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MBC:The Shocking Reality About Relationships With Foreigners
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northway

Joined: 05 Jul 2010

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:21 am Post subject:

Quote:

Nowhere in the video does it say it's part of Western culture to transmit HIV or leave women pregnant, LOL. At most this is more Jersey Shore (a US reality TV program about Italian-Americans) than it is Stormfront. Again, I just think folks are projecting their Western paranoia/ideology about racism onto what was a fairly harmless piece. Sorry folks but the Western history of racism as a model does not fit in the Korean context.

I'm not projecting anything. In her response, the producer stated that the piece was merely showing cultural differences. Yes, that would be hilarious, save for the fact that the producer actually said it, and the fact that she did says a lot about the mindset behind its production. Jersey Shore it is not.

slothrop

Joined: 03 Feb 2003

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:03 pm Post subject:

edit Last edited by slothrop on Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:21 pm; edited 1 time in total

fermentation

Joined: 22 Jun 2009

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 10:33 pm Post subject:

slothrop wrote:

6 weeks later 'truth about foreigners' documentary part2 airs with your voice over, heavily edited.....
-hello.....hear me.... complaint... truth about foreigner... most foreign men... playboy.... have aids... do drugs....dispicible fashion.... sense..... make angry.....foreigner... love... you... long time.... bad..... customer... understand?

Lulz.

Dodge7

Joined: 21 Oct 2011

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:10 pm Post subject:

slothrop wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

Guys I keep telling you, stop viewing it as a political issue and the targets as political entities and making this about human rights.

We are lodging a customer complaint against a business we purchase services from (through our cable TV subscriptions). We are allowed to do that.

It is not against our visa rules to lodge customer complaints with businesses we purchase services from.

In our rage with issues that we have with Korea and by extension the Korean government, our mentality keeps on defaulting to protest and petitioning the government and complaining about human rights.

Step back and soberly view the issue as stemming from a single report on a single station. Lodge a customer complaint against MBC or your cable/satellite TV provider for bad customer service.

If you start going after the Korean media/government you've magnified the problem and will accomplish nothing. That's too many big fish. Use your brain not your anger. Go after one report on one station, a station that is already in the crapper with other issues? You might get somewhere and that one station can set a precedent.

Critical thinking.

customer complaint phone call to mbc...

customer-hello, is this mbc?
mbc-yoboseyo?
customer-hello?
mbc-yoboseyo?
customer-can you hear me?
mbc-neeeeeeeeh.
customer-i have a complaint about the truth about foreigner documentary. most foreign men are not playboys, do not have aids and do not do drugs.
mbc-neeeeeeeeh.
customer-i think it was really unfair for your mainstream newschannel to depict foeigners, who are your customers, in that dispicable fashion. it doesn't make sense to make customers angry, correct? listen, i usually love your programing and have watched you for along time.
mbc-neeeeeeeeeh.
customer-i just wanted to go on record and lodge this customer complaint, not about human rights, but about bad customer service. understand?
mbc.-neeeeeeeh.argetsamnida. comsamnida.

2 weeks later a 20$ gift certificate to tgi fridays shows up in your mail box courtesy of mbc.

6 weeks later 'truth about foreigners' documentary part2 airs with your voice over, heavily edited.....
-hello.....hear me.... complaint... truth about foreigner... most foreign men... playboy.... have aids... do drugs....dispicible fashion.... sense..... make angry.....foreigner... love... you... long time.... bad..... customer... understand?

best post on Daves lol

Steelrails

Joined: 12 Mar 2009
Location: Earth, Solar System

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:35 pm Post subject:

slothrop wrote:

Steelrails wrote:

No, I'm saying that when you protest in front of their headquarters you make sure to frame under the context of "customer complaint". Not to call up the customer complaint line.

Duh.

And so what? Petition the government? Replay your call only substitute MBC with "Korean Justice Dept." AND they might deport you on top of it.

But since we can't politically protest, we have to do the end around. Unless you have a better idea?

slothrop

Joined: 03 Feb 2003

Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:58 pm Post subject:

edit Last edited by slothrop on Mon Jun 18, 2012 11:21 pm; edited 1 time in total

Los Angeloser

Joined: 26 Aug 2010
Location: Korea

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 12:26 am Post subject:

TheUrbanMyth wrote:

Los Angeloser wrote:

TheUrbanMyth wrote:

Adventurer wrote:

[That is what I was stating to Urban Myth. He stated that since the E-2 laws, that it cannot be viewed as a violation of our human rights since it's a visa-related law. Yet, many people view it as a moral, human right to assemble and protest. .

And many don't. Very few countries look kindly upon on NON-CITIZENS assembling and protesting. Plus when we accepted the E-2 visa we gave up that right as we accepted that we could be deported for doing so.

