Korean Job Discussion Forums

[Us in DC]

Rawiri - Another useless, vindictive post that says nothing about the issue and just proves my point that you have nothing to contribute to the conversation. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe your negative experiences are a result of your crappy personality and not your race.

I have spent time in a number of places where people have pretty extreme views about Americans and have had a lot of luck working with people. Namely Vietnam and Russia. Some people treated me horribly. Some people were great. That's how these things go.

This board is here for people to deal with the feelings they have about issues like this in a constructive way and to get purposeful feedback and not to be insulted by people who are looking to take out their anger against total strangers.

In both my experiences I had really positive people around me who in part saw our goal as showing people of other nations that Americans are not the gun-toting, war-mongering supremecists that they may believe us to be. This is not an easy obstable to overcome particularly when one has negative jerks around you telling them that they deserve it because they went through it once upon a time. What kind of help is that?

To the OP - it's a really unfortunate situation when things like that happen. But I am sure you know that societal changes don't happen when a foreigner comes in and tells people how they should behave. But eventually that person (maybe in his lifetime, maybe a person like him in the future) will have to change. In every place around the world there are the people who want to stop things from changing and hold onto their views. These people will loose this battle in the end. We are planet of people who are converging onto eachothers countries and cultures. By being in Korea and trying to be the best person that you are, as much as you can, despite situations like this and showing people that foreigners are not people to hate but rather embrace then you are already doing all that you can.

[rawiri]

[quote="Us in DC"]Rawiri - Another useless, vindictive post that says nothing about the issue and just proves my point that you have nothing to contribute to the conversation. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe your negative experiences are a result of your crappy personality and not your race.
.[/quote]



What the hell do you know about my personality?....what the hell do you know about my race...what the hell do you know about my experiences with racism?...where the hell do you get off writing something like that....i have no problems with most posters on daves...but you have pissed me off...i say it's good for whiteys to come over here and experience a bit of racism...maybe it will open your mind a bit...see how it is with the shoe
on the other foot...i'm not saying your all racists back home...obviously...but i will say that if you can get a bit of a feeling of what it's like to be a minority and to experience what go's along with it...then good.

Unless you actually go out and look for it the chances of anything confrontational (physically) are next to nil....sure you will get stares from ajosshi's....maybe you'll get denied by some of the juicy miari girls....examples like being denied membership to a gym would be very very small indeed...koreans will still hate you...but they will take your money with a big beaming smile on their faces.

My point is that if being denied membership to a gym is the most racist thing that has happened to you then you should probably count yourself lucky.


and please point out to the rest of us all of my other "useless and vindictive posts"....cut and paste them...show us all just how useless and vindictive i am.

[rawiri]

[quote="Us in DC"]
I have spent time in a number of places where people have pretty extreme views about Americans and have had a lot of luck working with people. Namely Vietnam and Russia. Some people treated me horribly. Some people were great. That's how these things go.

.[/quote]


Thats my point exactly...some people will treat you horribly over here for no more rerason than you are a yank...thats how these things go....can you handle it?....how will you deal with it?...some people will come onto a message board and cry about it...others will think...what the *beep*?...if that gym doesn't want my cash then *beep* them.

[rawiri]

[quote="Us in DC"]
This board is here for people to deal with the feelings they have about issues like this in a constructive way and to get purposeful feedback and not to be insulted by people who are looking to take out their anger against total strangers.


quote]


No it's not....this board isn't here to be dictated to by the likes of you...i have the right to say whatever the hell i want so long as it doesn't offend any of the moderators...i have no anger towards the op at all...as for us in dc...thats a different story...im not going to sympathise with the guy...get over it and go to another gym...problem solved...by the way...koreans hate round eyes...especially yanks.

