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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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 Posted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
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young_clinton
Joined: 09 Sep 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Konglishman wrote: |
Indoor Heating: Seoul wins with the widespread use of ondol heating. That said, it is possible to find this option in Shanghai if you are willing to pay enough rent money.
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I had Ondol heating in my apartment on top of a house, although I probably would have preferred central heating. Could you explain the advantages of Ondol heating? |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 10:56 pm Post subject: |
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| young_clinton wrote: |
| Konglishman wrote: |
Indoor Heating: Seoul wins with the widespread use of ondol heating. That said, it is possible to find this option in Shanghai if you are willing to pay enough rent money.
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I had Ondol heating in my apartment on top of a house, although I probably would have preferred central heating. Could you explain the advantages of Ondol heating? |
When you sit on the floor you can keep your cup of coffee warm by placing it next to you. That's about it.  |
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byrddogs
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 11:52 pm Post subject: |
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| 12ax7 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
Self-doubt by whom? |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 12:29 am Post subject: |
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| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
Self-doubt by whom? |
Isn't it obvious? |
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byrddogs
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:05 am Post subject: |
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| 12ax7 wrote: |
| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
Self-doubt by whom? |
Isn't it obvious? |
Yep, you're right, it is. |
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12ax7
Joined: 07 Nov 2009
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| Posted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 1:51 am Post subject: |
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| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
Self-doubt by whom? |
Isn't it obvious? |
Yep, you're right, it is. |
Good, so I hope you stop doubting your decisions from now on. |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| young_clinton wrote: |
| Konglishman wrote: |
Indoor Heating: Seoul wins with the widespread use of ondol heating. That said, it is possible to find this option in Shanghai if you are willing to pay enough rent money.
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I had Ondol heating in my apartment on top of a house, although I probably would have preferred central heating. Could you explain the advantages of Ondol heating? |
With air heating, when you open the door or window, the heat's gone. With Ondol, floor heating, opening the window or door doesn't make the room lose it's heat. Pretty good Korean invention, actually. |
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Konglishman
Joined: 14 Sep 2007
Location: Nanjing
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| Posted: Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:46 pm Post subject: |
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| young_clinton wrote: |
| Konglishman wrote: |
Indoor Heating: Seoul wins with the widespread use of ondol heating. That said, it is possible to find this option in Shanghai if you are willing to pay enough rent money.
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I had Ondol heating in my apartment on top of a house, although I probably would have preferred central heating. Could you explain the advantages of Ondol heating? |
I probably should have elaborated on that point a little more. Due to laws regarding the use of central heating in China, Shanghai is just far enough south for widespread central heating to not be allowed. So, the only heating you can typically get is from air conditioner units which is not particularly efficient. That combined with many apartments not having much better insulation than Korean apartments, the majority of Shanghai residents who not rich (meaning they could not afford to have any kind of efficient heating system such as ondol) will just wear winter coats inside in order to cope with the winter.
Some people will also use heat fans, but I have found this only works particularly well for small rooms. |
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byrddogs
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Location: Shanghai
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| Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 1:31 am Post subject: |
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| 12ax7 wrote: |
| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| byrddogs wrote: |
| 12ax7 wrote: |
| jvalmer wrote: |
| Wow, a city pissing contest debated by foreigners to both cities. |
Yeah, this one's got self-doubt written all over it. |
Self-doubt by whom? |
Isn't it obvious? |
Yep, you're right, it is. |
Good, so I hope you stop doubting your decisions from now on. |
 at that and you. |
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lemak
Joined: 02 Jan 2011
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| Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 2:07 am Post subject: |
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| Konglishman wrote: |
Air Quality: Seoul wins, but keep in mind there are still some bad days in terms of air quality in Seoul and Shanghai does usually have reasonably good air.
Architecture: Shanghai wins hands down. How could it not with the French Quarter and the famous Shanghai Tower and so forth?
Cleanliness: It is basically a tie. Seoul has a much more organized recycling program, but on the other hand, I would say there is not nearly as much spitting in Shanghai as there is in Seoul.
Food from the Grocery Store: Shanghai wins in this category definitely. It is much cheaper than in Seoul and there is a wider variety and availability of fruits.
