Forum name change

[fluffyhamster]

Thanks for the link to Guy Cook's lil' book, metal. Maybe I should've got that instead of wasting my money on that big Blackwell Handbook, eh (and no, I still haven't finished Davies' chapter on the native speaker "for you"). And I didn't learn anything about 'whom' from that big LGSWE that I got a few years ago, either.

I'd say, of late, it doesn't get sorted. What you have is a situation when some posters make it near impossible to discuss anything that they do not see as immediately relevant to their next class, so to speak. They criticise, ridicule, divert, mock, and bring undue attention to certain posts and posters. Those people are dumbing down this forum. Many have left due to such people - I know because I get emails from a few ex-posters.

You're one to talk about criticizing, ridiculing, diverting, mocking and the like, but if I truly am one of the reasons that 'a few' posters have "left" (=no longer post on?) these forums, then I apologize. But to be totally honest, I have to say that I do not really learn very much from most your posts, metal (or from that many posts in general), and have always preferred to consult paper reference books regarding questions I might have; as for things to whet my linguistic appetite, again, I find them rather in books, that authors and publishers have poured (no offense) years of thought and effort into. You never post anything that appears to be that thoughtful or polished, then just give me and others the brush off or run-around when we dare to remark on it.

Anyway, a lot of the stuff on here doesn't seem essential to me...or it is simply too "BIG" to really get answered (even if a discusssion could be continued cooly enough for the necessary months if not years) - questions and issues that responsible teachers will likely struggle with for their whole career and then some, and which nobody else can really answer for them.

Completely Ignored Requests to have Papers written for the Poster

And before that, in our now growing list, should be: 'Badly written CIRs apparently asking for help in deciding on a topic for (especially worryingly) postgraduate research'.

[metal56]

You're one to talk about criticizing, ridiculing, diverting, mocking and the like

Nothing wrong with such behaviour per se, but when it is done to limit the remit of this forum, I kick-back.

But to be totally honest, I have to say that I do not really learn very much from most your posts, metal (or from that many posts in general),

As I've said many times, there are other posts and forums to follow if you like. Your problem is that you want to be in every thread, even when you are not learning anything.

and have always preferred to consult paper reference books regarding questions I might have;

Yes, that approach used to be the one armchair antropologists took. They formed their ideas of human cultures on books from professors who had never even left the lecture hall.

that authors and publishers have poured (no offense) years of thought and effort into.

The ones from teachers and educationalist who have worked in the field, as have many here, are most useful and relevant, IMO. If you wish to dismiss the experience of the teacher-thinker who posts here, it your decision.

You never post anything that appears to be that thoughtful or polished,

Hmm. "Polished" can sometimes mean "dead".

Anyway, a lot of the stuff on here doesn't seem essential to me

Thats no reason to want to prevent it being heard.

questions and issues that responsible teachers will likely struggle with for their whole career and then some, and which nobody else can really answer for them.

Most of us know that we can but try: you normally give up at the starting gate.

[fluffyhamster]

Quick rebuttal:

Nothing wrong with such behaviour per se, but when it is done to limit the remit of this forum, I kick-back.

I've mentioned elswhere how you've never had much of a sense of humour, and you really did start butting in on threads after I dared intrude once ('See, lol, overusing that sort of language simply will not do!' ring a bell?). YOU were the one trying to LIMIT ME. That's the only reason why I then started genuinely trying to disrupt yours (but darn it, sometimes I got sucked into responding seriously). If you'd exhibited a bit more of a mature attitude, taken the joke, and restrained yourself, you'd have saved yourself quite a lot of grief and might have retained my respect and interest longer. It wasn't my fault that Larry disappeared and left you feeling more miserable than usual, you know.

As I've said many times, there are other posts and forums to follow if you like. Your problem is that you want to be in every thread, even when you are not learning anything.

Really? All I seem to see are threads and more threads from YOU, asking all sorts of questions that you often seem to have no real interest in seriously discussing (re. your continual quote 'n' quipping). I wonder if you're just bored and trying to pass the time sometimes. People will soon give up on you if you aren't prepared to invest more time in your threads, and in respectfully awnsering the points they raise.

Not sure who you're referring to when you mention 'Armchair anthropologists' versus the "wild" men of (A)L (again, who? Mario Rinvolucri? Hey, THERE'S a thought! Are you Mario, metal? Or maybe Scott Thornbury? You seem to have a liking for both guys. Me, Scott's more my type. ).

'Polished' usually means exactly that, in my books. As in, shiny shoes.

You can but try, eh. Ganbatte kudasai. Me, I'm off to find me another nag to bet on, this one's got itself caught up in its own knickers for gawd's sake.

[metal56]

If you'd exhibited a bit more of a mature attitude, taken the joke, and restrained yourself, you'd have saved yourself quite a lot of grief and might have retained my respect and interest longer.

