Job Discussion Forums

[No Moss]

This is related to James S's topic, but more general. I live in Shenzhen, and I'm not looking for a full-time job. But I would say that hours in the language schools seem to be down, since I'm not getting any part-time work these days. Part of that is attributable to the approaching Spring Festival, but I used to get fill-in work as the local native teachers left for the Christmas holidays. This year, hardly anything.

I've always maintained that there is a limitless demand for English in China, but a limited amount of disposable income to pay for English instruction, especially by us native speakers.

So what's your experience or opinion?

[Mikeylikesit114]

Demand is defined as willingness and ability to pay, which is why it is influenced by factors such as income and expectations about future income.

What do Chinese expect about their future incomes???
You tell me.

[vikuk]

they've stopped buying property, they've stopped buying cars - so maybe some of them will decide to stop paying for English lessons

[Eyrick3]

[Ms Bean]

Since I began considering a return to China, I have noticed fewer offers and advertisements from "Language Schools". I've also noticed an increase in pay from public universities in general.

Another trend that I've noticed is that public schools offer half-year contracts which are renewable (as one FAO told me) "depending upon what kind of teacher you are."

I think that China's economic engine will run a bit differently for awhile, given the fact that the rmb has risen in value while the dollar has dropped in value. (Yeah, I know, this has already been raised, but it is relevant to the discussion). Perhaps as China's currency strengthens, its economy may become more consumer-oriented, rather than manufacturing -oriented.

[China.Pete]

"...I would say that hours in the language schools seem to be down, since I'm not getting any part-time work these days." -- No Moss

The economy is definitely slowing down in China, as it has elsewhere. I've heard of people being put on unpaid leave for up to a month, or even longer. Some people's traditional Lunar New Year's bonuses could be chopped. This uncertainty is bound to have an effect on the discretionary end of the education market. Someone who has a kid in high school or university is unlikely to pull him/her out mid-course. But I think the language school market is more likely to be hit. And, if the slow-down goes on long enough, some of the private schools could potentially see a drop in their recruitment numbers.

[Buck Lin]

I am in between jobs at the moment. My top university has hundreds of students who have graduated long ago sitting around and self studying. If they get high marks on tests coming up this week they will get jobs. Otherwise they must pay for a job. This was the same at my last school. The school will provide a job for a few thousand rmb.
Education is usually a good field to be in during bad times. People stay in school or go back for upgrading. But maybe the leaders of China would like them to do other things than look at books.

[Lhenderson]

I've notice alot more foriegn teachers arriving in the past few months.

Interestingly, I've never seen so many female teachers applying before.

[vikuk]

[Lhenderson]

I charge 300 rmb/hour for private teaching.

[Buck Lin]

I am happy to hear that the women are starting to come over here. My female students are into the shy mode and I have a hard time getting them to speak up and not cover their moths when they talk. Western women will help them break out of this.

[roadwalker]

[waxwing]

As I said in a post on this forum a few weeks back, I expect a MASSIVE increase in teachers applying for China soon. There are a lot of people in America whose assets have depreciated alarmingly, that cannot retire and are scrambling for work which they didn't plan. Meanwhile in the UK there's been a huge crash in the value of the currency, which means that many qualified and unqualified teachers will start to pay a lot more attention to the job ads that previously were dismissed as laughably low salaries.
I think the whole Chinese laowai teacher market will be affected, from the bottom-of-the-barrel 4000 kwai Uni jobs (which will be swamped with lower middle class retirees and fresh graduates who figure it's better to wait out the bad job market a year or two before starting), to the higher end private schools that want qualified teachers and could never get them before for love nor money. Now the latter suffices for us Brits, as Chinese wages have gone up by maybe 40% in our terms.

All of that is supply. The other side of the equation is demand. This is murkier; as someone said above, demand remains strong for anything that aids the ultra-competitive Uni entry for the middle class Chinese (who can afford decent, but not superior schooling for their kids). I think the top end of the market, which is populated with the sons and daughters of the ownership class, might be affected quite badly, because so many investments have gone sour. Those parents will still want to get a foreign education for their progeny, but they will find the cheapest, rather than the best way to do it now.

[Amaguq]

I suspect that an economic crisis in the States won't affect employment in China at all. For the vast majority of people here, moving to a non-English speaking country is the equivalent of moving to the moon. Moving to China takes a particular mindset, that even if some of the newly unemployed could muster, their duration would be approximately 5 1/2 days.

[No Moss]

A surfeit of teachers would show up in the best places initially, such as Shanghai, Beijing, Xian, Dalian, and Shenzhen. What do you teachers from there report?

Also, I'm more concerned about the demand rather than the supply. Can you imagine if the demand for NTs in China if the TEFL demand were as intense as it is in Taiwan or Korea? Imagine a TEFL industry twenty times as big as Korea's. And it's not that far-fetched, ten years down the road. Hell, China could take every TEFL teacher the US could send over.

I've written about this before, but China is in the OEM phase of its industrial development. When they move to branded products, as they have in Taiwan and Korea (and Japan long ago), they will need to develop English marketing, sales, support, packaging, and advertisement services that demand relatively fluent English rather than the pretty crappy standard of English we see now. You can already see this transition in the larger cities, although not nearly to the extent you see it in Taiwan, for instance. Also, you'll start to see the rise of multi-national companies based in China where the company language is English, standard practice now in companies from France to Singapore.
These companies will demand significant staffing of NTs to support their staff on a daily, rather than a weekly, basis. Chinese may argue that Chinese will be an international language, but that will never, ever happen because of the difficulty of the written language.

Assuming that China doesn't fall off the cliff at some point, there is significant opportunity here for someone willing to commit to a career here. This country is a sh***ole in some ways, but it will get better in the same way that Korea and Japan got better.

In ten years, the average NT in China will make the (inflation-adjusted) equivalent of US$2000 now, with benefits or salary supplements sufficient to bring the total up to US$2500.

Maybe in the meantime the Chinese will learn to behave in such a way as to not make life a living hell for people around them, foreign and Chinese.