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Dating Korean men-part deux
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Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:12 am Post subject:

sistersarah wrote:

i guess i got quite lucky, too. my husband fought his parents for 6 long months to marry me (oldest son).

now things are great. his parents, especially his dad, really like me. at first i thought their refusal to meet me was because they were racists. it was a bad six months. when they finally agreed to meet me, it turns out they're just small town people who never met a foreigner and didn't know what to expect. not racist at all.

i really hate hearing korean men get bashed because i think my husband is the best human being i've ever met, of any race. he's not a *beep* or a mama's boy. he's an independent thinker with all the respect for me in the world, and more.
but he is the only korean man i've ever been with, so i can't add much on korean dating trends. i won't start making broad generalizations, like the OP.

all i can do is wish her better luck next time.

Good luck!

I am happy that so many of you overcame your differences with the in-laws -- at least to a level where your husband was able to marry you.

I have watched enough Korean movies and heard enough stories to know that Korean MIL's can be a real pain in the butt!

Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:17 am Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

rapier wrote:

Derrek wrote:

It feels weird to us, but it is totally normal to bring up questions like, "Would you marry a westerner and would your family approve." very early on in the relationship. That way, you're not wasting your time.

Some things are just too wacky for westerners to get their heads round. A sure fire way to kill any mystery or romance in an early relationship is to start talking sh*t like that.
I'd known this girl platonically for a few months and finally went on a date with her one time. She brought two friends and they discussed things like "Plenty of Koreans are marrying foreigners now, there's no problems with that..and would you be able to give English lessons to my sister on weekends? etc".

Nice girl, but I fled the scene pretty quickly.

The order of steps for romance to proceed in korea is backwards compared to the west.

How old are you, rapier?

I agree with you, talking about marriage in any way, shape, or form is a pretty tough thing to get your arms around if you're a western guy or gal in your 20s. But by mid 30s, it becomes easier to accept. Still weird to us, though. It is even easier to understand when you learn to appreciate the family-oriented "marriage inquiry hell" that a lot of "of age" Koreans have to put up with.

But yeah, it's backwards to us!

Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:36 am Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

coldcrush wrote:

I didn't get much of a "sully the bloodlines" reaction from the inlaws. I got more of a "we don't want you to screw our daughter, ger her pregnant, dump her and then leave the country, ok?". Hell, that's what whiteys say.

Then again my missus is not, as far as I can tell, a Korean man.

Hope this helps.

Derrek wrote:

Corporal, relationships in Korea follow VERY predictable themes, on a large scale. It's difficult to know how everyone will react, but date enough and it doesn't take long to figure out the patterns.

I, for one, wish to hear more about these themes and patterns.

Ok, you win the avatar contest for the week. Cute apes.

I wrote a big post about all of this a few months back. It was all about "being a man" and stuff like that, in order to figure out if the girl was just using you for english practice or not. I talked about things like waiting for the 3rd to 5th date before trying to kiss her, and expecting her to refuse you at least twice, even if she WANTS desperately to kiss you.

Koreans also follow patterns where they talk about marriage MUCH sooner than westerners would. I like to use this predictability to my advantage. It helps me read the girl I'm with and saves me from wasting feelings on someone who never plans to get that involved, but isn't exactly forthcoming about that for fear of losing her English-speaking buddy. By date 2 or 3, I like to casually drop a forienger/Korean dating story into conversation and mention how that person had such troubles getting parental approval for marriage. I find that the girl often volunteers what she thinks her family reaction will be, or she will tell you if you simply ask her "what would your family do if this were your situation." Or she'll put up a massive wall that says, "I have no plans to marry a foreigner."

<--------- Ponders writing a "dating in Korea" book, but doesn't want to be lynched by angry netizens.

rapier

Joined: 16 Feb 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:46 am Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

Derrek wrote:

How old are you, rapier?

Shut it, you cheeky young whippersnapper.

Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:59 am Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

rapier wrote:

Derrek wrote:

How old are you, rapier?

Shut it, you cheeky young whippersnapper.

You mean to tell me you're older than even me?

komtengi

Joined: 30 Sep 2003
Location: Slummin it up in Haebangchon

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 8:48 am Post subject:

Derrek wrote:

I have watched enough Korean movies!

yeah thats where I get all my Korean insight from Rolling Eyes

pegpig

Joined: 10 May 2005

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 2:16 pm Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

Derrek wrote:

Koreans also follow patterns where they talk about marriage MUCH sooner than westerners would.

I polled my students on their proposals in my first year and was shocked at some of the 'within a couple of months' proposals. One guy proposed on their 2nd date Shocked

and she accepted Shocked

. I can't remember if this guy was desperate looking and I don't know if she was either. But, I do remember some love at first sight crap or something like that. They were still happily married when I asked at least.

Wrench

Joined: 07 Apr 2005

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 2:58 pm Post subject:

crazylemongirl wrote:

1. Most white people are mutts of some kind or another.

Nope not I. Sorry I am of one race. White as white can get.

dogbert

Joined: 29 Jan 2003
Location: Killbox 90210

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 3:56 pm Post subject:

sistersarah wrote:

now things are great. his parents, especially his dad, really like me. at first i thought their refusal to meet me was because they were racists. it was a bad six months. when they finally agreed to meet me, it turns out they're just small town people who never met a foreigner and didn't know what to expect. not racist at all.

Do you people ever listen to yourselves?

Would you be so understanding if someone back in Canada (which has GOT to be where you're from) refused to meet a fellow human being for six months simply because s/he was of a different race or nationality and that person "didn't know what to expect"?

Why wouldn't you have more self-respect than that? How can one internalize such hatred for six months?

Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:02 pm Post subject:

komtengi wrote:

Derrek wrote:

I have watched enough Korean movies!

yeah thats where I get all my Korean insight from Rolling Eyes

Really, you can learn a lot from them. Of course, movies can be overdone, but they're a great insight into the culture.

Derrek

Joined: 15 Jan 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 4:08 pm Post subject: Re: Dating Korean men-part deux

pegpig wrote:

Derrek wrote:

Koreans also follow patterns where they talk about marriage MUCH sooner than westerners would.

I polled my students on their proposals in my first year and was shocked at some of the 'within a couple of months' proposals. One guy proposed on their 2nd date Shocked

and she accepted Shocked

I heard it's quite common to have a marriage discussion within 3 to 5 dates. In fact, it's almost expected in the regular "pattern" of Korean dating. It helps to verify the others intentions.

Not proposal, just discussion.

For others, hey, you've got to realize that there are a TON of korean men and women who are mid-20s and HAVE HAD MAYBE ONE significant other in their lives!

Keep in mind, these are the types who went to an all-girls' middle school, all-girls' hs, all-womens' University, or studied in a female-dominated area of study at a co-ed university. They studied too much to date, and still live with the parents. One of the guys was freaking out on his first day at work, and seriously asked me all kinds of questions like, "what's it like to be around girls? What do they act like?" This guy has never had a date with a Korean girl in his life, and never attended a co-ed school after grade school. He did admit to having a few short dates with a filipina once when he was studying overseas. But that's IT. And the guy is 26.

Also, the guys have to go to military, so the one relationship they had probably ended right before that.

This is EXACTLY the situation that 3 of my new recent-graduate co-workers went through (2 of them male, one is female). None of them has had a date all year! The female is darned hot, is seeking marriage, and said her last BF dumped her after 3 months because she wanted to marry and he didn't!

Couple this fact with the Korean "push for marriage" and you've got a lot of middle 20-something marriage-minded Koreans. By age 30, they become desperate!

sistersarah

Joined: 03 Jan 2004
Location: hiding out

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 5:30 pm Post subject:

Quote:

Would you be so understanding if someone back in Canada (which has GOT to be where you're from) refused to meet a fellow human being for six months simply because s/he was of a different race or nationality and that person "didn't know what to expect"?

Why wouldn't you have more self-respect than that? How can one internalize such hatred for six months?

to answer your question, no, i probably wouldn't be so understanding, true. but i tried to keep in mind the society i'm living in and where his parents were coming from (hard, but i tried). yeah, i'm from canada, and i'm not living in canada right now.

i have plenty of self-respect. as i said, it was a tough six months, but i got through it because of how much i love my husband. at that point we had already decided we would move back to canada eventually, so i thought if the in-laws don't accept me, at least i don't have to see them too often.....BUT...funny how things work out. they ended up really liking me and a week after meeting me urged him to marry me as soon as possible. they are very kind people.

somehow i don't think a western guy marrying a korean woman in the same situation would have got the same response of "hey man, have some self-respect!"

Quote:

I do know that there are many other women who were not able to marry their Korean bfs because of their position in the family or the close-mindedness of the family. It sucks and I think we should count ourselves lucky and sympathise with the OP instead.

although it's not too common yet for foreign women to marry korean men, i have met more than a few such couples. i feel bad the OP went through such a traumatic break-up, but c'mon, she dated one korean guy and then dismissed the entire race!

rapier

Joined: 16 Feb 2003

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 7:59 pm Post subject:

Derek- 32. You? My general opinion of dating Koreans is that its so fraught with cultural miscommunications and difficulties that you end up doing it just out of boredom. Any genuine person out here will ultimately be turned into a hard-edged player after spending enough time with these spoiled princesses after a while. Unless you're prepared to learn their language fluently..spend a lot of time figuring out their expectations and how they think, and put a lot of work into your game, its simpler just to get with other westerners. Or dare I say...any other nationality at all. I haven't seen a single guy married to a Korean who was happy and relaxed.

Gopher

Joined: 04 Jun 2005

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:21 pm Post subject:

Derrek wrote:

komtengi wrote:

Derrek wrote:

I have watched enough Korean movies!

yeah thats where I get all my Korean insight from Rolling Eyes

Really, you can learn a lot from them. Of course, movies can be overdone, but they're a great insight into the culture.

Agreed. Movies and novels provide excellent anthropological insights. Of course, poetry and humor are even better. In any case, the eye roll was inappropriate.

Here's a "funny" Chilean joke about the Chilean economy that starts to get into the depths of their yanquiphobia:

"They say that if you want to have a strong economy, first you should be conquered by the United States. Look at Japan and Germany. So if Chileans want a better economy, they should just wait to be conquered by the norteamericanos. But oh yeah, [here's the punchline], that wouldn't work because the Americans could never conquer us."

Told to me by a retired Air Force officer who also emphatically argued that Hitler was humaniy's last, great hope...

I'd love to see some Korean political jokes translated into English. The few I've seen are unintelligible because they were badly translated.

Last edited by Gopher on Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

seoulunitarian

Joined: 06 Jul 2004

Posted: Wed Jul 20, 2005 9:31 pm Post subject:

dogbert wrote:

sistersarah wrote:

I don't think it's a matter of self-respect for those of us with Korean partners. It's a matter of falling in love with someone from a different (perhaps racist) culture. We really love our Korean partners, and are willing to sacrifice a lot that we would not sacrifice in the West. On the whole, we are very self-respectful, and it hurts a great deal to have to deal with some of the cultural factors of being in a bi-racial relationship. But sometimes, we sacrifice our comfort for the comfort of those we love.

Peace,
Daniel

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