Please note, I am not at all interested in gaining your respect. I am interested that you respect a wide remit for this forum.

It wasn't my fault that Larry disappeared

Hmm. A matter of opinion.

Me, Scott's more my type.

I'll tell him next time I see him.

'Polished' usually means exactly that, in my books. As in, shiny shoes.

Somehow, I see you as a shoe-shine boy/girl.

[fluffyhamster]

Please note, I am not at all interested in gaining your respect. I am interested that you respect a wide remit for this forum.

Noted. I'm sure others have noted it, too. In turn, please note that I said 'retain', not 'gain' (or even 'regain').

It wasn't my fault that Larry disappeared

Hmm. A matter of opinion.

I guess we'll never know. Maybe Bigfoot got him.

Me, Scott's more my type.

I'll tell him next time I see him.

Thanks, I knew I could depend on you to pass my pass along. Oh, and tell him that I bought that new grammar book of his, too (don't say it was only for the photo of him on the back cover, though).

'Polished' usually means exactly that, in my books. As in, shiny shoes.

Somehow, I see you as a shoe-shine boy/girl.

Oh, you should've seen my parade shoes when I was in my ATC uniform. Hell, I bet I put more elbow into my cleaning my boots boots than you have into all your posts combined.

[fluffyhamster]

Ooh, look, pretty Christmas bell is ringing! Maybe that means you can soon banish your Scrooge, metal?

[metal56]

I guess we'll never know. Maybe Bigfoot got him.

Bigmouth, more like.

Hell, I bet I put more elbow into my cleaning my boots boots than you have into all your posts combined.

What are "boots boots". Is that what Mummy used to call them?

[fluffyhamster]

Hmm, do you think Scott would be interested in the fact that I may have a big mouth (when I open wide)?

[metal56]

Hmm, do you think Scott would be interested in the fact that I may have a big mouth (when I open wide)?

I think Scott is happy with his present partner. Well, he seemed to be pretty much so last time I saw them together.

[fluffyhamster]

Boots x2 is a reflection of the hard work and repetition involved in bringing them to that shiny gloss. Oh, did I mention that I like leather?

[metal56]

Boots x2 is a reflection of the hard work and repetition involved in bringing them to that shiny gloss. Oh, did I mention that I like leather?

Well thank God you bought the book. Maybe now we can here about how it has changed your life and limited view on teaching and relevant material.

[Anuradha Chepur]

Somehow, I see you as a shoe-shine boy/girl.

After hundreds of posts of interaction, you are still not sure
whehter it is shoe-shine boy or shoe-shine girl?

[metal56]

Somehow, I see you as a shoe-shine boy/girl.

After hundreds of posts of interaction, you are still not sure
whehter it is shoe-shine boy or shoe-shine girl?

I'm not sure if Fluff is into cross-dressing. Window-dressing for sure, but cross-dressing...

[jotham]

I talked about a ceratin group of teachers who do not see the question of "whom" as complex. They say "use it, or be seen by most people as uneducated", which in contemporary society...

Do you really know teachers like that? That is too bad. My experience has been the opposite. I don't think I've heard anyone talking about teaching that. (I was taught the distinction in junior high, so I was always aware of it even though I didn't use it personally in my speech.) But neither do I think it harms anyone if they are taught when to use whom, unless it is in the stilted sense. What I'm afraid is that some teachers don't introduce it at all and those students won't be exposed to it, and wouldn't know how to use even if he or she wanted to.
Maybe the business scene might be overexaggerated, but it may also depend on what kind of business, or at what level, such as managers or corporate officers versus office workers. I'm talking about ambitious individuals for whom vocabulary and communication power matters not a little.
I think I did summarize Garner, which you thought was good. He does add quite a bit more with examples. You might be able to cite him as a trusted authority to those teachers you speak of. They could probably tone down their assertions a little bit. I can't imagine they are as mainstream as you suggest.

[metal56]

Some of the things that are discussed in Applied Linguistics:

• Language learning problems (emergence, awareness, rules, use, context, automaticity, attitudes, expertise)
  Language teaching problems (resources, training, practice, interaction, understanding, use, contexts, inequalities, motivations, outcomes)
  Literacy problems (linguistic and learning issues)
  Language contact problems (language and culture)
  Language inequality problems (ethnicity, class, region, gender, and age)
  Language policy and planning problems (status planning and corpus planning; ecology of language)
  Language assessment problems (validity, reliability, usability, responsibility)
  Language use problems (dialects, registers, discourse communities, gate-keeping situations, limited access to services)
  Language and technology problems (learning, assessment, access and use)
  Translation and interpretation problems (on-line, off-line, technology assisted)
  Language pathology problems (aphasias, dyslexias, physical disabilities)

How many of those do we now discuss here?