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deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
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 Posted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:57 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, back on topic:
Whether or not Ron Paul wins, he is the uncomfortable demonstration that the Republican/Democrat division is a completely artificial and meaningless one.
Now we can see a new division - between the bought-and-paid-for whores of corporate America and Israel, and.. er.. the rest.
The latter is rather under represented - and quite probably doesn't stand a chance. Nice to hear the voice of the people backing sanity though. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:00 am Post subject: |
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Are you perhaps legitimising the Palestinian resistance, then? |
How so?
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| After all, didn't Israel start it all with terrorist bombings and ethnic cleansings? |
Actually in 1948 the Arab side of the conflict tried to kick out the Jews of the area when they refused the UN partition. Not my fault you don't know the history. Not only that Israel's enemies also persecuted and expelled the arab jews of the area.
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| By your logic, the Palestinians should defend themselves until Israel stops stealing land and water. |
Israel ought to leave the West Bank just as soon as the Palestinian side says they won't attack if they do.
When David Icky supporters breathe good oxygen is lost. |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:09 am Post subject: |
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| deadman wrote: |
Sorry, back on topic:
Whether or not Ron Paul wins, he is the uncomfortable demonstration that the Republican/Democrat division is a completely artificial and meaningless one.
Now we can see a new division - between the bought-and-paid-for whores of corporate America and Israel, and.. er.. the rest.
The latter is rather under represented - and quite probably doesn't stand a chance. Nice to hear the voice of the people backing sanity though. |
Beware of all those who say that we need to be saved from the corrupt democracy -which must be bypassed and so they are taking their case directly to the people.
Such was the message of Hitler and he would smile at everything you say and stand for. |
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deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:33 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
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Are you perhaps legitimising the Palestinian resistance, then? |
How so? |
| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| It is not aggressive to go after those who are out to get you. It is defensive. |
| Joo Rip wrote: |
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| After all, didn't Israel start it all with terrorist bombings and ethnic cleansings? |
Actually in 1948 the Arab side of the conflict tried to kick out the Jews of the area when they refused the UN partition. Not my fault you don't know the history. Not only that Israel's enemies also persecuted and expelled the arab jews of the area. |
You're right, I should have said "Zionists", not Israel, specifically the Irgun terrorist group.
I'm sure you do know your "history" better than me - for me it's only a hobby, not a full time job.
Whatever the endless justifications are though - the fact is Israel is a racist state, and relies on constant and aggressive propaganda and manipulation to keep its head above water, public opinion-wise, the most distasteful of which is the exploitation of the holocaust for political purposes.
That's basically what attracts me to needling at these "taboo" subjects. |
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deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:36 am Post subject: |
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| Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee wrote: |
| deadman wrote: |
Sorry, back on topic:
Whether or not Ron Paul wins, he is the uncomfortable demonstration that the Republican/Democrat division is a completely artificial and meaningless one.
Now we can see a new division - between the bought-and-paid-for whores of corporate America and Israel, and.. er.. the rest.
The latter is rather under represented - and quite probably doesn't stand a chance. Nice to hear the voice of the people backing sanity though. |
Beware of all those who say that we need to be saved from the corrupt democracy -which must be bypassed and so they are taking their case directly to the people.
Such was the message of Hitler and he would smile at everything you say and stand for. |
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| ..which must be bypassed.. |
Pretty sure I didn't say that, so you must not be talking about me.
I just said it's corrupt. Are you saying it's not? |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:39 am Post subject: |
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| How is Israel a racist state? |
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deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:01 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| How is Israel a racist state? |
"Facts" believed by me which may or may not be true:
Israel was originally intended for, and and is in effect today, a country for Jewish people.
In Israel, Jewish people have had and do have preferential access to land (new settlements or productive farming areas).
There exists a superior and an inferior class of people, from the POV of the state, and they are the Jewish immigrants, and the former occupants of the land, respectively.
This division reminds me of apartheid-era South Africa - an effective, efficient, "white" privileged class, and a disorganized, underprivileged and inefficient under class.
[Edit--> Where I was going with that is, in their absence in Zimbabwe and SA, it can clearly be seen they did have their good points]
I see state-level racism as a fact of life. Any group of people with a group identity will look after themselves first. Individuals can and should adopt a more enlightened approach. I understand where Israel is coming from, and don't particularly begrudge them for it, but I will call it like I see it - and that's what I genuinely believe to be the case.
