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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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 Posted: Thu Apr 28, 2016 1:35 pm Post subject: |
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@ sicklyman Yes, agreed:-) In fact, we could discuss what quals are effectively useful in such a context, and they wouldn't include grad work at all, I think;-)
@lion No, dude. This is, as nomadsoul says, 'easy breezy' for most people to figure out; it is extremely basic. I doubt the thread will inform anyone who is seriously considering the quals needed to work in KSA.
Frankly, most people contemplating MA or PhD work have the brains to figure this very basic stuff out without undue stress or resorting to requests for obvious info on online forums. |
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lion101
Joined: 29 Mar 2016
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 6:21 am Post subject: |
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| The other thing I wanted to know is if you guys think a phd in pure linguistics can get you a job teaching the ma tesol or applied linguistic programs. this job posting http://www.eslcafe.com/joblist/index.cgi?read=39032 makes it seem like linguistics phd holders can teach the ma tesol courses. It makes sense because if you look at the ma tesol/applied linguistics programs, half of the classes are on pure linguistics. Also I know of many tesol programs who's coordinators are phd holders in linguistics. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 6:29 am Post subject: |
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| Seriously? The ink has barely dried on your BA. |
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lion101
Joined: 29 Mar 2016
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 6:34 am Post subject: |
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| You do make a good point but I am currently applying to several programs, and there are some that offer an ma and phd with funding so that is why I am interested. |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:08 am Post subject: |
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Again, no one can say what qualifications will be required nor what positions will be available 5+ years from now, especially given the government's nitaqat initiative. Moreover, you apparently ignored the following at the top of this page:
| spiral78 wrote: |
| Frankly, most people contemplating MA or PhD work have the brains to figure this very basic stuff out without undue stress or resorting to requests for obvious info on online forums. |
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rtm
Joined: 13 Apr 2007
Posts: 1003
Location: US
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 1:10 pm Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
The idea of jumping from a new BA immediately to an MA and then to a PhD is unrealistic enough to emit serious troll-stench, frankly.
It makes no sense financially [...] |
I'm surprised to hear you say that. Actually, it is quite common to go directly from a BA to MA to PhD. Not always the recommended route, but I wouldn't call it unrealistic by any means. Of course, I have no first hand knowledge of whether that would result in employment in Saudi Arabia (and neither do you, I am guessing).
Many graduate programs in the US are fully funded, providing a tuition waiver and stipend, so I would not necessarily say that it makes no sense financially, either (I didn't pay a dime for any of my graduate degrees, didn't dip into my savings, and have no loans).
I'm not saying that the OP's plan is the best, but that it isn't as ridiculous as some are saying. |
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Makkah
Joined: 08 Oct 2014
Posts: 113
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 2:55 pm Post subject: Re: ma or phd in linguistics |
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| lion101 wrote: |
| Would a ma or phd in linguistics be sufficient for the "good" jobs or does it have to be in applied linguistics. I ask this because a lot of the job postings say applied linguistics but most of the graduate programs I see in the U.S. are in Linguistics. |
What is your definition of a 'good' job? Great, motivated students with possibility for you to gain good exp. that would really mean something back in the real world or simply money? |
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paul.conlong
Joined: 31 Mar 2015
Posts: 84
Location: Rochdale, UK
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:18 pm Post subject: |
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It's all about the money, money makes the world go round.  |
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hash
Joined: 17 Dec 2014
Posts: 456
Location: Wadi Jinn
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 3:32 pm Post subject: |
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| lion101 wrote: |
| also the reason I have decided on linguistics is because of my academic interest and also because it seems like a more flexible degree. I just want to know if linguistics and not applied is considered equal for employment in the gulf. I am not pursuing it solely for esl because I also know arabic and might want to pursue translation. |
Can someone fill me in as to how an MA/PhD in "Linguistics" prepares one to "teach" ESL in the Gulf?
Linguistics (by which I assume one means here theoretical linguistics) is simply the study of how languages work....Chomsky and all that. Heavy duty courses in math, logic and of course nowadays, computerese and IT.
Applied linguistics generally means going out into the "field" (Amazonas, New Guinea, Belgian Congo et al) and transcribing and describing languages that hitherto haven't been studied. This means years living out in the outback, away from civilization, poverty, being subjected to insect bites, catching rare diseases, risking blindness and so on.
Neither of these branches of linguistics has anything at all or whatsoever to do with "teaching English in the Gulf".....or "teaching" anything anywhere.
I am aware that employers will often list "Linguistics" as one of the fields acceptable to them for an ESL job, but I've always taken that as an indication that your average employer, recruiter and so on, simply doesn't know what he's talking about and is totally clueless about "teaching" anything, let alone the difference between a degree in linguistics and TESL (which I've always had a hard time accepting as a "field" in any case.....but that's another subject).
The OP has also stated (see above) that he "knows Arabic" (whatever that might mean....or rather.....that could mean a dozen different things) and he might pursue a career in "translation". Really? And how does "Linguistics" enter into and impact this possibility? How is that topic related to "teaching ESL in the Gulf"? Is there really any relationship at all? Not in any rational way that I can see.
