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Korean Job Discussion Forums
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Adam Carolla
Joined: 26 Feb 2010
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 Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 9:03 am Post subject: |
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| edwardcatflap wrote: |
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| I do miss the huge paid vacation which is one of the better perks of the job. |
Interesting. Back in July you said
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| No I don't get that much I get 38 days annual leave in total, |
at your current job.
As far as I know public school teachers in Korea get 20 days holiday plus 16 national holidays = only 36 days annual leave
Hagwan workers get less 10 days plus public holidays = 26 days annual leave.
Maybe you were at a university and forgot to mention it? |
Before the advent of summer and winter English camps, I think public school teachers used to have the entire break off. (I could be wrong on this but I have vague recollections that public teachers used to have pretty good vaction schedules.)
Also, he may have worked at a private school. My last private school had 7-8 weeks vacation + national holidays. |
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hagwonnewbie
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Location: Asia
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| Posted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 11:30 am Post subject: |
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As far as I know, Korea is the only country in Asia that requires teachers to teach 30 hours a week. There are sweeter gigs, but that's par. It's a good place for teachers to start, but if you really want to upgrade your life and career significantly, you'd best move on to another country with more reasonable conditions.
The reality is that the less hours your contracted to teach and work, the more money you'll make on the side. |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:56 am Post subject: |
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| hagwonnewbie wrote: |
As far as I know, Korea is the only country in Asia that requires teachers to teach 30 hours a week. There are sweeter gigs, but that's par. It's a good place for teachers to start, but if you really want to upgrade your life and career significantly, you'd best move on to another country with more reasonable conditions.
The reality is that the less hours your contracted to teach and work, the more money you'll make on the side. |
30 hours a week is par for hakwons
22 hours a week is par for public schools...and in smaller rural schools even less. I've seen several schedules that (in terms of hours worked) seemed pretty good. One guy taught 18 hours a week and another taught only 13 hours a week. That would seem like too much free time (at least for me)...but different strokes for different folks |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 2:03 am Post subject: |
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| There are way more hagwon jobs than public school jobs. Most E-2s don't have a public school job. (They're not easy to get anymore.) |
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TheUrbanMyth
Joined: 28 Jan 2003
Location: Retired
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 6:41 am Post subject: |
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| World Traveler wrote: |
| There are way more hagwon jobs than public school jobs. Most E-2s don't have a public school job. (They're not easy to get anymore.) |
The poster I was responding to never said anything about hakwons vs public school. He said that
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| Korea is the only country in Asia that requires teachers to teach 30 hours a week. There are sweeter gigs, but that's par |
I merely pointed out that it depends on your employer and type of school you are in. But if it comes to that, there are WAY more public schools than hakwons. (this was threshed out in one of the public schools vs hakwons threads ages ago)
And do you by any chance have any source for your claim that most E-2's don't have a public school job? |
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JohnML
Joined: 05 Jul 2015
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 10:20 am Post subject: |
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| There are definitely not way more public school positions at least open positions, than hagwon ones. That's the first time I've ever seen anyone suggest such a thing. |
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World Traveler
Joined: 29 May 2009
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| source for your claim that most E-2's don't have a public school job? |
Roughly 5K in public. Roughly 15 K in hagwons. (Both of these numbers are down.)
Google.com |
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Weigookin74
Joined: 26 Oct 2009
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| Posted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 4:22 pm Post subject: |
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| TheUrbanMyth wrote: |
| hagwonnewbie wrote: |
As far as I know, Korea is the only country in Asia that requires teachers to teach 30 hours a week. There are sweeter gigs, but that's par. It's a good place for teachers to start, but if you really want to upgrade your life and career significantly, you'd best move on to another country with more reasonable conditions.
