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johnslat · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:26 pm Post subject:

Dear 007,

Seriously - I cannot believe that you can seriously make a claim such as that.
Over the course of nineteen years, I encountered MANY Saudis (and other Muslims) who solemnly assured me that such things as traffic accidents were SOLELY a matter of "inshallah." that the drivers' behavior was irrelevant.

Are you going to tell me that you never encountered such people?

How long were you there?

Regards.
John

isabel · Joined: 07 Mar 2003 Posts: 510 Location: God's green earth

Dear 007, I am not in hell any longer, I am southeast of hell- to be specific- in Oman. I guess I was reprieved.

007 · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 4:40 pm Post subject:

johnslat · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 5:40 pm Post subject:

Dear 007,

But of course, we are not talking about YOU; I'm quite sure that you don't share their fatalism.
What i was vigorously disputing was THIS:

"Statistically and socially speaking, fatalism and pre-determination have nothing to do with the road deaths in the Gulf."

And that, I have to say, based on my experience, is TOTALLY wrong.

Regards,
John

isabel · Joined: 07 Mar 2003 Posts: 510 Location: God's green earth

007 · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 8:05 pm Post subject:

johnslat · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 8:33 pm Post subject:

Dear 007,

Mama mia - how you can miss the point! First of all do you really think the WHO people (or any other statistic-keeping organization) is going to factor in "the inshallah mentality?"

But even more importantly, WHAT do you think might be at least partially responsible for those MAJOR causes of traffic accidents: careless driving and excessive speed, not to mention not using safety belts?

Gee, do you suppose that possibly, just possibly, it might be this sort of attitude:

"It doesn't MATTER how carelessly or how fast I drive or whether I wear a safety belt or not BECAUSE IT'S ALL INSHALLAH. If Allah wills that I'm going to have an accident, it's going to happen, NO MATTER what I do or how I drive."

And if you don't think that there are a fair number of drivers in the Kingdom who feel that way, then you were in a different Saudi Arabia than I was.

Regards,
John

Geronimo · Joined: 11 Apr 2007 Posts: 498

The Arab News picked up on the WHO's report back in March...
http://arabnews.com/saudiarabia/article29726.ece

"In a report issued by the World Health Organization, the Kingdom has the highest road accident death toll in the world. The rate is put at 49 deaths for every 100,000 residents."

If the same death toll per 100,000 residents was to occur in the U.S.A., a country with a population of c. 300 million,
I reckon that the total number of fatalities would be in the order of 147,000 per annum. Exclamation

A related piece of commentary was presented by the same newspaper in March,too... http://arabnews.com/opinion/letters/article31392.ece

According to one of my Saudi colleagues, the recent introduction of speed cameras into Riyadh's road network has resulted in an increase in speeding tickets for the wastaless. Consequently, it would appear that taxi cab firms will now have to reconsider their hiring policies....

It seems to me that the remedy to be found must be congruent with the culture if it is to prove successful in reducing these horrendous numbers of accidents and deaths. And a major wastaman must be found for the credit for finding that remedy in order for it to be implemented effectively.

In the meantime, youths without helmets will continue to perform extensive 'wheelies' on their powerful morbikes in the middle of heavy fast-moving traffic on the capital's expressways.

Geronimo

cosmosmariner · Joined: 09 May 2003 Posts: 34

Well, the boys get bored so they have fun behind the wheel. The only thing one needs to drive in AllaLand is something dangling 'tween the legs!

Grendal · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 10:35 pm Post subject:

I see. I think I am begining to understand. OK, now get this. Christopher Walken, Deer Hunter, one bullet, one gun. 'he puts gun to head'..........Recites Inshallah.........'pulls trigger'..........'no bang'. Then he says it was God's will for him not to die.

Or maybe ..... 'fills every chamber in the revolver with bullets except one'.......'puts gun to head'.......Recites Inshallah........'pulls trigger'.......'no bang' Then he says, 'holy @#%* I'm still alive. My deathwish is not working'.

Then a Saudi comes along and says, 'Hey Chris, you got it all wrong. This is how you do it'. 'fills every chamber in the revolver with bullets'......... Recites Inshallah........'pulls trigger'.........'bang, splat'. Then Mr. Walken says, 'It must've been God's will for him to die'.

Yup. Ithink I got it straight now.

Grendal

johnslat · Posted: Mon Jul 12, 2010 11:14 pm Post subject:

Dear Grendal,

Well, you've got the WRONG attitude pretty straight, but you're totally mistaken about what "inshallah" SHOULD mean to Muslims - and DOES mean to many of them.

It's a lot like the Serenity Prayer:

"God (Allah), grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference."

Regards,
John