From what I understand it is legal to hold a "one man/person silent" protest in S. Korea, even for E-2 visa holders. In fact, anyone can go to the proper city office and register to do so. However, like other Korean laws which are counterdicting you can be sued for libel, even charged criminally. But, you will not be deported since it would only be a small fine of 1 million won(criminally) and the "one man protest" should not prevent you from getting another E-2 visa. I doubt MBC would sue individuals in civil court(David and Goliath syndrome) as long as you don't lie[or write on sign(s)], but you never know? Since group demonstrations are or have already been held the one-man protest is moot?

From what I understand I rather believe you understand wrongly.

But if you are correct no doubt you can point us to said law which allows one man protests for everyone including non-citizens.

Your belief is flat wrong. Seoul Immigration will not deport a teacher for conducting a properly registered one-man silent demonstration. And yes the hagwon could file charges in criminal and civil court but the petty crime will not get you deported. Depending on how much the hagwon owes a teacher it might be worth it but I'd do it only as a very last result. A teacher should expect the hagwon to sue in civil court where maybe everything could be straightened out, again, only as a very last result. However, if the teacher wasn't planning ever return or stick around for however long(1 year or so) to see a possible case to the end then why not get a little pay back in some manner before you leave without salary money + owed?

Adventurer

Joined: 28 Jan 2006

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 7:17 am Post subject:

slothrop wrote:

no better idea. i was just trying to be funny. your idea is interesting. like going after al capone for not paying his taxes because you can't get him for murder.LOL but mbc, the korean people, and the international media don't care about this issue. they have bigger fish to fry than the hurt feelings of foreign english teachers and a few guys married to korean women.

i think the best thing to do is talk about the real issues and their causes, not to change anything in the near future, but just to not let people rationalize it away or be in denial about it. in the end when the truth is accepted in OUR minds and is revealed through our daily conversations with koreans and each other they will have no choice but to deal with their dillusional conceptual framework and their acceptance of racism on an individual basis.

one thing to start with is to stop acting like it's ok to keep being tested for aids and drugs. if you are tested anymore than your korean coworker it is racist. i'm not saying don't take the test and get fired or get deported, btw, but at least let every teacher in your school and your principal and the MOE and your doctor know that you feel it is a pure unadulterated racism and you think less of them for it.

1 thing you could do is the next time a documentary like this is aired... when you show up to work the next day tell your coworkers that you are "embarrassed for korea" because of their racist media. this may work better than getting angry.

This wasn't about foreign teachers. This was an attack on all Westerners who live in Korea, not only EFL instructors. It didn't say instructors, and the Western media does care. Many reported on it, and many asked the Korean Government for comments, and all they would say is they have no control over MBC, and it's a private group. We know that's all just face-saving comments. I'm sure they were embarrassed somewhat. Also, a friend of mine who can read Korean told me that a conservative newspaper trashed that MBC video as horribly unprofessional. I think it's not business as usual.

sirius black

Joined: 04 Jun 2010

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 2:22 pm Post subject:

While the expose said 'foreigners' by showing only people who were teachers or who were believed to be, they were addressing male foreign teachers specifically. They didn't show international students, SE asian migrants, etc. approaching korean women. For obvious reasons since korean women aren't dating them. They were targeting the category of teachers korean women date and that is male english teachers. So, they were targeting teachers. I do agree that the western media probably wouldn't care. As noted before by others, I don't see the show changing much.

Adventurer

Joined: 28 Jan 2006

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:13 pm Post subject:

sirius black wrote:

While the expose said 'foreigners' by showing only people who were teachers or who were believed to be, they were addressing male foreign teachers specifically. They didn't show international students, SE asian migrants, etc. approaching korean women.
For obvious reasons since korean women aren't dating them. They were targeting the category of teachers korean women date and that is male english teachers.
So, they were targeting teachers. I do agree that the western media probably wouldn't care.
As noted before by others, I don't see the show changing much.

In my opinion, some Koreans feel insecure vis-a-vis Westerners, and that's why there's a focus on Westerners. We are high status countries in the eyes of Koreans, and some men feel insecure about the idea that Western men are dating their women. Never mind that a large percentage of Korean men are marrying non-Korean women, so it shouldn't be a problem. Far fewer Korean women marry foreign men compared to Korean men marrying foreign women.

And when people complain about the MBC report, the apologists bring up the fact that most teachers are white, so they have no ground to talk about prejudice as if prejudice against a certain color is acceptable, and it presumes that all the Westerners of Puerto Rican, Dominican, Asian, and African American extraction are all happy campers with the way the media sometimes deal with us. They're not happy with it, either. We clearly saw one or two black people in the video, though we didn't see their faces.

