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ew4055
Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 12
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 Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:35 pm Post subject: Sending a photo with application? |
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Hello everyone! My name is Liz and I'm new to the ESL cafe. I'd like to introduce myself to you all 
So here is my first post. I've had a few people from ESL teaching positions ask me to send them a photo with my job application. And this totally creeps me out. In the United States, it's well known etiquette that you just don't send a photo with your resume --- it's easy grounds to sue a business for discrimination. But I get a lot of organizations wanting a photo.
What are they looking for when they ask for my photograph? To see how pretty I am? And what are they going to do with it?
Has anybody else been asked for their photo/what is your advice with how to handle this? |
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santi84
Joined: 14 Mar 2008
Posts: 1317
Location: under da sea
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| Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| This is very common abroad. Things like your photo, age, marital status, children - when in Rome. |
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rtm
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: US
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| Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 5:41 am Post subject: Re: Sending a photo with application? |
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| ew4055 wrote: |
In the United States, it's well known etiquette that you just don't send a photo with your resume --- it's easy grounds to sue a business for discrimination. But I get a lot of organizations wanting a photo.
What are they looking for when they ask for my photograph? To see how pretty I am? And what are they going to do with it? |
As santi said, this is common in many places in the world. They might be looking to see how pretty you are -- after all, if this is a language school, they need to attract customers, and that's easier to do with good-looking teachers. In some places in the world, they might be looking to see what race you are. And yes, in some places in the world they might pass you over because you are a certain race, or because you aren't pretty enough (in their eyes). That may or may not be illegal where the school is, and even if it is illegal, there's probably not much you could do about it (and they know that).
I think most places would just use the photo for hiring purposes, and (if you are hired) possibly put the photo on their web site or other marketing materials. |
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Grenouille
Joined: 01 Oct 2006
Posts: 62
Location: Moscow
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| Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 6:36 am Post subject: Re: Sending a photo with application? |
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| ew4055 wrote: |
Hello everyone! My name is Liz and I'm new to the ESL cafe. I'd like to introduce myself to you all
So here is my first post. I've had a few people from ESL teaching positions ask me to send them a photo with my job application. And this totally creeps me out. In the United States, it's well known etiquette that you just don't send a photo with your resume --- it's easy grounds to sue a business for discrimination. But I get a lot of organizations wanting a photo.
What are they looking for when they ask for my photograph? To see how pretty I am? And what are they going to do with it?
Has anybody else been asked for their photo/what is your advice with how to handle this? |
Hello, and welcome. I would just like to point out that if you're 'creeped out' by a future foreign employer asking for your photo with a job application, then maybe you need to re-think if you're suitable to take the leap into teaching English abroad. There will be a lot of business practices and situations in your new country that you wouldn't see in your home country, but you have to remember that things are done differently in other places. You can't be too 'sensitive' or 'demanding' or expect things to be the same as in your home country. 'Home comforts' will probably not exist, depending on where you go.
Your photo is needed because you could be working in a school that promises their clients a 'certain type' of teacher, either race or gender, so yes, they do want to see what you look like before they hire you - people are their business and they don't want any new teacher scaring away their clients because of their looks. If you want advice about what you should do, my suggestion is that you send your photo if you want to work in that school. Good luck. |
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Sashadroogie
Joined: 17 Apr 2007
Posts: 11061
Location: Moskva, The Workers' Paradise
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| Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 11:07 am Post subject: |
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Agree with all that has been written above. Are you applying for teaching jobs outside the USA? If so, then American practices are not really relevant, sorry. In many countries the idea of suing for discrimination is just as alien as sending a photo is for you, except that the former is very often pointless, whilst the latter is not.
Interviewers can glean quite a lot of vital information from a pic. Tattoos, piercings, unkempt hair, facial hair etc. True, these may not always come up in a photo, if you did arrive in the school with a nose ring or tattoo, your employer would be able to justifiably say you had misrepresented yourself in the application, thus justifying rapid termination of contract.