[rawiri]

[quote="Us in DC"]

To the OP - it's a really unfortunate situation when things like that happen. But I am sure you know that societal changes don't happen when a foreigner comes in and tells people how they should behave. But eventually that person (maybe in his lifetime, maybe a person like him in the future) will have to change. In every place around the world there are the people who want to stop things from changing and hold onto their views. These people will loose this battle in the end. We are planet of people who are converging onto eachothers countries and cultures. By being in Korea and trying to be the best person that you are, as much as you can, despite situations like this and showing people that foreigners are not people to hate but rather embrace then you are already doing all that you can.[/quote]



mate you are so full of poop it isn't funny...try actually experiencing life here before you come across with all of the "you can change them one person at a time" routine...this is korea pal!...they don't want to change!...they have resisited change for 5000 years...but oh no...just wait til good ole us...in dc comes over and starts winning hearts and minds.

You really sound incredibly naieve...just come over and see how things go before shooting your mouth off.

[davyteacher]

Maybe take a trip to the UN Memorial centre in Busan and read the names of soldiers who have died for the Independence of this country. Then ask yourself whether that will justify `racism` in this country. No one should be discriminated against, especially people from countries who have helped this country keep it`s own flag. As a person from Britian I will walk these streets with no****** racism against me, I WILL NOT accept it, even though other people will. I will not be spat in the face and then say `hey, it`s the way they are`. No f***** way, I won`t just accept it. Good luck to that guy who protests, even though it`s a small thing now it`ll get even bigger if you ignore it now and accept it.

Tally ho.

[rapier]

I agree that its good for people to experience racism at some point in life, it awakens their awareness to they way they treat others when they're back home.
I get the feeling a lot of white westerners are naiive, like rawiri says.
Personally me and my family suffered long and hard in Africa after the victory of African nationalism..I don't think many Americans, Australians or New Zealanders will ever have to experience being turfed out the country of their birth and viewed as the enemy by the indigenous peoples. And yet they all claim to be experts on the racism score, while holding onto their priveledged positions in society back home.

[Gideon]

Listen up people... (RAWIRI)... you think that i just got off the boat or something... Hell you make it sound like ooohh this poor guys having a hard time in Korea.. like um some school boy from uni that just landed in this country and am suffereing from racism overload.. booo hoo..

Oh my god.. You think this is the first time i've experienced racism in this country..

When i began this post i was just stating a fact.. Perhaps i was venting a little about my experience in the gym.. My god, relax with the attacks ok

Getting denied membership in a gym is the least of racism i've experienced.

hmmm shall i make a list.??

I've been spit at by one korean in the subway
I've been given countless dirty looks
I've been almost hit by a car a few times...
I've had old school koreans look at me and say something derogatory, and based on their facial expression albeit it wasn't a nice thing they said
I've been turned down to a few clubs
and the list can go on...

All of the above are far more racist than my original post.

Oh by the way... rawiri whats with the hostility.. RELAX!

[rawiri]

[quote="Us in DC"]Rawiri - Another useless, vindictive post that says nothing about the issue and just proves my point that you have nothing to contribute to the conversation. Has it ever occurred to you that maybe your negative experiences are a result of your crappy personality and not your race.

.[/quote]




Thats whats with the hostility man...nothing against you...initially all i said was that you just have to suck those kind of experiences in...learn from them...go to another gym...anyways best of luck to you gideon...you state other examples of racism that you have encounterd in this country....does it bother you that much?....if you are any reasonable sort of a person it wouldn't because you would have enough of a sense of logic to realise that this is korea...it is their country...they will treat you how they see fit...fair enough...i know back home there is a fair amount of racism toward asians...thats how some members of my country (not all but enough to make the headlines every now and then) see fit to treat asians.

Koreans aren't going to change for a long long time...why get into a hissy fit about it?....i get stares everyday...i got the crap kicked out of me on saturday morning after being in a soju induced semicomatosed state and having some posturing ajosshi's smart mouthing me...i just lost it and said "come on then...lets fight"...which in my state was a terrible idea as they kicked the crap out of me...still usually i can blow off anything i perceive as racism....aint no korean ever called me a n igger.

[rawiri]

[quote="davyteacher"]Maybe take a trip to the UN Memorial centre in Busan and read the names of soldiers who have died for the Independence of this country. Then ask yourself whether that will justify `racism` in this country. No one should be discriminated against, especially people from countries who have helped this country keep it`s own flag. As a person from Britian I will walk these streets with no****** racism against me, I WILL NOT accept it, even though other people will. I will not be spat in the face and then say `hey, it`s the way they are`. No f***** way, I won`t just accept it. Good luck to that guy who protests, even though it`s a small thing now it`ll get even bigger if you ignore it now and accept it.