We keep on hearing some xenophobic Koreans saying all these Westerners are 20 year old somethings who couldn't find a job.
It's easier to pay your loans here than there. Anyway, do those critics have such a low view of their country that they would say only losers would come to Korea? In a way, it shows a kind of insecurity some Koreans have. I think it explains such shows on MBC. Some want to trash us out of insecurity.

I will add, however, that many Koreans do like us and appreciate us. They think we're kind of a breath of fresh air, culturally. Some find that they find a certain freedom with Westerners, culturally.
I don't know what to make of the song "Itaewon Freedom", but it tells me that some kind something positive about our respective Western cultures. We have something to bring to the table.
And if we all didn't have student loans and debt and a great economy, there would not be enough foreigners to teach Koreans.

comm

Joined: 22 Jun 2010

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:33 pm Post subject:

sirius black wrote:

Steelrails has been trying to make the point that NETs are incredibly self-centered "world revolves around me" types... and you're desperately trying to prove him right.

There are MORE U.S. troops in Korea than there are NETs (by the way, if anyone has a better source for the number of NETs in Korea I'd appreciate it). Add in foreign students, tourists and other sectors of employment and most "Western" foreigners in Korea are not teachers. Please try to understand: White person =/= teacher. I have never had a Korean assume I was a teacher without asking, and yet you would... ridiculous.

Adventurer

Joined: 28 Jan 2006

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 4:50 pm Post subject:

comm wrote:

sirius black wrote:

Some of the guys in the video could have been soldiers. It didn't say anything about teachers per se. It said there's a problem with the morals of Westerners in Korea. For me, it's kind of a joke because there are many kids in the Philippines who are half Korean, and their fathers are AWOL. I doubt those Korean men were perfect angels. They were just there for the sex, and that's a large percentage of Korean men who go to that country. We don't come here seeking sex with Korean women. If we're soldiers, we're here because Uncle Sam sent us here rather than somewhere else. If we're teachers we could be here for a combination of reasons including wanting to experience an Asian culture, pay off loans, and have a change of scenery.

The language of the documentary had it directed against all Westerners, and it had Caucasians and African Americans in the video. It's not about the whites. The report was slamming the idea of Korean women dating the white and black males show in the video as if it's some horrible thing to do.

Hugo85

Joined: 27 Aug 2010

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:23 pm Post subject:

Adventurer wrote:

We keep on hearing some xenophobic Koreans saying all these Westerners are 20 year old somethings who couldn't find a job.

That's the same as on this forum seemingly..

TheUrbanMyth

Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:33 pm Post subject:

Adventurer wrote:

[There's a problem with your logic here. What is spent? Money is spent. Korea overtook Japan, which is in 14th place. Where would Korea be if it did not spend that money. You also forget that certain places that best Korea were former British colonial possessions like Singapore and Malaysia. And the Philippines was heavily influenced by the U.S. for many decades. You avoid giving the proper context to their position.

Earlier, you were dismissive of the idea that the EFL instructors contribute to the Korean economy, and you're using the fact that it's only 3rd in terms of ranking in Asia to say it was pointless for all those EFL instructors to have come, when Koreans can use the English they learned to help them trade with other countries, and that's why we're here in many cases. So only if they received a ranking of number 1 would it have been worthwhile for foreign EFL instructors to be here? That's almost what it sounds like you're saying. It's a losing point. If Korea didn't think it was vital for them economically, that we come here, we would not be here. We're not simply a luxury as you stated. If we have helped them improve somewhat then that's for their economic good.

EFL instructors do NOT contribute in a meaningful way into the economy because of 2 things. First of all we are less than half of ONE percent of the population. Our contribution is meaningless. Secondly most people can (if they know how to budget) save around half or so of their money which they then take with them when they leave. As opposed to that money being paid to a Korean and being spent in Korea.

Secondly I'm not saying that it is pointless for ESL/EFL instructors to come...I'm saying Korea is not getting value for its money as COMPARED to other places. This is not to say that there are no problems with the Korean hiring system. They should double the salary and halve the positions and place qualifications first and foremost. At 4 million won a month they wouldn't have trouble hiring qualified certifed teachers and it wouldn't cost anymore than now (remember there is only 1/2 the positions). They'd actually save money on the housing and insurance.

wylies99

Joined: 13 May 2006
Location: I'm one cool cat!

Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2012 5:58 pm Post subject:

Hugo85 wrote:

Adventurer wrote:

We keep on hearing some xenophobic Koreans saying all these Westerners are 20 year old somethings who couldn't find a job.

That's the same as on this forum seemingly..

Yet they seem to have 24 hours a day free to post on here while the rest of us are working. Makes you wonder why the jealousy and so much free time- are they unemployed?

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