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School is trying to black list and deport me!
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austrian123

Joined: 15 Oct 2010

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:32 pm Post subject:

Quote:

If you didn't want it to get personal, you shouldn't have started by insulting people's careers.

There you go again convincing yourself that esl is a real career. I never intended to insult anyone. The OP was obviously distressed, I was just telling him to chill out a bit....losing your job in korea is not the end of the world. There is life beyond korea you know.

Quote:

No, it's the truth as you see it. Big difference..

And vice versa.

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Why wouldn't it? I'm not a hagwon monkey and I don't usually teach English.

Quote:

Why wouldn't they? I've worked as a teacher before I arrived in Korea. Why wouldn't I work as a teacher after I left Korea?

I don't think 90% of the esl teachers in korea would appreciate you referring to them as hagwon monkeys. Who's doing the insulting here?

So if you were a teacher before you came to Korea, that means you're certified and if this is the case then yes most likely can go back home to work as a teacher again. If you didn't have any teaching experience before coming to Korea, do you think your esl teaching experience would be transferable back home?

Quote:

Either way, why would I care? Doesn't apply to me or anyone I work with.

If you don't care, why are you so sensitive?

austrian123

Joined: 15 Oct 2010

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 12:39 pm Post subject:

PatrickGHBusan wrote:

austrian123 wrote:

Seoulnate and Patrickbusan....

I acknowledge that there are exceptions to the rule. However, have you considered many people are teaching or have taught in Korea? Hundreds of thousands? And of these hundreds of thousands, what percentage of them have been able to translate their work experience in Korea to meaningful jobs back home? Just because you know a handful of people who have been successful in making the transition, doesn't meant that it applies to all. Because generally speaking, esl experience isn't universally accepted as valid work experience back home.

All we are saying is that it is not a universal conclusion that ESL is not accepted as valid work experience back home. the point was well made before: it can work for you, it can be recognized but it needs to be referenced.

As for the hundreds of thousands of teachers who worked in Korea, I am fairly certain a lot of them managed to get their experience in Korea recongnized. Some of course did not, but that is the same way many people fail to get their experiences recognized properly when they apply for work. A lot of people simply have no clue and possibly no desire how to build a career and what that requires in terms of job choices, accumulating references, improving your skills and qualification...

So basically if as a teacher you sit on your hands in Korea and stick to ding ding dang hakwon where you punch in and punch out, do the minimum and play bingo, well then that experience will indeed be worth next to nothing. If on the other hand you do more with your job, get it referenced, then it can benefit you back home in several ways.

Thats it for me. Take care Smile

Thank you for your thoughts. I agree that it's not a universal conclusion..but it's a widely accepted conclusion. As for the hundreds of thousands of teachers who worked in Korea, I am fairly certain MOST of them did not manage to get their experience in Korea recongnized.

Listen, whether people on this board like to hear it or not....I've met tons of E2 visa holders in Korea. And in their moment of least resistance, they all admit to me that they are 'lost and directionless'...not exactly the type of go getters who try to make a legitmate career out of teaching esl in korea.

PatrickGHBusan

Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 3:34 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Listen, whether people on this board like to hear it or not....I've met tons of E2 visa holders in Korea. And in their moment of least resistance, they all admit to me that they are 'lost and directionless'...not exactly the type of go getters who try to make a legitmate career out of teaching esl in korea.

You just described the majority of people under 30 who enter the workforce in one field or another after graduating from university... Laughing

SeoulNate

Joined: 04 Jun 2010
Location: Hyehwa

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:30 pm Post subject:

austrian123 wrote:

Hypocritical again. You suggest that we have no way to speak for the thousands here, but you have no problem presuming that you know their situations.

Plain and simple, if you can not get your work here recognized by an employer back home then it is YOUR FAULT not the job, field, employer or any of that.

If you really want a guide on "Korea Work Experience: How to use it back home", I will write it. Most of it is just common sense and work.

As per the question, "Why am I still here?"