In any case, there would probably be a face-to-face interview, or a video interview, so your face will be seen at some point, and possibly recorded. Passports need to be scanned and emailed in order to process visas, so again, your image is going to be requested.
In an age where everybody seems to be comfortable with posting their intimate details on social networks etc., I find this reticence about photos with a job application a little odd, I have to say... |
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rtm
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: US
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| Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 11:50 am Post subject: Re: Sending a photo with application? |
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| Grenouille wrote: |
| I would just like to point out that if you're 'creeped out' by a future foreign employer asking for your photo with a job application, then maybe you need to re-think if you're suitable to take the leap into teaching English abroad. There will be a lot of business practices and situations in your new country that you wouldn't see in your home country, but you have to remember that things are done differently in other places. You can't be too 'sensitive' or 'demanding' or expect things to be the same as in your home country. 'Home comforts' will probably not exist, depending on where you go. |
In the OP's defense, if you only have one frame of reference, you can't be blamed for using that to understand new situations. And, her asking here about the legitimacy of sending a photo with an application doesn't necessarily mean that she doesn't understand that things will be different (though, as Grenouille pointed out, being "totally creeped out" about it might show a bit of inflexibility).
If a potential employer asked her to send a $500 "application fee" and told her that that's just how it is done in that country, we would say she was foolish for sending it and should have known better. But, similar to submitting a photo with a resume, how is she to know what is 'normal' and what is not? In that sense, it was good that she asked here about something she was uncomfortable about (though she could have searched, as this question has been asked and answered before  ) |
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Prof.Gringo
Joined: 07 Nov 2006
Posts: 2236
Location: Dang Cong San Viet Nam Quang Vinh Muon Nam!
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| Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2013 12:07 pm Post subject: Re: Sending a photo with application? |
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| rtm wrote: |
| Grenouille wrote: |
| I would just like to point out that if you're 'creeped out' by a future foreign employer asking for your photo with a job application, then maybe you need to re-think if you're suitable to take the leap into teaching English abroad. There will be a lot of business practices and situations in your new country that you wouldn't see in your home country, but you have to remember that things are done differently in other places. You can't be too 'sensitive' or 'demanding' or expect things to be the same as in your home country. 'Home comforts' will probably not exist, depending on where you go. |
In the OP's defense, if you only have one frame of reference, you can't be blamed for using that to understand new situations. And, her asking here about the legitimacy of sending a photo with an application doesn't necessarily mean that she doesn't understand that things will be different (though, as Grenouille pointed out, being "totally creeped out" about it might show a bit of inflexibility).
If a potential employer asked her to send a $500 "application fee" and told her that that's just how it is done in that country, we would say she was foolish for sending it and should have known better. But, similar to submitting a photo with a resume, how is she to know what is 'normal' and what is not? In that sense, it was good that she asked here about something she was uncomfortable about (though she could have searched, as this question has been asked and answered before ) |
A professional photo (Often both a headshot and a full-length body shot) are the "norm" anywhere outside of the USA (Can't speak for Europe) and it is just the start...Passport copy, degree, diplomas, you name it, and an employer will want all those as well... Geez, no privacy anymore, let me go update/check my Facebook, it's been almost 5 mins... |
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ew4055
Joined: 28 Oct 2013
Posts: 12
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| Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:23 am Post subject: |
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An employer asked for my photo so they could please put it up on their teaching website. I asked if I could please see their website. They refused to show me their website. That sounds suspicious to me.
I've also run across several employers who ask for application fees.
I applied to one place whom I found on the ESL Cafe. They seemed completely legitimate when applying. I got an email back from a man who could not even write proper English (this company was supposedly based in Chicago).
