. Could happen, but it's media scaremongering mainly. The media has more to answer for than Bush does.
As for the caves point, the word 'later' is interesting. Actually cave complexes have been found by British and American forces, as well as by Afghan forces and Pakistani forces. The Russians found some too while they were in Afghanistan. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BourneNOIR
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 113
|
| Posted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 9:07 am Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
| k.m.m wrote: |
| I think Al qaeda is just A BUSH BOOGEMAN ? |
Al-Qaeda did not "just exist" during the Bush administration. It existed long before that, during the end of Cold War in fact, after the invasion of Soviet Union into Afghanistan. They were also responsible for the attacks during the Clinton administration, are they Clinton's "boogeman" too? It's good that you're exercising your freedom to think, but please be mindful of actual historical facts before pulling things out of thin air.
| k.m.m wrote: |
| If Osama bin Laden does, in fact, head a vast international terrorist organization with trained operatives in more than 40 countries, as claimed by Bush, why, despite torture of prisoners, has this administration failed to produce hard evidence of it? |
Yeah, I'm sure there are no unsolved/unclosed cases in the history of law enforcement. All criminals can be identified easily and that the terrorist members walk around dressed in Al-Qaeda uniforms with signs saying, "I'm a terrorist". On the contrary, if this is a conspiracy and Bush wants to look good, why doesn't he just force some people to admit that they're Al-Qaeda members and make up numbers showing the success rate of capturing terrorists, rather than showing some of the unsuccessful attempts and make himself look bad? Did you think about that or are you easily swayed by anti-American theories?
| k.m.m wrote: |
| � How can it be that in Britain since 9/11, 664 people have been detained on suspicion of terrorism but only 17 have been found guilty, most of them with no connection to Islamist groups and none who were proven members of Al Qaeda? |
Did they check their ID? I'm sure it says "Membership: Al-Qaeda" on them. Or maybe they should call Al-Qaeda's Human Resource Department to see if those people are on the payroll.
I'm not even gonna bother with the rest of the ridiculous "conspiracy theories" since ieltsinsider had already addressed them. This is what sucks about Democracy and the freedom of speech. People are allowed to say whatever they want, even unfounded conspiracy theories that damage a nation's reputation. What's even worse is that there are people who actually believe them.
| ieltsinsider wrote: |
| Trials take time. One of the 'problems' of living in a democracy - you can't just accuse someone and put a bullet in their head without consequences. If a person in Britain commits a crime, they are considered innocent until proven guilty. The person can still be guilty, even though they are being considered (for legal purposes) innocent. A person could still be guilty even after being found innocent, e.g. they could get off on a technicality. A lot of the people arrested in Britain were only arrested because they refused to talk to police voluntarily. Once arrested, they had to account for themselves. Again, blame the legal system, not the police. |
Yeah, this is another thing that sucks about the Democratic judicial system: you're "innocent until proven guilty". People got off easy not because they're proven innocent, it's because you don't have sufficient incriminating evidence (keyword: sufficient). Not that you don't have evidence, but "sufficient" evidence. So if the suspect refuses to produce evidence or does not arouse suspicion for you to even obtain a warrant, you have to let him/her go. How come these terrorists don't target China? China is becoming an influential economic power and they're not Muslims. Maybe China will have a higher success rate at capturing Al-Qaeda members since all suspects are "guilty until proven innocent" under the Communist system. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
k.m.m
Joined: 23 Jul 2006
Posts: 121
Location: Riyadh
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 12:42 am Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
| BourneNOIR wrote: |
| k.m.m wrote: |
| I think Al qaeda is just A BUSH BOOGEMAN ? |
Al-Qaeda did not "just exist" during the Bush administration. It existed long before that, during the end of Cold War in fact, after the invasion of Soviet Union into Afghanistan. They were also responsible for the attacks during the Clinton administration, are they Clinton's "boogeman" too? It's good that you're exercising your freedom to think, but please be mindful of actual historical facts before pulling things out of thin air.
| k.m.m wrote: |
| If Osama bin Laden does, in fact, head a vast international terrorist organization with trained operatives in more than 40 countries, as claimed by Bush, why, despite torture of prisoners, has this administration failed to produce hard evidence of it? |
Yeah, I'm sure there are no unsolved/unclosed cases in the history of law enforcement. All criminals can be identified easily and that the terrorist members walk around dressed in Al-Qaeda uniforms with signs saying, "I'm a terrorist". On the contrary, if this is a conspiracy and Bush wants to look good, why doesn't he just force some people to admit that they're Al-Qaeda members and make up numbers showing the success rate of capturing terrorists, rather than showing some of the unsuccessful attempts and make himself look bad? Did you think about that or are you easily swayed by anti-American theories?
| k.m.m wrote: |
| � How can it be that in Britain since 9/11, 664 people have been detained on suspicion of terrorism but only 17 have been found guilty, most of them with no connection to Islamist groups and none who were proven members of Al Qaeda? |
Did they check their ID? I'm sure it says "Membership: Al-Qaeda" on them. Or maybe they should call Al-Qaeda's Human Resource Department to see if those people are on the payroll.
