Dave's ESL Cafe's Student Discussion Forums

[ClarissaMach]

Hi, teachers! Well, I know that what I am about to ask is difficult to answer with written words, but could you please help me to understand the differences, in terms of pronounce, of the pairs of words below?


Met/ mat
Bet/ bat
Pet/ pat
Head/ had
Dead/ dad
Then/ than

Heard/ herd
Through/ throw
Your/ you�re
Morning/ mourning
Idol/ idle
There/ their
To/ too/ two
Wore/ war

Ship/ sheep
S h i t/ sheet
Fill/ feel
Bit/ Beat
B i t c h/ beach

Pull/ pool
Full/ fool
Whether/ weather
_________________
Stormy Weather.

[redset]

Heh, this would be a lot easier in person (these are called 'minimal pairs' by the way). It might be worth you learning the phonemes used in English from something like this: http://www.paulmeier.com/ipa/diphthongs.html If you click on any of the phonemes it will demonstrate how they sound. Then look at a good dictionary and it will tell you how to say the word phonetically (dictionary.com has a 'Show IPA Pronunciation' link that will do this).

Met/ mat
Bet/ bat
Pet/ pat
Head/ had
Dead/ dad
Then/ than

Each of the words on the left each sound like the one on the right, apart from the vowel sound used. The 'e' sound on the words to the left is pronounced near the front of the mouth, with the mouth slightly open (from that link above, it's the sound you get if you click on ɛ, the one that looks like a rounded E - I'm British though, so people with different accents may pronounce it slightly differently!). The 'a' is pronounced further back in the mouth, with the mouth open wider (isn't this similar in Portugese?).

Heard/ herd These are homophones (they sound the same)
Through/ throw 'Through' has an oo sound, open your mouth just a little bit and the sound comes from the front of your mouth (u on that chart). 'Throw' has your mouth open wider and the sound further back, then move into the 'oo' sound from 'through' (oʊ from the boxes on the right of the chart).
Your/ you�re Homophones


I'll try and come back to this in a bit (or maybe someone else can take a few), I need to jump in the shower!

[ClarissaMach]

Thanks, RedSet!

If your and you're sound the same, it means I've been commiting a terrible mistake since I began to study English, ten years ago...


The pairs I'm really concerned about are s h i t/sheet and b i t c h/beach... I don't want inadvertedly say something rude!!!
_________________
Stormy Weather.

[redset]

Hey that's ok - is this actually useful? It's kinda difficult to describe sounds through text, but hopefully this will give you some idea. Really you need to find a native speaker who can show you these differences in person.

You're and your are basically pronounced the same where I come from, but it could vary slightly with different accents. Some people would pronounce you're like 'you are' without the 'a' sound, so it almost sounds like two syllables. Either way they at least sound very similar, and as long as you're consistent it shouldn't be a problem.

I just found this fantastic site: http://www.uiowa.edu/~acadtech/phonetics/english/english_main.swf It has videos of someone pronouncing the different sounds, I think it will help. I'll link to examples in a second.

As far as the rude words go, click here and click on the play button, watch her mouth and listen to the sound. That's the 'eeee' sound in sheet and beach, and you make it by sort of smiling. (In fact when people take photographs, they often tell you to 'say cheese!' because the 'eeee' sound makes you look like you're smiling.) I don't speak Portugese, but it's the same sound as s� in Spanish if that helps.

Now if you click on this link, you can see and hear the short 'i' sound in shit and bitch. Hear how it's shorter (click the example words) and lower in pitch, and more relaxed? It's the same sound as in 'in', 'hit', 'cooking', 'English' etc.

The same applies for bit/beat, fill/feel and ship/sheep.

As for the words I missed:
Morning/ mourning - This one's difficult, I can't find any good examples and it can really depend on the person's accent. For me, morning has the word or in it, whereas mourning uses the same sound as door, floor, more etc.
Idol/idle - technically idol uses this sound (only a little shorter) and idle uses this one, but in regular speech many people use the second sound for both (that sound is called the schwa, and it's used for unstressed vowels in English. It's the most common vowel sound in the language!)
There/ their - homophones
To/too/two - homophones
Wore/war - same as mourning (wore) and morning (war)

Oh, you sneaked a couple more in
Pull/ pool - This is the sound in pull, and this is the sound in pool.
Full/ fool - same as above
Whether/ weather - homophonic, they use this sound.

I'd really recommend learning these phonemes if you have time - once you know the sounds and the symbols for each, pronouncing a word is as easy as looking in a dictionary and reading off the sequence of sounds you're supposed to make.

[Lorikeet]

A lot of our answers regarding pronunciation will depend on what kind of "English" we are speaking. Mine is American English, so I would never say a speaker of another kind of English is "wrong;" just that I say it differently.

By the way, here is an exercise I did on my website to practice the difference between the sound in "bed" and the sound in "bad":

http://fog.ccsf.cc.ca.us/~lfried/listening/vowel2.html

The most common pronunciation of "you're" sounds exactly like "your." That is why so many native speakers make spelling mistakes and write "your" instead of "you're." You can also pronounce it with the /u/ sound from "pool" but it's absolutely not necessary, and not used much by native speakers. The same goes for "they're" and "their" and "there." They are usually all pronounced the same way (where I am, anyway ). You can also pronounce the "they're" with more of an "ay" sound so it rhymes with "layer" but I don't think it's used as often.

In my speech, I pronounce "then" and "than" the same way. I know there are others who make a distinction. I suppose it helps that the "than" is almost always reduced in a sentence to what some call a schwa, so I would almost never pronounce it with stress.

I too pronounce weather and whether the same. There are, however, some speakers who put a /hw/ instead of /w/ at the beginning of the wh- words. (what, when, why, where, whether, etc.) I think this is going out of American English at least, as my mother used to do it and doesn't anymore.

I pronounce "wore" and "war" exactly the same way. They both have the same vowel as the one in "morning," and most of the time I pronounce "mourning" the same way, but sometimes I pronounce it like "tour" instead.

I pronounce "idle" and "idol" the same.

redset has already explained most of everything (and well, too) so I will just add something that I have my students do to help them with the /i/ sound in "meet". I tell them to say a word like "yes." Then I tell them to make the /y/ sound long. Of course it's hard to show here, but it would be something like yyyyyyyyyes! (all one sound at the beginning) If you hold the beginning sound of yes you will make the /i/ sound. The harder part is to put it in a word.

[ClarissaMach]

Dear teachers, thanks for the help! It's something really important to me. The websites will help me a lot.