What I do object to is the constant propaganda efforts by the out-of-county lobby groups and advocacy organizations who are at the forefront of the battle for the hearts and minds, and dollars, of the free world.
I resent the fact that someone else is trying to manipulate me, so I occasionally play the anti-semite's advocate. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:24 am Post subject: |
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| Aren't the "racist" state policies of Israel actually solidly in line with the vast majority of states on earth? |
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deadman
Joined: 27 May 2006
Location: Suwon
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:55 am Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| Aren't the "racist" state policies of Israel actually solidly in line with the vast majority of states on earth? |
Probably - there's a lot of countries in the world.
Let's look at the minority though - America, England, Australia, Canada, Western Europe. Would you say they are solidly in line with those, and how so? |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:59 am Post subject: |
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No. Western nations are the exception.
What other states would you say are racist? |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 3:50 am Post subject: |
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You're right, I should have said "Zionists", not Israel, specifically the Irgun terrorist group.
I'm sure you do know your "history" better than me - for me it's only a hobby, not a full time job.
Whatever the endless justifications are though - the fact is Israel is a racist state, and relies on constant and aggressive propaganda and manipulation to keep its head above water, public opinion-wise, the most distasteful of which is the exploitation of the holocaust for political purposes. |
Well Israel enemies are far more racist than Israel . Say it is not so.
Compare what Israel's enemies have done to what Israel or zionists have done. Yes and I know history w/o the quotes better than you do.
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| That's basically what attracts me to needling at these "taboo" subjects |
Here is another Taboo subject : Israel enemies.The truth is that Bathists , Khomeni lovers and Al Qaedists and all the similar ideological types are all fascist bigots who can't be trusted to protect their minorities or govern. There is is a good reason for Israel now. Israeli jews need protection from those types.
See rascism and fascism. below:
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According to the WEA, "[t]he Mandaeans have survived 1400 years of Islamic persecution," and that in Islamic communities, they are "regarded as infidels (kaffir) and unclean (najes), hence they can have great difficulty obtaining employment and education" (WEA 24 July 2003). In respect of sexual assault,[
Islamic judges in Iran have set the precedent that the rape of a Mandaean woman can be regarded as an act of 'purification,' and as such, violators receive impunity. In Iran this defence has been used to acquit men of rapes on Mandaean girls as young as 8 years old (ibid.). |
http://www.unhcr.org/cgi-bin/texis/vtx/print?tbl=RSDCOI&id=41501c2123
If you want to deal with evil and injustice in the middle east.First deal with Bathists , Khomeni lovers and Al Qaedists and the similar ideological types . They are the greatest racists in the middle east and in fact by far greatest evil in the middle east. |
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cbclark4
Joined: 20 Aug 2006
Location: Masan
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| BJWD wrote: |
| How is Israel a racist state? |
Are Palestinian immigrants allowed to own and build in Isreal?
Are non-Jews marriages reckognized by the state?
cbc |
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Joo Rip Gwa Rhhee
Joined: 25 May 2003
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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A lot of states are more racist than Israel, including everyone of their enemies.
In fact it is probably true that most of the nations on the planet are racist in someway.
Here are some examples:
In Germany there is a right of return for ethnic Germans.
In Holland the children of non dutch do not become Dutch citizens.
Pakistan is a nation for Indian muslims and
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Non-Muslims who lived in Pakistan were forced the leave the area, which was one major factor in causing a violent reaction amongst the populations of the newly founded nations. The partition also resulted in tensions over Kashmir leading to the Indo-Pakistani War of 1947. |
Where is the UN demanding right of return for Hindus forced to leave Pakistan?
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A Malaysian Chinese is an overseas Chinese who is a citizen or long-term resident of Malaysia. Most are descendants of Chinese who arrived between the fifteenth and the mid-twentieth centuries. Within Malaysia, they are usually simply referred to as "Chinese" in all languages. The term Chinese Malaysian is rarely (if ever) used in Malaysia.
Early Chinese settlers (from the fifteenth century in Malacca; eighteenth century in Penang) form to a sub-group called Peranakan or Straits Chinese, who adopted many Malay customs and to varying extents (limited in Penang, almost complete in Malacca) the Malay language, but retained Chinese religious practices. In contrast, the newer arrivals (nineteenth century and later) who retained Chinese customs were known as sinkheh (新客 - literally "new guests").