I'm not even gonna bother with the rest of the ridiculous "conspiracy theories" since ieltsinsider had already addressed them. This is what sucks about Democracy and the freedom of speech. People are allowed to say whatever they want, even unfounded conspiracy theories that damage a nation's reputation. What's even worse is that there are people who actually believe them.
| ieltsinsider wrote: |
| Trials take time. One of the 'problems' of living in a democracy - you can't just accuse someone and put a bullet in their head without consequences. If a person in Britain commits a crime, they are considered innocent until proven guilty. The person can still be guilty, even though they are being considered (for legal purposes) innocent. A person could still be guilty even after being found innocent, e.g. they could get off on a technicality. A lot of the people arrested in Britain were only arrested because they refused to talk to police voluntarily. Once arrested, they had to account for themselves. Again, blame the legal system, not the police. |
Yeah, this is another thing that sucks about the Democratic judicial system: you're "innocent until proven guilty". People got off easy not because they're proven innocent, it's because you don't have sufficient incriminating evidence (keyword: sufficient). Not that you don't have evidence, but "sufficient" evidence. So if the suspect refuses to produce evidence or does not arouse suspicion for you to even obtain a warrant, you have to let him/her go. How come these terrorists don't target China? China is becoming an influential economic power and they're not Muslims. Maybe China will have a higher success rate at capturing Al-Qaeda members since all suspects are "guilty until proven innocent" under the Communist system. |
BourneNOIR :
We know that...it does exist...And as you say long before...even before Clinton...all that we know..?Osama bin laden was the best friend of both US and Saudi during the cold war during Russia invasion of Afghanistan, he got help from both. no one can deny this ��he was the good tool to fight U.S.S.R. During that time �so he was very close alia to CIA..SAME AS Saddan in his war against Iran during the 80s �we know also his family "Bin laden" is one of the richest family here in Saudi and still rich.. " by the way Saudi low doesn't allow to punish or destroy them because of bad and guilty member of them" ..Also we know they have "the family " construction company (Ben Laden Group )whic is one of the biggest in middle east costruction company managed bysaudies and christian labanees it doing good busniss here and in Dubai and all over the glob ..They built Kuala lumpier Air port on the late 70 s for example..And during the 60es they do the reinforcement of the Jerusalem's dome "new information/historical fact" during 1961-1964 before the Arab �Israeli war. But we all remember the advertising on the American TV. On the 80s name "the forgetting story" about the war in Afghanistan and ask American people to donate $$ to them "who are they "no body ask during that time!!! But the decision makers they know!!The advertisement is to show a child who was crying because of the war and it ask people to donate the cost of one copy of coffee at least to them it was before the ABC news with Ted couple ... �we know that Al Qaeda change their policy to attack both U.S and Saudi...9/11,train bombing in Madrid, London,Casablanca, Bombing and killing our inset people in Riyadh...Abqiq, Jeddah, and so on. We almost every month pay the cost...the question who helped them to kill in 9/11? Madrid, London, Casablanca, and Riyadh �do they work alone .Is their terrorist group in the U.S may be helped them for the disaster of 9/11 such as KKI.etc..."Remember the enemy of your enemy is your friend", in London who arrange them? Helped them? in Madrid may be Eta group helped them ,work with them ��..
So many questions can not be answer some group of people didn�t go for work during that day due to odego some message!!�because not only me and you who doesn't know but so many people �.
We notice also that when ever Mr. Bush administration in tribal, there will be a new threat from al Qaeda!! Or new tape of Osama issued. Does it mean that he is the "BOOGYMAN"!!!!?
This make a question where is he!!I mean Osama." the boogeyman" .!! Gash still in his advanced HI-tech cave in Tura Bura !!
No need to force people. Why to do that and so many they can do this dirty job may be by money. the bad people are every where and sometimes good people are get involve without knowing "stupid" �if it is true the story of 19 Saudi on the planes �may be the terrorist force them to do ,or may be they were kidnapped also �or may be they are bad and terrorist �unfortunately we are the Saudis are very simple and naive " you can check that by your self" we believe what other say , I consider that is stupidity � I know we have been tricked since long time about those kind of people , which they were wear a religious face and they are enemy and bad ..
