Site Search:
 
Speak Korean Now!
Teach English Abroad and Get Paid to see the World!
Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index Korean Job Discussion Forums
"The Internet's Meeting Place for ESL/EFL Teachers from Around the World!"
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Removed
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Job-related Discussion Forum
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Chokse



Joined: 22 May 2009

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Imagine that! A Korean cheating. Shocking!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
interestedinhanguk



Joined: 23 Aug 2010

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobbybigfoot wrote:

친차요?

진짜요?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bobbybigfoot



Joined: 05 May 2007
Location: Seoul

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

interestedinhanguk wrote:
bobbybigfoot wrote:

친차요?

진짜요?


pwned! Thanks for the correction. Embarassed
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bobbybigfoot wrote:
Op,

You seem to have lost sight of the number one cardinal rule in Korea:

(1) Education is a business. The parents are customers.

You are here for a business reason not an education reason. You are not a teacher. You are an employee.

NEVER tell your customers their kids are cheaters unless your boss specifically tells you to do so and I don't think there is a single boss in Korea who would do such a thing.

I made a similar mistake awhile back before I realized my role in Korea (that of an employee NOT that of a teacher): I used to grade children based on merit. Now I grade children based on what my employer wants to see. Everybody passes and 90% get an A. The rest get a B.

That's how they want it in Korea.

Eat humble pie then fall into line if you want to continue working in Korea.


This (the education is a business) is true in SOME cases in Korea, partly accurate in other cases and not true at all in many other cases as it is a far too simplisitic way to discuss education in Korea.

Sure some Hakwons are business first, education second. However, many are both and many others yet are education-centered. All however need to produce some educational results or they simply go out of business.

On the not a teacher but an employee point. Thats amusing because a teacher IS an employee, wherever he may work. You CAN in fact be a TEACHER if YOU decide to work as a teacher. You CAN also be a paid monkey if YOU limit yourself to this.

The amusing thing is that in many cases, people hired to teach in Korea are not teachers in the first place, do not intend to teach as a career and have little interest in teaching. They want a "gig" that "lets them see the world and take a break from their lives". Korea encourages this with extremely low selection standards for its foreign teachers (visa requirements). The thing is, being a TEACHER is about training, education but also critically dependant on skills and the WILL to actually teach.

Understanding what it is to be a teacher is also critical here just like understanding your ROLE in a school and your PLACE at that school is important.

REDUCING Korean ESL to a BUSINESS and EMPLOYEE model is a cop out that gives people liscence to do less, to treat their jobs as a joke and to miss the entire train on what it is to be a TEACHER.

You want good hakwons dedicated to education...look around there are plenty. No need to name any either. I worked for 2 myself, and many others I know worked for or are currently working for such schools.

Wherever you work in ESL you CAN be a TEACHER. That is in the vast majority, up to you.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
angma



Joined: 02 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:18 am    Post subject: Removed Reply with quote

Removed

Last edited by angma on Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
shifty



Joined: 21 Jun 2004

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

OP I can understand your frustration completely. I just hope you don't get to teach middleschoolers because their propensity to cheat is on a whole new level. It's like they're ingrained with it.

Then you'll really have to restrain yourself.

The parents are completely OTT. Once I declared to some middleschoolers that Neil Armstrong of spacewalk fame was a friend of mine, that I saw him regularly. They wanted me to prove it by producing
an autograph.

I had forgotten about it until I started getting regular reminders about the autograph. So I produced one. Of course they pronounced it a fake. All good healthy fun and encouraging to and fro.

Next thing I knew the director was in a huff since some parents instigated by a doyenne now accused me of making improper suggestions.

OP, any decent director knows that the foreign teacher will err from time to time in the sight of the crazy mothers. A competent director will shield and protect you from their interference.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Skippy



Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Daejeon

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

First off, you made something so minor, so big. GhBusan is right, but you also need to know when to just let things slide. Because something are just not worth the fight. Find that balance of being a good teacher and giving yourself less stress.

Also if you boss is not going to go to bat for you. Cancel the class, they do not like it, get rid of the class. Ask the boss to change to it and say sorry I will not teach it, I will teach everything else but that one. You need to turn the tables on the parents. You need to show them that okay you will not teach their daughter along with the other students in her class. How long do you thing the other parents want no foreign teacher not teaching before they go to the complainers and tell them to shut up, or they leave the school making the boss think which is worse 1 student or 5 to 10 students leaving. True you might get fired or let go, but you will have had the power and you have the chance to poison the well, if you are fired, tell us all the name of the place. Finding a another teacher might be difficult for them.

Good Luck
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Fat_Elvis



Joined: 17 Aug 2006
Location: In the ghetto

PostPosted: Tue Feb 15, 2011 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sounds to me like you should take another look at how you are assessing the performance of your students. Is it really that important to set tests for kindergarten students? Can't you just assess their performance based on a portfolio of work they produce in class, or using speaking assessments based on pairwork activities, or another kind of testing that can't be cheated on? And does it really matter if there's a bit of cheating in class? They're kindergarten students after all.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
oldtrafford



Joined: 12 Jan 2011

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat Elvis, perhaps it's the school that sets the tests. Cheating at any age is just wrong!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
oldtrafford



Joined: 12 Jan 2011

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wiltern, I was referring to the kid being a serial cheat in general.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
PatrickGHBusan



Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fat_Elvis wrote:
Sounds to me like you should take another look at how you are assessing the performance of your students. Is it really that important to set tests for kindergarten students? Can't you just assess their performance based on a portfolio of work they produce in class, or using speaking assessments based on pairwork activities, or another kind of testing that can't be cheated on? And does it really matter if there's a bit of cheating in class? They're kindergarten students after all.


Excellent post.

Our son was in Kindergarten last year and his assessements were based on his portfolio of activities along with a few exercises. Formalizing evaluations at this level is counter-productive.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
shifty



Joined: 21 Jun 2004

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 5:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

PatrickGHBusan wrote:
Formalizing evaluations at this level is counter-productive.


We all know that. It's the Korean parents that need telling.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sirius black



Joined: 04 Jun 2010

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been in Korea long enough to vote for the posts that said
1. Generally speaking hogwons are a business. Given a choice, keep the parents (typically the ajumas) happy even if what they want is not conducive to teaching.
2. Children cheat. They may or may not understand it in kindergarten but the FACT that they cheat at all educational levels (and oftentimes as adults) tells me its a cultural thing.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
oldtrafford



Joined: 12 Jan 2011

PostPosted: Wed Feb 16, 2011 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sirus I agree. I've only ever taught adults and they cheat. I have had students in the past ask me for the test paper. I've known admin. pass on papers to their friends/ lovers. I kid you not. I think I'll write a book about the goings on at my place of work, when I leave Korea. Problem is nobody would believe me!!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
angma



Joined: 02 Jul 2007

PostPosted: Sat Feb 19, 2011 11:10 pm    Post subject: Removed Reply with quote

Removed

Last edited by angma on Sun Aug 07, 2011 7:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Korean Job Discussion Forums Forum Index -> Job-related Discussion Forum All times are GMT - 8 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


This page is maintained by the one and only Dave Sperling.
Contact Dave's ESL Cafe
Copyright © 2018 Dave Sperling. All Rights Reserved.

Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group

TEFL International Supports Dave's ESL Cafe
TEFL Courses, TESOL Course, English Teaching Jobs - TEFL International