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Native English speaker/ Fluent English Speaker
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lareveuse



Joined: 25 Nov 2008
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 7:20 pm    Post subject: Native English speaker/ Fluent English Speaker Reply with quote

Hi guys,
I�m Natalia, originally from Argentina. I�m right now in Buenos Aires but I lived in other countries before. I�m fluent in English and I hold a Diploma in Visual Communication done in an English Institute in Singapore.

My question is, how is the job market out there for people who are fluent but not native speakers? do we also have good chances to get a job as an English teacher?

I remember when I was learning English and French, most of my teachers were fluent but not native speakers. So I�m interested in becoming a teacher but I dont want to spend lots of money and time to realize later that schools only take native English speakers with Degrees...

I would really appreciate any thoughts on this Very Happy
Cheers
Nat
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Justin Trullinger



Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends on what qualifications you have. When I studied French and Spanish in school, my teachers were also fluent non-natives. They were from Iowa, same as me.

I guess that most countries are hesitant about hiring foreign non-natives, though, and I can see their reasons. They have non-natives locally, and have little reason to import them. That said, I've regularly worked in English teacher training with non-natives from all over- but to work overseas, they have MAs, PhDs, and a pile of paper that indicates a level of qualifications that locals may not have.

If you're a non-native speaker, you're going to need more qualifications.


Best,
Justin
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Justin Trullinger



Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Posts: 3110
Location: Seoul, South Korea and Myanmar for a bit

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends on what qualifications you have. When I studied French and Spanish in school, my teachers were also fluent non-natives. They were from Iowa, same as me.

I guess that most countries are hesitant about hiring foreign non-natives, though, and I can see their reasons. They have non-natives locally, and have little reason to import them. That said, I've regularly worked in English teacher training with non-natives from all over- but to work overseas, they have MAs, PhDs, and a pile of paper that indicates a level of qualifications that locals may not have.

If you're a non-native speaker, you're going to need more qualifications.


Best,
Justin
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Glenski



Joined: 15 Jan 2003
Posts: 12844
Location: Hokkaido, JAPAN

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depends on the country and type of teaching job you want.

In Japan, non-native English speakers can get English teaching jobs, but it's harder because the immigration requirements are stiffer.
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naturegirl321



Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home

PostPosted: Wed Dec 03, 2008 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It depends on where you want to go. Some countries, due to visa requirements, only hire native speakers.
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Gusss



Joined: 08 Nov 2008
Posts: 81

PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the other hand employers are aware that a native speaker doesnt make a good teacher. If a native speaker is unable to explain the hidden rules of the language he is actually not as useful as a non native who can (apart form pronunciation). It depends where you go - certainly in Spain you could teach no problem.
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MO39



Joined: 28 Jan 2004
Posts: 1970
Location: El ombligo de la Rep�blica Mexicana

PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2008 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gusss wrote:
On the other hand employers are aware that a native speaker doesnt make a good teacher.


Perhaps you meant to say that "a native speaker with no training in language teaching doesn't make a good teacher" Question
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Blasphemer



Joined: 03 Dec 2008
Posts: 199
Location: NYC/Warszawa

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a question for you guys�

I am a Polish citizen, but have been living in the US for almost 20 years now (most of my life). My English is much stronger than my Polish� I am CELTA certified and on my way back to Poland to teach� am I a native speaker?
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naturegirl321



Joined: 04 May 2003
Posts: 9041
Location: home sweet home

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd say so, my qusetion to you is, why haven't you applied for citizenship?
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Blasphemer



Joined: 03 Dec 2008
Posts: 199
Location: NYC/Warszawa

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

naturegirl321 wrote:
I'd say so, my qusetion to you is, why haven't you applied for citizenship?


That's a very good question naturegirl... very good question indeed hahaha... actually I just received the package couple of weeks ago... I'm working on it.. it's a looooong story and it involves 13 years of fighting deportation and enjoying the nightmare that is the US immigration system.
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Mr. Kalgukshi
Mod Team
Mod Team


Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Posts: 6613
Location: Need to know basis only.

PostPosted: Thu Dec 11, 2008 11:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A posting has been deleted. Let's stay on topic. Another jab at a nationality or country will result in a severe sanction. Please take personal political agendas elsewhere.
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Gusss



Joined: 08 Nov 2008
Posts: 81

PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2008 1:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MO39 wrote:
Gusss wrote:
On the other hand employers are aware that a native speaker doesnt make a good teacher.


Perhaps you meant to say that "a native speaker with no training in language teaching doesn't make a good teacher" Question



Without meaning to be willfully contrary - Yes and no. I have talked to several employers who feel that because non native speakers have had to learn the language from scratch often as an adult they are often better able to explain the hidden rules, grammar and nuances than a native speaker who has done a CELTA simply because they have had to go through the same process as the students themselves. Of course a non native speaker will never be able to compete with a native on pronunciation (unless they are from Glasgow).
On top of that I do not necessarily believe that TEFL courses make you a good teacher - they give you a bit of paper that says you can teach , but as we all know that is not necessarily the case. I have known CELTA qualified teachers that are abysmal and people with no formal training that are great so......
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Carll101



Joined: 17 Oct 2008
Posts: 45

PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2008 4:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm french Canadian and the first thing I did to start my ESL career was to take a CELTA. I think it showed that I was serious about teaching, and I didn't have any trouble finding a job after. But then I'm Canadian, lot of people don't know some Canadians are not native speakers.
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jpvanderwerf2001



Joined: 02 Oct 2003
Posts: 1117
Location: New York

PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gusss wrote:
MO39 wrote:
Gusss wrote:
On the other hand employers are aware that a native speaker doesnt make a good teacher.


Perhaps you meant to say that "a native speaker with no training in language teaching doesn't make a good teacher" Question



Without meaning to be willfully contrary - Yes and no. I have talked to several employers who feel that because non native speakers have had to learn the language from scratch often as an adult they are often better able to explain the hidden rules, grammar and nuances than a native speaker who has done a CELTA simply because they have had to go through the same process as the students themselves. Of course a non native speaker will never be able to compete with a native on pronunciation (unless they are from Glasgow).
On top of that I do not necessarily believe that TEFL courses make you a good teacher - they give you a bit of paper that says you can teach , but as we all know that is not necessarily the case. I have known CELTA qualified teachers that are abysmal and people with no formal training that are great so......


I'd be very interested to know which "hidden rules, grammar and nuances" a native speaker cannot deal with.
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JZer



Joined: 16 Jan 2005
Posts: 3898
Location: Pittsburgh

PostPosted: Sat Dec 27, 2008 2:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:

Perhaps you meant to say that "a native speaker with no training in language teaching doesn't make a good teacher"


Ha or in some cases they make a better teacher. While a trained teacher is often better one might argue in Asia that actually hearing your teacher speak English is a lot better that having someone speak your native language most of the class. A whole lot more of the target language will be acquired by actually listening to the language than having a trained teacher.
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