Tally ho.[/quote]



Dude,
I visited the war memorial museum in seoul just out of itaewon (well worth the visit!)...there were kiwis that died over here for the same reason as the brits!....then again many of my ancestors died at the hands of the brits during the colonisation of my country...i don't feel any great need to go home and try to change the belief systems of the many racists back in my country...after a while you learn to live with it...blow it off...water off a ducks back and all that...what doesn't kill you will only make you stronger.

Who cares what koreans think...if your only here for a year or two, don't worry about it!...just laugh at how juvenille and rediculos it is...blow it off...some people on this thread remind me of me and some of my other native buddys back home when we would get all riled up at the local skinheads in town on a friday night or racist teachers at school...FUTILITY...theres no point in it...racism is inherent in all cultures in the world....just thank god that the gene pool lottery came up trumps for you as a caucasian...finish your tour in korea then head back home and have a good old chuckle with your buddys about the whole experience!

[Homer]

An interesting list Gideon...and sad too but these two elements are ridiculous.

I've been given countless dirty looks
I've been almost hit by a car a few times...


Looks can be interpreted in many ways. Who are you to say they were al motivated by racism?
You have a racism scanner on you?

Perhaps they were staring back at you. Perhaps they were just in a bad mood. Some of them were racist I am sure but if you stop and get frustrated and aggravated by something as vague as a look....you will have a very unhappy life.

The car comment was meant as a joke right? You could not be dumb enough to say that these drivers tried to hit you out of racism...come on now
Traffic is bad here...but are you saying these were homocidal racists bent on hitting you?

To the enraged Brit who will take no crap from Koreans because "we" saved em.

Ahh who is we? Were you there?
Did you serve in Korea?

Also, does participation in a war to help preserve a country mean that this country is forbidden from all negative thoughts about those that helped?

If so....the list of violators goes on....

[chronicpride]

It's amazing how some people here think that Koreans are a grouch-free zone, except when it comes to when they encounter foreigners.

Korea, as with every country, has it's share of scowlers, grouchs, and temperamental wackjobs, who are grouchs to every person in their path. (No, I'm not reducing everyone's issues down to naturally grouchy Koreans. I'm just stating something that often gets overlooked.)

God forbid, should one of those perma-grouchs happen across a self-conscious, hyper-sensitive teacher and then has their body language and facial expressions audited and over-analyzed and gets logged as being yet another racist dirty scowl or muttering directed at a foreigner.

Also, Koreans are taught, from traditional Confucius practices, not to show emotion in their face. That's why you see the perma-frowns in their pictures and people covering their mouths when they laugh. Seeing the perma-frown everywhere will naturally leave a negative subconscious imprint with us. So, I don't blame foreigners who misread their faces. And they stare and gawk at themselves, just as much, as they do us. Start looking for this, you'll see what I mean.

But try, sometimes, just try to realize that the amount of time that you put into thinking about yourself and less on others, well, that's how much we are all thinking about ourselves and less time on you. Humans are, for lack of a better word, selfish and self-centered creatures. That includes english teachers and Koreans. We all know what it's like to stand at an intersection and feel naked. It's because we are obsessed with self. Internally, it's easy for one to think that it's all about themselves. Realistically, it's the opposite.

[Gideon]

Ok the "almost hit by a car" line, was going a bit far.

I suppose racism can be preceived in many different ways. True enough that some people are having a bad day, or just in a bad mood.

Having been here for sometime does make you appreciate life back home in your country thats for sure.

Thats all i gotta say about this topic... um outta here

[matko]

The never ending topic!!!!!!!

Discrimination is everywhere, yeah, I know. Ask my family. Ever been ethnically cleansed?

Never accept discrimination. There are degrees of course. I love this prayer

God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change
the courage to change the things I can
And the wisdom to know the difference.

That's all

[Homer]