The Chinese in Malaysia maintain a distinct communal identity and rarely intermarry with native Malays for religious and cultural reasons. This is because most Malays are Muslim. Under Malaysian law, such a marriage requires the non-Muslim party to convert. Most Malaysian Chinese consider their being "Chinese" at once an ethnic, cultural and political identity.
The Malaysian Chinese have traditionally dominated the Malaysian economy, but with the advent of affirmative action policies by the Malaysian government to protect the interests of ethnic Malays, their share has eroded somewhat. On most counts, however, they still make up the majority of the middle and upper income classes of Malaysia. As of 2006, there are about 7-7.5 million Chinese in Malaysia or 27% from Malaysian population. |
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Bumiputra or Bumiputera (Malay, from Sanskrit Bhumiputra; translated literally, it means "son of the soil"), is an official definition widely used in Malaysia, embracing ethnic Malays as well as other indigenous ethnic groups such as the Orang Asli in Peninsular Malaysia and the tribal peoples in Sabah and Sarawak. Economic policies designed to favour Bumiputras (including affirmative action in public education) were implemented in the 1970s in order to defuse inter-ethnic tensions following the May 13 Incident in 1969, but these have not been fully effective in eradicating poverty among rural bumiputras and have further caused a backlash of resentment on the part of non-bumi ethnic groups. |
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Certain pro-bumiputra policies known as the Bumiputra Laws exist as a means of affirmative action for bumiputras. Such policies include quotas for the following: admission to government educational institutions, qualification for public scholarships, positions in government and ownership in business. Most of them were established in the Malaysian New Economic Policy (NEP). Many of them focus on establishing a Bumiputra share of corporate equity comprising at least 30% of the total. This target was originally proposed by Ismail Abdul Rahman, after the government was unable to agree on a suitable policy goal.[3]
Examples of such policies include:
Companies listed on the Kuala Lumpur Stock Exchange (Bursa Saham Kuala Lumpur) must find Bumiputras to take up a minimum 30% of equity to satisfy listing requirements. MSC status companies listed on MESDAQ (Malaysia's latest stock exchange, modelled on the NASDAQ and other 'tech' stock exchanges) are not subject to this requirement.
A certain percentage of new housing in any development has to be sold to Bumiputra owners. Housing developers are required to provide a minimum 7% discount to Bumiputra buyers of these lots. There is no bumiputra discount on established housing.
A basket of government guaranteed and run mutual funds are available for purchase by Bumiputra buyers only.
Many government tendered projects require that companies submitting tenders be bumiputra owned. This requirement has led to non-Bumiputras teaming up with Bumiputra companies to obtain projects in a practice known as "Ali Baba" where Ali (the Bumiputra) exists solely to satisfy this requirement and Baba (the non Bumiputra) gives Ali a certain sum in exchange.
Projects were earmarked for Malay contractors to gain expertise in various fields. Often these projects would be sold as the bidders were not interested in the work, only in the gains that could be made from winning such a tender.
Approved Permits (APs) for automobiles preferentially allow Bumiputra to import vehicles. Automotive companies wishing to bring in cars need to have an AP to do so. APs were originally created to allow Bumiputra participation in the automotive industry since they were issued to companies with at least 70% Bumiputra ownership. In 2004, the Edge (a business newspaper) estimated that APs were worth approximately RM 35,000 a piece. They also estimated that Nasimuddin Amin, chairman of the Naza group received 6,387 for 2003, making him the largest recipient of APs. 12,234 APs were issued in 2003. In addition to APs, foreign car marquees are required to pay between 140% to 300% as an import duty.
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There are a lot more examples. Tell me if I can be of more help. |
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igotthisguitar
Joined: 08 Apr 2003
Location: South Korea (Permanent Vacation)
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 3:38 am Post subject: |
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Good for Ron Paul.
Good for freedom & truth.
Good for democratic values.
Good for helping to restore the integrity of the US electoral process.
Good for AMERICA. |
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thepeel
Joined: 08 Aug 2004
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:09 am Post subject: |
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| cbclark4 wrote: |
| BJWD wrote: |
| How is Israel a racist state? |
Are Palestinian immigrants allowed to own and build in Isreal?
Are non-Jews marriages reckognized by the state?
cbc |
I don't know.. Are they? Seriously. |
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