It's off to bank we go!

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:07 pm

How many people here use the second example?

I must go to school. I'm late.
I must go to bank. I've got a lot of extra cash lying around.

Stephen Jones · Post by **Stephen Jones** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:54 pm

The first sentence is grammatical. The second isn't. Why are you wasting everybody's time?

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 1:04 pm

Stephen Jones wrote:The first sentence is grammatical. The second isn't. Why are you wasting everybody's time?

That's a strange reply from someone who always rails against prescriptivists here. Not grammatical by whose standards?

As always, Stevie, you have the option to opt out of this discussion.

Stephen Jones · Post by **Stephen Jones** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 1:30 pm

Unless they've changed the rules of Monopoly you can only withdraw money from the Bank, not withdraw it, so "pass by bank" won't fit your example.

Marginally related is the fact that you would write on a ToDo list
go to bank
get shopping

but say
"i've got to go to the bank and get the shopping".

Below are the three cases from the BNC In each case the person is speaking haltingly, stopping and picking up again. In the third case it looks like he was going to give a name "Go to Bank of ......." and cut himself off.

, a lot of situations these er employees can't go to bank, get a loan, they can't get a mortgage,

That would be nice wouldn't it? and go to bank and see what it would cost you for. It's Yeah

no because it'd mean I'd have to go to bank of and, and this borough and well I said I would

Looking at similar examples from the BNC it seems in fact that the omission of the article in these cases may be a feature of certain Northern English dialects, so perhaps I should have said, "not grammatical in standard English".

It would still be quite nice if you explained what you are getting at.

JuanTwoThree · Post by **JuanTwoThree** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 2:21 pm

school, hospital, church, prison, university, college.

Why these and not others? Dunno.

JuanTwoThree · Post by **JuanTwoThree** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 2:46 pm

court, camp, jail, gaol........

mass, morning service, evensong?

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:44 pm

And I thought I was wasting your time, Stevie.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 3:54 pm

"i've got to go to the bank and get the shopping".

"got to go shopping" is also used.

Anyway, I'm supposing that your answer to my question is in the negative; you don't use the form "I must go to bank".

I also do not use it. When I want to tell someone that I have financial transactions to carry out, I often say "I'm going to/I've got to go to the bank". Now, I bank in two places in this town - depending on the type of business I have to carry out. So, when I say "I'm going to the bank" most people understand me to mean "I have financial business to carry out". Same if I were to I say "I have to go to the dentist's". I do not happen to be registered at at dentist's here, and am not sure where to find one. So, when I say "I'm going to the dentist's" I mean, I need dental work done. Both those expressions involve a focus on an action and not a building.

Looking at similar examples from the BNC it seems in fact that the omission of the article in these cases may be a feature of certain Northern English dialects, so perhaps I should have said, "not grammatical in standard English

You don't say!

BTW, where do you bank (verb)?

Don't you use the expression:

I need to bank
.........

Point is, "go to bank" (no ellipsis) is used, but not generally, as I see it. So, what is the equivalent way to talk about doing the action of carrying out financial business (an action) at a bank (place) without having to descibe in detail one's purpose for going to a bank? Many say "I'm going to the bank", which is similar to saying "I have financial business to carry out".

In many cases, it's just an idiomatic/lexical way of saying the latter.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:12 pm

JuanTwoThree wrote:school, hospital, church, prison, university, college.

Why these and not others? Dunno.

Those all involve idiomatic, in the wider sense of the word, ways to describe certain actions or periods of one's life. For me, it's often the same with "I have to go to the bank". It's not always with the specific building in mind, as Stevie seems to think, but can be an abbrieviated way of saying "I have to carry out financial business", or similar.

Stephen Jones · Post by **Stephen Jones** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:15 pm

I rarely use 'bank' as an intransitive verb.

When I want to tell someone that I have financial transactions to carry out, I often say "I'm going to/I've got to go to the bank". Now, I bank in two places in this town - depending on the type of business I have to carry out. So, when I say "I'm going to the bank" most people understand me to mean "I have financial business to carry out". Same if I were to I say "I have to go to the dentist's". I do not happen to be registered at at dentist's here, and am not sure where to find one. So, when I say "I'm going to the dentist's" I mean, I need dental work done. Both those expressions involve a focus on an action and not a building.

As I thought, your purpose in opening this thread was merely to try and be clever and indirectly back up your original idea.

Nobody denies going to the bank implies a financial transaction by default (after all even robbing the bank can be considered a financial transaction) but it is your suggestion that this is opposed to 'to a bank' normally referring to the building that is not backed up by examples.

All these three example from the first page of Google are to do with financial transactions not buildings.

"There's a misconception in the community that if you need money to start up a business, you go to a bank"

For most other things that might fall within the generic term "financial advice" I would either go to a bank or to a suitably qualified accountant. ...

Why do so many small businesses go to a bank?

And of course you can go to the bank to pick up the wife, ogle the cashier, or check it out for a future heist.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:25 pm

As I thought, your purpose in opening this thread was merely to try and be clever and indirectly back up your original idea.

My purpose was to discuss a particular item separately and not to crowd Jotham's thread with such. Now, if you've finished you silly trolling, can we get on?

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 4:32 pm

but it is your suggestion that this is opposed to 'to a bank' normally referring to the building that is not backed up by examples.

You are often hard work, Stevie, because you don't read posts properly or you try to twist aanother's words. I said that "go to the bank" can mean (note the modal) "carry out financial business". It can also be used to focus on a particular building. It can (modal) also, also be used to express both ideas at once. There are a few possibilities out there if one takes into consideration semantics AND pragmatics.

And of course you can go to the bank to pick up the wife, ogle the cashier, or check it out for a future heist.

You can indeed - in fact I imagine you do the second action often. But, one normally expresses such "unusual" actions by modifying one's statements, doesn't one?

Stephen Jones · Post by **Stephen Jones** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:48 pm

And "go to the bank", like "get the bus/train", is a regular, universal action for many people, so the definite article fits well.

go to a bank (picture the building, being in it)
go to the bank (the whole action of business one performs when visting a bank)

You are often hard work, Stevie, because you don't read posts properly or you try to twist aanother's words. I said that "go to the bank" can mean (note the modal) "carry out financial business". It can also be used to focus on a particular building. It can (modal) also, also be used to express both ideas at once.

Note the blatant contradiction, between what you did post, and what you are now claiming to post. It's called lying or trying to weasel out of it. I'll leave it up to you to decide which is the most appropriate (I would consider mental disorder as a third possibility).

JuanTwoThree · Post by **JuanTwoThree** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 7:49 pm

class, town, bed

OK they describe the action, or period of life. Or the purpose of the place rather than its location.

But why these and not others?

I've got to go to town. *I've got to go to city.

I'm going to class. *I'm going to lecture.

I'm going to bed. *I'm going to sofa.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 8:24 pm

Note the blatant contradiction, between what you did post, and what you are now claiming to post

.

Quote:
Doesn't agree with the examples. In most cases 'go to a bank' could be changed to 'go to the bank' with no change in meaning.

Do you mean "no change in literal meaning"? If so, I agree.

As I said, you don't read well.