No ..at all I am not swayed by anti-American theories ..But I think ,I use my mined ..Also I read�.The American people are good people, I have nothing against them �as the fact of the matter my car is American "used one from Nevada" My family and I love to go and visit U.S. but may be because of my name ""Mohammed or Abdullah " we will be consider a terrorist till we prove the opposite, so, it is a wasting time � "may be part of democracy ..we dont know ...!!
take care.. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ieltsinsider
Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 170
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 1:10 am Post subject: terrorism in China |
|
|
| BourneNOIR - There is a recognised terrorist group in China - The Uyghur Liberation Front (or something). The Chinese province of Xinjiang is largely Muslim. It's rare that they actually do anything, but they blew up a bus in Beijing a few years ago and there is intense security in Beijing even now. The USA recognised them as a terrorist group to get China on board with its 'war on terror' policy. A few alleged members were even caught in Afghanistan and sent to Guantanamo Bay. They weren't charged and Albania took them in as China wouldn't take them back. China's keeping a low profile on the world diplomatic stage, but I think they'll have problems with terrorists in the future. Of course, another 'problem' with democracy is that it makes it easier for terrorists to operate. China, of course, has no idea what democracy means! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BourneNOIR
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 113
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 8:36 am Post subject: Re: I don't get it... |
|
|
k.m.m and ieltsinsider, thanks for providing additional information. They're interesting "food for thought".
k.m.m, I have to say I don't quite understand what you're saying or what your main point is, so if I misunderstood, I apologize.
| k.m.m wrote: |
| We know that...it does exist...And as you say long before...even before Clinton...all that we know..?Osama bin laden was the best friend of both US and Saudi during the cold war during Russia invasion of Afghanistan, he got help from both. no one can deny this ��he was the good tool to fight U.S.S.R. During that time �so he was very close alia to CIA..SAME AS Saddan in his war against Iran during the 80s |
Ok, so now you acknowledge that it exists. All nations act with their own self-interest as the highest priority, the goodness that results from the actions are considered as the side effect. Yes, Bin Laden was a tool to counter USSR. Times change, people change, and countries change. USSR no longer exists and the money and weapons sent to Bin Laden is now being used to commit acts of terrorism.
| k.m.m wrote: |
| But we all remember the advertising on the American TV. On the 80s name "the forgetting story" about the war in Afghanistan and ask American people to donate $$ to them "who are they "no body ask during that time!!! But the decision makers they know!!The advertisement is to show a child who was crying because of the war and it ask people to donate the cost of one copy of coffee at least to them it was before the ABC news with Ted couple |
I don't understand this part. Are you saying that the US asked the American people to donate money to support the war in Afghanistan during the 80s? Wasn't that the war against the USSR invasion of Afghanistan? If so, I don't see what your point is. The government knows that money is going to support Bin Laden, but does it matter if the American people know that or not? Al-Qaeda did not attack the US then and the only thing people concerned about was the threat of the Communist Soviet Union.
| k.m.m wrote: |
we know that Al Qaeda change their policy to attack both U.S and Saudi...9/11,train bombing in Madrid, London,Casablanca, Bombing and killing our inset people in Riyadh...Abqiq, Jeddah, and so on. We almost every month pay the cost... the question who helped them to kill in 9/11? Madrid, London, Casablanca, and Riyadh �do they work alone .Is their terrorist group in the U.S may be helped them for the disaster of 9/11 such as KKI.etc..."Remember the enemy of your enemy is your friend", in London who arrange them? Helped them? in Madrid may be Eta group helped them ,work with them ��..
So many questions can not be answer some group of people didn�t go for work during that day due to odego some message!!�because not only me and you who doesn't know but so many people �.
We notice also that when ever Mr. Bush administration in tribal, there will be a new threat from al Qaeda!! Or new tape of Osama issued. Does it mean that he is the "BOOGYMAN"!!!!?
This make a question where is he!!I mean Osama." the boogeyman" .!! Gash still in his advanced HI-tech cave in Tura Bura !! |
This is another part I don't understand. What's this "tribal" thing? Are you implying that the US government is helping them? Why the US? Why not other countries? What does the US gain for helping the terrorists to attack its own people? In a Democratic system, it is very difficult to pull something off like you said. You have the press and everyone else watching. The president is not there forever and the Congress can replace him. Once the president leaves office, dirty scheme can be dig up by the opposing parties (just look at the secret wire-tapping fiasco). Yes, everyone is at risk of being the next target for Al-Qaeda so why isolate the blame and conspiracy theories on the US alone? The terrorists are Islamic fascists who will also kill your fellow Muslims and it's very easy for them to hide among the crowds of innocent people in the Middle East. How come you don't also suggest that there might be countries in the Middle East secretly supporting Al-Qaeda?