The reality is that the less hours your contracted to teach and work, the more money you'll make on the side. |
30 hours a week is par for hakwons
22 hours a week is par for public schools...and in smaller rural schools even less. I've seen several schedules that (in terms of hours worked) seemed pretty good. One guy taught 18 hours a week and another taught only 13 hours a week. That would seem like too much free time (at least for me)...but different strokes for different folks |
But, you're still at your school for 40 hours a week deskwarming. A few isolated rural areas may still let you go home when you are done. It use to be that way with me. As for the breaks some places gave the teachers the full break off. Others like mine sent me around to all the schools in my area doing English camps in the morning or sitting at the education office in the morning chilling. But, I only had half days during the vacation and could tack on an extra one or two days to each of my vacations (summer and winter).
In the semester, most schools did let me go home early and take off exam days. I also taught less than 22 hours. Nowadays and in recent years, it's always 22 hours and I must stay till 4:30. Some schools will let me go home early on exam days and when doing the English camps. Others will make you stay until 4:30 even on those days now. Also, 18 days vacation means 18 days vacation. Kind of blows, but the pay rate is much better than your typical 2.1 million hakwon I guess and the renewal allowance of 2.0 million comes in handy each year. |
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Mr. Pink
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:24 am Post subject: |
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Do people really still only make 2mil a month? Really?
I think you could make more at fast food back home for the same amount of work... |
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Fallacy
Joined: 29 Jun 2015
Location: ex-ROK
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 6:18 am Post subject: |
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| Agreed. In 2015, I would not come here to earn, or stay here if I earned, anything less than 3.0 per month. Absolute minimum for me. |
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JohnML
Joined: 05 Jul 2015
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 10:07 am Post subject: |
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| Fallacy wrote: |
| Agreed. In 2015, I would not come here to earn, or stay here if I earned, anything less than 3.0 per month. Absolute minimum for me. |
This is the problem though, many many people are willing to accept even 1.8 million because of other reasons such as travelling and staying in a different country. So much so I don't think we're anywhere near as bad as it's going to get. I think it'll get to the point genuinely where it'll be under 1.5 or so going rate (or equivalent with inflation). Japan is further down the ladder than Korea likely due to previous popularity. It is to be expected though with the increase in degree holders and young people wanting to travel the world, it's inevitable.
As for the high paid universities etc, one of two things I see happening with these jobs. I don't see the pay decreasing but I don't see positions keeping up with demand. I can see requirements going up for these jobs to 5 years+ experience within your own country and much better candidates coming through. This will push the still highly qualified teachers who can't get these jobs into the lower hagwon positions (I've seen examples of this already). Thus slowly phasing out the lower qualified (TEFL cert only) candidates and extremely qualified people working for around 2 mil within the next decade, easily. Korea is already getting pretty hard to find work.
Next after that is going to be China, basically any country popular for ESL is going to see the same thing happening. I would bet a large sum of money on it. If TEFL paid as much as professional jobs/other industries (it doesn't nearly) everyone would be doing it because of travel + easier job + low entry requirements. It would be perfect, perfect things don't exist. As for professionals already here, either get qualified so you can jump back home to teach if shit hits the fan or get qualified in another industry that actually sees salary increases. Anyone who is realistic would already be doing so. |
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Mr. Pink
Joined: 21 Oct 2003
Location: China
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| Posted: Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:38 pm Post subject: |
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| Fallacy wrote: |
| Agreed. In 2015, I would not come here to earn, or stay here if I earned, anything less than 3.0 per month. Absolute minimum for me. |
I left Korea 10 years ago and I was making over 3mil a month, and I had around 10 weeks of paid vacation included in that.
I really feel sorry for people that feel they have no choice. Really, China is a way better choice imo.
Especially if you speak a bit of Korean already, come to a city with a large Korean population. You can make a bundle doing privates.
For new grads, if they come and learn a bit of Chinese and can get the rich Chinese market for tutoring...man there are so many rich Chinese willing to pay for English lessons.
Anyways, those who are doing 2mil a month or less, you are wasting your time. |
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JohnML
Joined: 05 Jul 2015
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| Posted: Sat Oct 10, 2015 6:19 am Post subject: |
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| Mr. Pink wrote: |
| Fallacy wrote: |
| Agreed. In 2015, I would not come here to earn, or stay here if I earned, anything less than 3.0 per month. Absolute minimum for me. |
I left Korea 10 years ago and I was making over 3mil a month, and I had around 10 weeks of paid vacation included in that.
