wish

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Fri May 25, 2007 1:28 pm

either way it would have to be someone who never went on holiday.

That probably would apply to many millions of people all over the world. Psst! Aren't we being a bit "developed countriesish" about this?

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Fri May 25, 2007 2:56 pm

Aren't we being a bit "developed countriesish" about this?

Not necessarily. Have you seen the going rate for EFL teachers in the UK?

Miss Elenious · Post by **Miss Elenious** » Fri May 25, 2007 4:39 pm

Thank you all so much for your answers. And for all your imaginary dialogues

. You've been really helpful!!! Thank got summer vacation (or holidays) is close and we won't be wishing anymore!

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Fri May 25, 2007 7:07 pm

lolwhites wrote:
Aren't we being a bit "developed countriesish" about this?
Not necessarily. Have you seen the going rate for EFL teachers in the UK?

But Skegness isn't all that expensive.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Fri May 25, 2007 7:08 pm

Miss Elenious wrote: Thank got summer vacation (or holidays) is close and we won't be wishing anymore!

Thank God summer vacation (or holidays) is/are close and we won't be wishing anymore!

Have a good one when you go.

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Fri May 25, 2007 8:09 pm

metal56 wrote:
But Skegness isn't all that expensive.

Why go all the way to Skegness when you work in Bournemouth or Brighton?

Miss Elenious · Post by **Miss Elenious** » Sat May 26, 2007 6:39 am

metal56 wrote:
Miss Elenious wrote: Thank got summer vacation (or holidays) is close and we won't be wishing anymore!
Thank God summer vacation (or holidays) is/are close and we won't be wishing anymore!

Have a good one when you go.

Sory abuot the rong speling, metal. My teahcing is so stoudent centered that some times I get afected.

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Sat May 26, 2007 7:46 am

Sory abuot the rong speling, metal. My teahcing is so stoudent centered that some times I get afected.

LOL! So, are you a native English speaker, then?

Miss Elenious · Post by **Miss Elenious** » Sat May 26, 2007 1:51 pm

LOL! So, are you a native English speaker, then?[/quote]

I'm not a native English speaker and this is why I got stuck with the "wish" syntax. It can be quite frustrating for a non native teacher of English not to be able to explain something that a native speaker wouldn't give a second thought or bother too much about it

metal56 · Post by **metal56** » Sat May 26, 2007 3:27 pm

Miss Elenious wrote: It can be quite frustrating for a non native teacher of English not to be able to explain something that a native speaker wouldn't give a second thought or bother too much about it

Believe me, Miss E, lots of natives wouldn't be able to explain a high percentage of English usage. Even native teachers have trouble doing so, at times.

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Sat May 26, 2007 5:34 pm

The hardest phrases/sentences to explain are the ones where syntax isn't the problem. There's nothing grammatically wrong with I wish I went on holiday, it just sounds odd as a context when it might be used doesn't readily spring to mind.

If one gets too hung up on grammar/syntax. you can end up trying to think of "rules" to explain why certain forms, or combinations of forms are rarely used. My advice would be to try and think more about what stuff actually means, and try and think of a context where it might make sense.

Miss Elenious · Post by **Miss Elenious** » Sun May 27, 2007 6:32 am

lolwhites wrote:The hardest phrases/sentences to explain are the ones where syntax isn't the problem. There's nothing grammatically wrong with I wish I went on holiday, it just sounds odd as a context when it might be used doesn't readily spring to mind.

If one gets too hung up on grammar/syntax. you can end up trying to think of "rules" to explain why certain forms, or combinations of forms are rarely used. My advice would be to try and think more about what stuff actually means, and try and think of a context where it might make sense.

This is what I usually do, I mean, try to find the meaning, rather than the rule.
However, I have noticed that adult learners feel safer if you provide them with a rule.

lolwhites · Post by **lolwhites** » Sun May 27, 2007 9:23 am

However, I have noticed that adult learners feel safer if you provide them with a rule.

That's understandable. After all, older students are more likely to have learned a language at school through Grammar/Translation, so often that's what they feel most comfortable with (though remember that the adult students we see are the ones who weren't put off language learning for life by this method!). However, there comes a point when students simply won't get any better unless they start to think about language in a different way.

jedimasterbooboo · Post by **jedimasterbooboo** » Tue May 29, 2007 3:14 am

However, there comes a point when students simply won't get any better unless they start to think about language in a different way.

Well, amen. I talk about this with students. There is some language they can learn where rules are going to help them out. When a category arises where usage is the only rule, I let them know we've switched categories. And to demonstrate, we practice back and forth 5 times whatever we need to 'memorize'...some prepositions are like this. The word 'to' is hard for people in several countries because they use it generally for everything...but in English, sometimes 'to' is ok...sometimes it's not used.

In Tagalog, everything is "sa" which translates= "to". 'Sa' can be used in almost any sentence that needs a prepostion. Learning the English preps is a royal pain for the Philippino teachers here, and then they are put on the spot for a "rule" by the students.

Well, when they are speaking fluently, the aren't thinking of rules, they are rattling off what's comfortable, and there's no rule for some things anyway. So...drill a bit, at least for this category of rule-less usage stuff. ("rule-less usage stuff" is a term copyrighted by me and may not be used without permission

)

Student: "Somebody told me I smell to garlic."
Me: "You smell *like* garlic." (Now say it 5 times, "I smell like garlic."

)

Unfortunately, 'wish' is a hard one...sometimes there's rule, sometimes it's mind boggling to articulate the nuance there.

[edit] Wow! I stumbled in to another thread, and this topic is being discussed. Someone made the remark that speaking like a four year old is disappointing to students, but I have the opposite view especially when it comes to prepositions. Have you ever heard a four year old get a preposition wrong? Not bloody likely. A child would never say, "I smell to garlic.", it's only because they've only heard it properly and have repeated it. Some language just has to be learned that way and that's all there is to it. Practice. It doesn't take as long as one has exaggerated. Think of an annoying commercial.

Over the years growing up in my own country I've learned a whole 'nother language on top of a language with commercial slang. I'm in the Philippines and it hasn't taken me hours upon hours every day to learn some Tagalog phrases that are repeated in commercials a few times when I'm watching TV. I'm in an English environment all day and so learning Tagalog has been slow, but whatever's been repeated, I'm the most familiar with. I hear stuff, I repeat it, and I'm happy to learn that what I've said is correct. No rules taught. It hasn't taken years upon years.

I know how to say "It's donut time~!" in Tagalog, and I didn't need a single rule. Cheers.