| k.m.m wrote: |
| No need to force people. Why to do that and so many they can do this dirty job may be by money. the bad people are every where and sometimes good people are get involve without knowing "stupid" �if it is true the story of 19 Saudi on the planes �may be the terrorist force them to do ,or may be they were kidnapped also �or may be they are bad and terrorist �unfortunately we are the Saudis are very simple and naive " you can check that by your self" we believe what other say , I consider that is stupidity � I know we have been tricked since long time about those kind of people , which they were wear a religious face and they are enemy and bad .. |
We don't know the motivation behind the captured terrorists, but the point is they'll be killing lots of people. If the Saudis are very simple and na�ve (which I believe) why the tendency to hate America? Who's teaching them that? It's good that you recognize the possibility that the enemies "wear a religious face and they are enemy and bad". I know that maybe not everyone in Middle East hate America (I hope), but I get sick every time people in Middle East cheer when America gets attacked. Maybe we need more people like you who don't mind sharing ideas so you can teach your fellow Saudis about not hating America.
| k.m.m wrote: |
No ..at all I am not swayed by anti-American theories ..But I think ,I use my mined ..Also I read�.The American people are good people, I have nothing against them �as the fact of the matter my car is American "used one from Nevada" My family and I love to go and visit U.S. but may be because of my name ""Mohammed or Abdullah " we will be consider a terrorist till we prove the opposite, so, it is a wasting time � "may be part of democracy ..we dont know ...!!
take care.. |
That's good to hear. I don't mind people exercising their freedom of speech, but we need more people like you to think more than to blindly accept conspiracy theories against the US. I know it's not right to discriminate based on names, but I think you know that the US is not taking any chances after losing over 2000 innocent people. This also brings me back to my OP... Even if you take a plane to the US, you may be the target of a terrorist attack... they'll attack anyone even fellow Muslims. Why hating only America when the terrorist are trying to get everyone IN THE WORLD?
p.s. k.m.m. are you from UAE or Saudi Arabia? I'd love to visit Dubai some day, but flying to Middle East from the US kinda scares me� |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ieltsinsider
Joined: 16 May 2006
Posts: 170
|
| Posted: Sun Aug 13, 2006 7:31 pm Post subject: to BourneNOIR |
|
|
| You say that countries act placing their own national interest first. At last, someone who actually understands the real world! Kindly check out some of the other posts and back me up a bit! Many posters here think that we live a cuddly world where everyone wants to be best buddies with everyone else. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
k.m.m
Joined: 23 Jul 2006
Posts: 121
Location: Riyadh
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 4:11 am Post subject: |
|
|
BourneNOIR:
I prefer to change the word HATE to ANGRY...
which is true ....angry of what ??
the situation of the middle east and the way that's U.S. deal with it ...., Iraq, Palestine, who is next ��....???? speaking of interest ..may be the way that's dealt is against our interest ..
"sorry , ,,,the word "trabal " wrong spelling ,I know changed every thing ..I mean "problems
for more. I will be back ...sorry too much work on my table , I have to clear it...
I am from Saudi, I live in Riyadh...
tak care.. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BourneNOIR
Joined: 12 Apr 2006
Posts: 113
|
| Posted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 5:34 am Post subject: |
|
|
| k.m.m wrote: |
BourneNOIR:
I prefer to change the word HATE to ANGRY...
which is true ....angry of what ??
the situation of the middle east and the way that's U.S. deal with it ...., Iraq, Palestine, who is next ��....???? speaking of interest ..may be the way that's dealt is against our interest .. |
Good point. Thanks, I should avoid using the word "hate". It's a strong word and it implies violence and hostility. And yes, I absolutely agree with you that your people have the right to be angry with the US for the way it handles things, not only in the Middle East but in the world as well. I'm angry at the US for the way it's dealing with issues regarding Communist China. It has a double standard: promoting Democracy in Iraq with the use of force while pampering Communism and surpressing the international development of Democratic Taiwan.
I don't have a problem with people being angry with the US and its policies, it's just that people tend to trace terrorism to the Middle East and that would cause some people to assume that terrorism stems from the anger towards the US. I'm just thinking that your people probably should be more active in trying to separate the image of terrorists from regular innocent Muslims, because if the world continues to associate terrorism with the Middle East, there will continue to be policies made to conflict with the interests of your people.
Maybe that's the reason why things will not end:
terrorists fuel the fire -> people associate terrorism with Middle East -> the US meddles with affairs in the Middle East to protect its own interest -> people in the Middle East get angry with the US -> terrorists take advantage of the anger and continues to attack -> repeat cycle... |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
FAQ
Search
Memberlist
Usergroups
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