Friendliness of People: I have heard it argued that the rich Shanghainese can be more snooty compared to Koreans. I do not really agree with that based on my own limited experiences. That said, I would imagine it depends on what social circles you run in due to your specific occupation. Also, it is worth pointing out that many Chinese who live in Shanghai are originally from elsewhere in China. So, to some extent, there is a shared experience by both Chinese and foreigners starting life in Shanghai as outsiders. Due to this along with the fact that Confucianism no longer plays much of a role in society there, it tends to be much easier for Chinese and foreigners to relate to each other. Hence, I would say on a whole, Shanghai tends to be a friendlier city.
Indoor Heating: Seoul wins with the widespread use of ondol heating. That said, it is possible to find this option in Shanghai if you are willing to pay enough rent money.
International Food: Shanghai wins easily, but it is not as if Seoul is not lacking in options. Still, the wide variety of international restaurants in Shanghai cannot be emphasized enough.
Internet Access and Speed: Of course, Seoul wins in this category hands down. That said, aside from some occasional frustrations with VPN's not working as well as one would like, Shanghai generally has fairly decent Internet service.
Local Food: It is a tie. On a whole, I prefer Korean food over the bland Shanghainese and Jiangsu food. On the other hand, there are many other types of much tastier Chinese food that can be easily had in Shanghai such as Sizhuan and Xinjiang food. And of course, Chinese dumplings are usually quite good.
Public Transportation: Seoul wins in this category. This is because Seoul has a slightly more dense and comprehensive subway system. Further, it is easy to use the city buses whereas in Shanghai you really have to be familiar with written Chinese in order to easily navigate the bus system. Finally, the taxi drivers in Seoul are quite knowledgeable and even if they do not know where your destination is, they can immediately figure it out whereas many of the taxi drivers in Shanghai seem to be from elsewhere in China and need very exact directions.
Variety of Job Opportunities: Shanghai wins in this category without a question. In the teaching field alone, there are many opportunities to teach things other than English such as physics, calculus, economics, etc. while in Seoul such jobs for foreigners are fairly scarce although this might be beginning to change. |
Having lived several years in both I'd say this is pretty much spot on.
Seoul has a couple of advantages over Shangers, but in general the latter is light years ahead in terms of quality of life. |
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D.D.
Joined: 29 May 2008
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| Posted: Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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I would have to say after living in both that I would return to Seoul over Shanghai and this is for one reason and that is health. If I wanted to save some money I could do that in Seoul.
For me Shanghai was hard to live a healthy lifestyle. It had such bad air that anyone living their should be worried of cancer in the future. I had one smoke after leaving Shanghai and in a clean air environment it was such a different experience. The contrast made the smoke horrible where as in Shanghai it was hard to feel the effects.
I also didn't have much will power as there was so much night life in Shanghai I didn't choose a boring night inside over nights out with my friends. Many of my friends had high paying jobs and hanging out with them was expensive.
There is so much junk in the food and fake alcohol in China and with the air on top of that it's a horrible place health wise.
Many of us just become desensitised after a week or so and don't think about it much.
If health isn't a focus Shanghai is so much much better than Seoul. There is so many things to do, people to go out with etc.
One year after Shanghai I am 40 pounds lighter, don't smoke, drink healthy smoothies, feel years younger. I still miss those nights out with all my friends in Shanghai but I wouldn't have lived much longer if I stayed.
Sometimes I wonder would it be better to live 15 amazing years in Shanghai and die at 50 or so rather than 30 boring years in North America and live to 75. There sure is a lot of expats in Shanghai that wont live past 55 at the pace they are going. |
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expatjb
Joined: 23 Aug 2013
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| Posted: Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:02 am Post subject: |
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Both cities are great if you know people.
The one thing I like about Shanghai is that yes, it's so much more international, and there is more an opportunity to diversify and have many other opportunities outside of ESL. It has an entrepreneurial vibe and you meet so many different types of locals and expats then you might meet in Korea. You can meet like minds on Korea as well though. It really depends on long term goals and prospects in my mind. If it's not in ESL, Shanghai may not be a bad bet. |
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Janny
Joined: 02 Jul 2008
Location: all over the place
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:53 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks everybody. I am looking forward to an interesting, professional, culinarily exciting experience! NOT looking forward to the pollution, but hey...we all go somehow. Get an air purifier. |
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