Incidentally, you don't study "Linguistics" to become a translator (you might take a course in it, but you don't major in it).
Until terms are defined or accepted for what they generally indicate, this is all an exercise in total futility. Right now, it sounds like there's like 8 different conversations going on each one addressing a different topic. |
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lion101
Joined: 29 Mar 2016
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:30 pm Post subject: Re: ma or phd in linguistics |
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| Makkah wrote: |
| lion101 wrote: |
| Would a ma or phd in linguistics be sufficient for the "good" jobs or does it have to be in applied linguistics. I ask this because a lot of the job postings say applied linguistics but most of the graduate programs I see in the U.S. are in Linguistics. |
What is your definition of a 'good' job? Great, motivated students with possibility for you to gain good exp. that would really mean something back in the real world or simply money? |
I would say good money and good teaching hours. Also although I am not a citizen of Saudi Arabia but my family does have some roots there. I am Muslim as well and being near the holy sites( macca and medina) is priceless to me. Many Muslims wouldn't mind living poor just to be next to those sites. Btw I do not like or agree with the Saudi version of Wahhabi/salafi Islam and many of the Muslims around the world don't either. The only reasons many Muslims want to be there is because of the holy sites and we all HATE the Saudi government just as much as many of you do. |
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lion101
Joined: 29 Mar 2016
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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| rtm wrote: |
| spiral78 wrote: |
The idea of jumping from a new BA immediately to an MA and then to a PhD is unrealistic enough to emit serious troll-stench, frankly.
It makes no sense financially [...] |
I'm surprised to hear you say that. Actually, it is quite common to go directly from a BA to MA to PhD. Not always the recommended route, but I wouldn't call it unrealistic by any means. Of course, I have no first hand knowledge of whether that would result in employment in Saudi Arabia (and neither do you, I am guessing).
Many graduate programs in the US are fully funded, providing a tuition waiver and stipend, so I would not necessarily say that it makes no sense financially, either (I didn't pay a dime for any of my graduate degrees, didn't dip into my savings, and have no loans).
I'm not saying that the OP's plan is the best, but that it isn't as ridiculous as some are saying. |
Thank you my point exactly. |
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Hatcher
Joined: 20 Mar 2008
Posts: 602
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| Posted: Fri Apr 29, 2016 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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YOu dont need a PhD for a job in the KSA. Its useless because a PhD is for research and you wont do any there. If you do have a PhD then go to Qatar or the UAE.
An MA will get you the job... but your main concern fighting over attendance while you teach... I am, he is, she is.... |
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spiral78
Joined: 05 Apr 2004
Posts: 11534
Location: On a Short Leash
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 12:36 am Post subject: |
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| The OP has a brand-new BA degree (he says) and nothing else. The whole thread is pie-in-the-sky speculative. |
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lion101
Joined: 29 Mar 2016
Posts: 32
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 1:29 am Post subject: |
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| spiral78 wrote: |
| The OP has a brand-new BA degree (he says) and nothing else. The whole thread is pie-in-the-sky speculative. |
Not really its just basically me asking if linguistics would be the same as applied linguistics and I learned that it's not and applied would be the better route to take for the gulf. There really isn't a need to be so negative 😅 |
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nomad soul
Joined: 31 Jan 2010
Posts: 11454
Location: The real world
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| Posted: Sat Apr 30, 2016 5:01 am Post subject: |
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| lion101 wrote: |
| Its just basically me asking if linguistics would be the same as applied linguistics and I learned that it's not and applied would be the better route to take for the gulf. |
A suggestion: Hit the pause button. In three weeks' time, you went from asking (on the newbie forum) whether you should get an MA TESOL to teach adults or an M.Ed. with a TESOL emphasis and k-12 licensure. Now you're contemplating a combined MA/PhD in Linguistics with the idea of teaching EFL, teaching linguistics in a degree program, or specializing in translation.
Take a breather. Instead of jumping from your newly-minted BA in Business into a graduate or grad/doctoral program in something related to TESOL/k-12 teaching/linguistics/translation, focus on getting your first TEFL job 1) to gain a few years of professional experience, and 2) frankly, to see if you even like TEFL or teaching in general as a potential career. Be flexible where that first, entry-level TEFL job is. Sure, you might get something in KSA, but with an unrelated BA, CELTA, and zero experience, the only companies likely to have a teeny bit of interest in you will be those you really don't want to work for. Be realistic about where in the world you can teach; China, Japan, and Korea top the list for greenhorns. North Africa might be a possibility with an unrelated degree and nada experience. You'll need to ask on those forums.
But for now, it's too soon to be starting phase two of your educational path when it's obvious you're uncertain about what the heck it is you want to do and whether that's a good fit for you. Plus, it's doubtful you're ready/able to handle the rigors of graduate-level research and higher thinking given the types of questions you've been asking throughout these forums.
Last edited by nomad soul on Sat Apr 30, 2016 1:34 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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