I would like to teach abroad but I have no idea how to navigate who is a real, legitimate company. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 5:17 am Post subject: |
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| ew4055 wrote: |
| I would like to teach abroad but I have no idea how to navigate who is a real, legitimate company. |
Where do you want to teach? |
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MuscatGary
Joined: 03 Jun 2013
Posts: 1364
Location: Flying around the ME...
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| Posted: Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:55 am Post subject: |
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If you end up in the ME then they will ask you for large amounts of passport photos (20+ is not unusual). Often they will then lose them and ask you for more....
We have a lot of Americans who arrive here thinking that issues such as age/sex/race discrimination are treated in the same way as at home, they quickly get a rude awakening.
My favourite was an American who insisted it was 'his right' to smoke and to take smoke breaks during classes. He's not here anymore.... |
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alexmac84
Joined: 28 Dec 2013
Posts: 38
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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I think saying that a person is not prepared to apply for teaching abroad because she is hesitant to send her photo is a severe over reaction. I dislike it when anyone, upon learning that someone is a little green, decides to put on the "I'm going to scare this person away" tirade. I've noticed that there are people who do that in every industry.
That also being said, it's not stupid to question this. Human trafficing is a serious problem in this world, and violence against women is the number one international crime against humanity. By all means, women are told every day to watch out for situations exactly like this. And in many cases, questioning a practice like this could save someone's life.
Just wanted to give that perspective. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 5:53 pm Post subject: |
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| alexmac84 wrote: |
| That also being said, it's not stupid to question this. Human trafficing is a serious problem in this world, and violence against women is the number one international crime against humanity. By all means, women are told every day to watch out for situations exactly like this. And in many cases, questioning a practice like this could save someone's life. |
I'm not sure how sending a photo along with one's CV relates to human trafficking, but anyway, keep in mind that many employers will also want to see a scanned copy of the passport information page--the one that indicates nationality, age, sex, issuance/expiration date, and of course, includes a photo.
There's nothing suspicious about a legit, overseas recruiter/employer requiring a passport-sized photo---some do while others don't give a hoot. This and other seemingly discriminatory or odd practices are typical when seeking work abroad and will vary across cultures. It's just part of working in cultural contexts that are unlike the ones we're familiar with.
That said, obviously don't send recruiters money. At the same time, don't get distracted by the promise of a fun teaching environment, big money, a beach-front apartment, 4 months of paid holiday time off, etc., to the point where you lose sight of what's legit versus what's a scam. Research the recruiters and employers thoroughly with the same care used when planning your vacations. |
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rtm
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: US
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:04 am Post subject: |
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| alexmac84 wrote: |
| I think saying that a person is not prepared to apply for teaching abroad because she is hesitant to send her photo is a severe over reaction. |
People were objecting to her being "creeped out" about sending a photo suggested, not being hesitant to send one. Being hesitant is a good reaction to something that is outside of your frame of understanding. Being "creeped out" about it shows not just that the practice is foreign, but also shows that the speaker judges it negatively. To work abroad, the OP should hold off on judging foreign practices and have a more open mind.
Also, similar to nomad soul, I'm not sure what your connection between sending a photo with a job application and human trafficking is. |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 7:30 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| I think saying that a person is not prepared to apply for teaching abroad because she is hesitant to send her photo is a severe over reaction. I dislike it when anyone, upon learning that someone is a little green, decides to put on the "I'm going to scare this person away" tirade. |
I'm also curious why alexmac felt it was needed to revive a six-month old thread to chastise those who offered input; the OP has surely long since moved on. |
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3701 W.119th
Joined: 26 Feb 2014
Posts: 386
Location: Central China
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| Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2014 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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I got my picture taken earlier to attach to my CV and applications. Bit odd, as a Brit, but I can understand the reasons for employers requesting it. Different strokes and all that.
My only issue, is, the camera seems to have added about 50lbs to me, along with a third chin, and cold, black, dead eyes. The picture makes me look like Eric Pickles after an all-nighter. I always though of myself as more of a young James Gandolfini. |
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