I really feel sorry for people that feel they have no choice. Really, China is a way better choice imo.
Especially if you speak a bit of Korean already, come to a city with a large Korean population. You can make a bundle doing privates.
For new grads, if they come and learn a bit of Chinese and can get the rich Chinese market for tutoring...man there are so many rich Chinese willing to pay for English lessons.
Anyways, those who are doing 2mil a month or less, you are wasting your time. |
China is definitely better but it's going down too because everyone is doing exactly as you suggested (you can see many people on these forums have done so). The large cities used to pay well but now it's kindof meh, even for privates. The smaller destinations are mostly poor folk and i've seen private tuition hitting about 23,000 won/h average. 30,000 upper end. The average wage is like 2.5 million in the bigger cities and sub 2.0 elsewhere. You probably will be working less though! Put it this way, I know people working in China with a degree for 900,000 won/20 teaching hours.
Overall, I think it's about the same as Korea in the money department the only difference being you have the opportunity to work much less. There are plenty of private schools with who give you a summer/winter vacation but they are sly, usually it's they pay you 20% of your wage so you are forced to do private tuition. The best way to make money in China by far if you aren't a professional is to hit a new market. On the other hand, the real way to make cash in teaching English is the middle east quite honestly because most people don't want to go there. |
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GENO123
Joined: 28 Jan 2010
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| Posted: Sat Oct 10, 2015 9:34 pm Post subject: |
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| JohnML wrote: |
| Mr. Pink wrote: |
| Fallacy wrote: |
| Agreed. In 2015, I would not come here to earn, or stay here if I earned, anything less than 3.0 per month. Absolute minimum for me. |
I left Korea 10 years ago and I was making over 3mil a month, and I had around 10 weeks of paid vacation included in that.
I really feel sorry for people that feel they have no choice. Really, China is a way better choice imo.
Especially if you speak a bit of Korean already, come to a city with a large Korean population. You can make a bundle doing privates.
For new grads, if they come and learn a bit of Chinese and can get the rich Chinese market for tutoring...man there are so many rich Chinese willing to pay for English lessons.
Anyways, those who are doing 2mil a month or less, you are wasting your time. |
China is definitely better but it's going down too because everyone is doing exactly as you suggested (you can see many people on these forums have done so). The large cities used to pay well but now it's kindof meh, even for privates. The smaller destinations are mostly poor folk and i've seen private tuition hitting about 23,000 won/h average. 30,000 upper end. The average wage is like 2.5 million in the bigger cities and sub 2.0 elsewhere. You probably will be working less though! Put it this way, I know people working in China with a degree for 900,000 won/20 teaching hours.
Overall, I think it's about the same as Korea in the money department the only difference being you have the opportunity to work much less. There are plenty of private schools with who give you a summer/winter vacation but they are sly, usually it's they pay you 20% of your wage so you are forced to do private tuition. The best way to make money in China by far if you aren't a professional is to hit a new market. On the other hand, the real way to make cash in teaching English is the middle east quite honestly because most people don't want to go there. |
China is better than Korea right now. ESL in Korea is pretty much just junk now. Esl Korea = worst of all worlds. Low salaries ,bad employeers and bad treatment in general. |
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schwa
Joined: 18 Jan 2003
Location: Yap
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| Posted: Sun Oct 11, 2015 2:09 am Post subject: |
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I get the impression standard entry level wages & benefits for young minimally qualified native english efl teachers in much of SE Asia, parts of China, eastern Europe (maybe even some EU countries), Central Asia, Central & South America, Turkey, Russia, etc, are half or less what Korea is currently offering.
The hardships of living in some of those countries plus scant pay might make Korea's cultural challenges seem mild, yet untold thousands still take those jobs.
Not sure what my point is or if I even have one, just tossing that into the conversation. |
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