I KNOW that the work here transfers for me when I go back home and start teaching again, and the states that I would prefer to teach in allow 5 years of transfered time from another state/country and I am still enjoying myself with a year or so left to go on that.

austrian123

Joined: 15 Oct 2010

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:37 pm Post subject:

PatrickGHBusan wrote:

Quote:

You just described the majority of people under 30 who enter the workforce in one field or another after graduating from university... Laughing

How can you say something like that? I completely disagree. The majority of people who enter the work force upon graduating university are usually more focused and know for the most part what they want out of life.
That is why they're employed in their selected field and do not see the need to come to korea. When one is financially secure in one's field and making good coin with good benefits, why would anyone come to Korea...unless you don't have any other prospects.

austrian123

Joined: 15 Oct 2010

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:46 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Hypocritical again. You suggest that we have no way to speak for the thousands here, but you have no problem presuming that you know their situations.

I have no problem presuming because my conclusion is widely accepted.

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Plain and simple, if you can not get your work here recognized by an employer back home then it is YOUR FAULT not the job, field, employer or any of that.

I think you're taking this to personally. Sorry but ESL is not legitimate experience back in North America whether it's the fault of the individual or not.

Quote:

If you really want a guide on "Korea Work Experience: How to use it back home", I will write it. Most of it is just common sense and work.

As per the question, "Why am I still here?"

I KNOW that the work here transfers for me when I go back home and start teaching again, and the states that I would prefer to teach in allow 5 years of transfered time from another state/country and I am still enjoying myself with a year or so left to go on that.

I've already stated that since you're certified back home that you would have no problems finding work when you return. I was just wondering why a real teacher like yourself would come and stay in korea.

PatrickGHBusan

Joined: 24 Jun 2008
Location: Busan (1997-2008) Canada 2008 -

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 3:37 am Post subject:

austrian123 wrote:

PatrickGHBusan wrote:

Quote:

You just described the majority of people under 30 who enter the workforce in one field or another after graduating from university... Laughing

I am saying this based on experience as someone who worked on hiring committee, who interviewed people, who was also at times responsible for training new employees and who has run and managed his own consulting agency for the past 7 years.

The vast majority of new graduates have no clue as to what they want to do or how to get a career started and build on it. This in many ways is completely normal because they lack experience. Knowing what you want out of life and knowing what you want to do or how to do it are very different things by the way. Now again, if you wish to focus on education as a work field, the majority of FTs in Korea are inexperienced new grads. Many of them have no intention or training to be teachers and see the jpb as a chance to travel and earn some coin. Nothing wrong with this. That being said, that typical FT can still have his Korean experience recognized if he or she plays his cards right.

Private sector jobs that deal with international trade will actually favor people with international experience for example. You would need the relevant qualifications of course but that overseas experience can put you over other applicants with similar qualifications that have no experience abroad.

At the end of the day you are convinced of your position and thats fine. You can keep on believing that at no harm to others or yourself. However, in this thread a couple of people have presented you with their experiences (which you brushed aside are pretty much irrelevant or cases of exception). These experiences differ from your contention about how experience in Korea is valued.

As for Korean ESL, you really need to start spearating the newbies whp arrive fresh out of school with those teachers who make careers out of ESL. You are talking apples and organges here!

Finally, if someone is gainfully employed intheir field back home, the chance they move ANYWHERE to teach are pretty slim, but then again thats not the people we are talkign about is it? Wink

As for me, I was a certified public school teacher in Canada before coming to Korea. I left to get some different teaching experience and took a sabbatical (1 year). That sabbatical turned into a 10 year stay in Korea where I worked as a teacher, started a consulting firm, acquired another language, got married and started a family. All that work experience led, after a short 4 years for example to job offers in the private and public sector back home and abroad. My teaching experience would have been recognized in Canada as well and would have moved me up the payscale had I returned to teaching. Then in 2008 I got an offer I could not turn down from public sector Canada. That job was to be based in Seoul but events conspired to change that. I was then transfered to Canada for a similar job.

How did I get that job and the offers before it? Based on my experience abroad thats how.

I am far from alone in this. I know many FTs who came to Korea and did just as well or even better. On this very board you have people who became tenure track professors, who run their own companies, who founded and run their own schools. Many arrived as teachers and changed along the way.

You can find just as many people who used their teaching experience in Korea to get jobs back home.

Of course you can also find people who came to Korea for a gig, a few bucks and a chance to travel and who returned home 2-3 years later with a gaping hole in their resume that limited itself to "I worked 3 years for Playland Hakwon" without any references to back it up. Combined with a BA in basket weaving this of course leads to extremely limited options.

Then again...how well would Mr Basket Weaving have done had he not gone to Korea to teach? How much better off would he have been back home?